Somalia Pirates kill 4 Americans

[Janet Harrington]

Okay. Here is a link to Wikipedia about governing international waters. Very informative.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_waters

Who governs international waters?  According to Wikipedia, Ships sailing the high seas are generally under the jurisdiction of the flag state;[2] (if there is one) however, when a ship is involved in certain criminal acts, such as piracy,[3] any nation can exercise jurisdiction under the doctrine of universal jurisdiction.

So what is Universal Jurisdiction?  According to Wikipedia, Universal jurisdiction or universality principle is a principle in public international law (as opposed to private international law) whereby states claim criminal jurisdiction over persons whose alleged crimes were committed outside the boundaries of the prosecuting state, regardless of nationality, country of residence, or any other relation with the prosecuting country. The state backs its claim on the grounds that the crime committed is considered a crime against all, which any state is authorized to punish, as it is too serious to tolerate jurisdictional arbitrage.

What is Jurisdictional arbitrage?  According to Wikipedia, Jurisdictional arbitrage is the practice of taking advantage of the discrepancies between competing legal jurisdictions. It takes its name from arbitrage, the practice in finance of purchasing a good at a lower price in one market and selling it at a higher price in another. Just as in financial arbitrage, the attractiveness of jurisdiction arbitrage depends largely on its transaction costs — in this case the costs of switching legal service providers from one government to another.[

Jurisdictional arbitrage is a popular second-best strategy amongst anarchists who believe that it will allow them to avoid state control and persecution.[1]

So, the United States is within its rights to prosecute these pirates to the fullest extent of the law. However; does that stop the piracy? No. How do we do that? I still say, steal a Russian sub and a Chinese sub, blow them out of that international water, and blame it on the Communists.

[Janet Harrington]

Clean up their mess??...Yeah, we were real successful with that endeavor in Mogadishu.

Varmit, Not being a history buff, I really didn't know what your comment here meant. I didn't even know what Mogdishu was. Here is the link, (for those forum members who might be a ignorant as I), to explain the Battle of Mogdishu, also referred to as Battle of the Black Sea and Black Hawk Down (in popular culture.)  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mogadishu_(1993)

I like reading some of these posts, but find that at my age I am pretty ignorant as to what world history is all about.

[Roma Jean Turner]

I think that as a great idea Janet.  Why people decide to put themselves in such potentially dangerous situations without a means to protect themselves is just beyond me.  Of course others are expected to come to the rescue.

[Varmit]

Varmit, I'm not sure that anyone said anything about going onto "their" land and taking care of the problem. I believe the consesus is to just blow them out of the international water, so to speak.
Do you honestly think that by taking hostages of people and ships and asking for ransoms in international waters is the Somalians way of protecting "their" waters and land from toxic dumping and illegal fishing.
These pirates do not answer to any government because Somalia does not have a government. These pirates are just out and out criminals looking to make a buck, either for themselves or whoever they work for. They are not defending anything.

Janet, my comments about folks going into somalia were in response to the article you posted (reply #13). 
As for why the pirates are doing what they're doing...yes I do believe that if it weren't for the illegal activites of other nations it wouldn't be a problem.  I think that this is the "pirates" way of saying "stay out of our waters or this is what will happen".  Are they out and out criminals looking to make a buck...not anymore than the corporations and their parent countries involved in plundering the natural resources of somalia.  But you won't hear anything about that because the same countries that are trying to stop the pirates are the same ones involved in the illegal activities.  They don't give a damn about the hostages. 
There wouldn't be so many pirates if the people of somalia that used to make a living fishing could still do so.

[Warph]

"I nearly become a Somali pirate": Dji

http://www.somalilandtoday.net/?p=395

[Janet Harrington]

What a sad country Somalia is. Without an active government, I don't see how it is going to get any better.

[srkruzich]

Clean up their mess??...Yeah, we were real successful with that endeavor in Mogadishu.

Just so that you know, we weren't in there to clean up any mess, we were there to secure the food that was being brought into the country.  We landed a MEU in there and secured mogadishu and effected a environment where the factions came to the table except 1.  Then clinton took office and the dumbass sent in a ill equipped strike squad to capture or kill the leader of that one faction and instead it killed bout 60 women and children in the house they attacked.  One of my friends was there evacuating embassy and other folks from there, got left to survive the night.  He did survive but at a major cost of over half his team and personal injury that terminated his military career.   

We were successful in that we did capture targets we went in after, and we did bring the country to the bargaining table to stop the starvation under HW Bush, but when billy boy there got his day in the white house he did it without superior firepower and fubar'd the mission.

[srkruzich]

There wouldn't be so many pirates if the people of somalia that used to make a living fishing could still do so.

Oh come on.  THats a bunch of crap.  THe reason there are so many pirates is that criminals run the country.  No rule of law just gives people the ability to rape pillage and plunder which is in their nature to begin with.  The honest folks are just weak to them when the only rule to follow is the strongest and best armed will surivive.

[srkruzich]

What a sad country Somalia is. Without an active government, I don't see how it is going to get any better.

At this point in time it will take a active government based on the rule of law, and arming the honest citizens.  It will be a blood bath for a while but rest assured that the citizens that want their countyr back would succeed if they had leadership and support.

[Patriot]

When you hear someone touting 'absolute, unbridled individual freedom', 'screw the rule of law' and, 'I am a law unto myself', remember that Somalia is the likely outcome.  Dominance of the most vicious & violent... anarchy & collapse of order.  Every man, woman & child for themselves.  The foundational beliefs of a society and the adherence to those beliefs, lead to such things.... not the actions of a bunch of corporate capitalists.