Building doesn't collapse

[Varmit]

Teresa and Sailmexico execellent posts!

The air that pushed the huge cloud of dust down the street was from the air trapped inside the building that was released as it fell.

Wait a minute, I thought that windows were blown out so how could air be trapped inside?  Also, where did the dust come from? 

[Varmit]

Oh, one more thing I'd like you to ponder...just hours after the "attacks" on 9/11 our gov't knew who, how, why, etc. about the attacks...yet just recently WITH enhanched security measures a "misslle like" object was seen off the coast of california, HEADING towards california...yet for some reason they still haven't been able to figure out what the hell it was.

[Sailmexico]

Once again, poor well meaning Diane is in over her head.  No offense darlin' but you can't have it all ways.  

As a sailor I know something about the forces of air.  Consider the Mirabella V.  At 246′ in length, and a displacement of 816 tons, she is the largest single masted sailing yacht ever built.  What does the Mirabella V http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirabella_V have in common with the Twin Towers?  Her sail area is equal to the square footage of each of the tower's 110 floors – 40,000 square feet.  That's a lot of air resistance.

So, once again we have resistance that would have slowed the collapse of the buildings IF collapse is what they did.  How much resistance was there in actuality?  None.  The roof hit the ground in 10.5 seconds.  (In the instance of WTC7's 47 stories it was 6.5 seconds)

Consider one more thing.  Each floor did contain air and, with the exception of the few floors where the airplanes hit, the windows were sealed.  What does a stunt man use to break his fall from a great height?  An airbag.  In a collapse, the air in each floor would have been sealed until the windows blew out, and just like giant airbags they would have contributed something to the absorption of energy.  And any contribution to the absorption of the gravitational energy would have slowed the collapse.  That is... if it were a collapse.

Here is a link to the best analysis I've seen of a gravitational collapse, and why that's not what we saw on 9/11

[Varmit]

Why would he lie??

[kshillbillys]

Please note that I have went through several videos. There is a huge majority of conspiracy f*cking nuts on the internet that believe that we are being visited by gray aliens, blue aliens, sasquatch is an alien and that Elvis just went back to his home planet. One conspiracy was that a UFO crashed into the WTC. These individuals piss me off. But like the majority of them they are just like something you can scrape off the bottom of your shoe with a stick. Within minutes of the WTC being attacked they had a list of the terrorists? Yes, they have a list of everyone getting on the damn plane. And I suppose the Japanese didn't bomb Pearl Harbor. But I can guarantee that within seconds they knew it was the Japs bombing Pearl Harbor. Note the video where everyone is running down the street screaming as the south tower collapsed. All these people in New York must be idiots because what they saw were planes hitting the damn buildings. Please note the very last comment from Usama bin Laden on here, you may have to watch it a couple of times. Read what's under his beard then go back and read the little red boxes. For every stupid clip you put up I can put one up too. Have a bowl of fruit loops and drink your koolaid.---Robert

[kshillbillys]

Please note that George Bush is not in this picture and the absense of the democratic congress, but I am with the conspiracy theorists on this: most of the men DO look like sasquatch. I wonder why the Muslim world would be rejoicing us blowing up our own Towers so we could go to war to KICK THEIR ASS? ---Robert

[Teresa]

So Robert.. How do you really feel?  LOL Come on.. Chill a little bit here.
I understand your frustration.. I feel the same way only this time I am on the opposite side of the table my friend.

and WHY does it make you so mad?
Other than just refusing to acknowledge the "facts".. what don't you see here?

Do you REALLY think I want my countries government to be involved in things of this nature?
I mean. come on!.. Do you think I want to believe it?  I LIKE George Bush.. I STILL like George Bush.. It is so much bigger than George Bush that it isn't even funny. Hell ~George's strings were pulled just like every body elses.. He couldn't have stopped it if he had of tried.. Probably ended up like the Kennedy's if he had of.. and he knew it.

I don't want to believe it either.. but how can you actually go through everything.. and deny what is right in front of your eyes?
You aren't stupid.. and you aren't blind...and you are one hell of an American.. so what are you not seeing?
Why does it make you so mad at people like me..who think that this is just a small small section of what our dear Government has been involved in since God only knows...

You think the Kennedy's were killed by some no count off the street citizen? You think an Illegal like Obama is here without full corruption behind it? He's a sock puppet! Just like they all are..
You talk of one world government and socialization and the government behind Fema camps..screwing with us growing our food.. messing with our water.. taking away our guns.. but yet.......
you refuse to look at the facts of this.. why?
Unless Americans start opening up their eyes ..so we can band together... it is only going to allow them to continue to do whatever they want in the most horrendous way that they want. The people behind running this huge show are soul-less...so you can not even consider that they would blink at killing thousands to complete their "mission"..
I'm just talking out loud here..trying to understand..

I believe what I believe and I follow no one on anything when it comes to my own beliefs..I am not called the Research Queen for nothing..  
So I'm not on a mad rant .. I'm not going to get into a yelling and screaming match with you either.. You 're a friend..I know what you stand for. That is why I am so amazed by your reaction to this.
I am seriously confused about how you think the government is total worthless pig shit until it comes to this.. and now they are the victims and innocent of all involvement?
Really??

So... a simple question my friend... How DID the 3rd building come down..?
and if a plane hit the pentagon....why wasn't any of the grounds messed up or anything on the outside damaged?

I'm listening.

[kshillbillys]

Structural design
The structural engineering firm Worthington, Skilling, Helle & Jackson worked to implement Yamasaki's design, developing the tube-frame structural system used in the twin towers. The Port Authority's Engineering Department served as foundation engineers, Joseph R. Loring & Associates as electrical engineers, and Jaros, Baum & Bolles as mechanical engineers. Tishman Realty & Construction Company was the general contractor on the World Trade Center project. Guy F. Tozzoli, director of the World Trade Department at the Port Authority, and Rino M. Monti, the Port Authority's Chief Engineer, oversaw the project.[26] As an interstate agency, the Port Authority was not subject to local laws and regulations of the City of New York including building codes. Nonetheless, the structural engineers of the World Trade Center ended up following draft versions of the new 1968 building codes.[27] The tube-frame design, earlier introduced by Fazlur Khan, was a new approach which allowed open floor plans rather than columns distributed throughout the interior to support building loads as had traditionally been done. The World Trade Center towers utilized high-strength, load-bearing perimeter steel columns called Vierendeel trusses that were spaced closely together to form a strong, rigid wall structure, supporting virtually all lateral loads such as wind loads, and sharing the gravity load with the core columns. The perimeter structure containing 59 columns per side was constructed with extensive use of prefabricated modular pieces each consisting of three columns, three stories tall, connected by spandrel plates.[27] The spandrel plates were welded to the columns to create the modular pieces off-site at the fabrication shop.[28] Adjacent modules were bolted together with the splices occurring at mid-span of the columns and spandrels. The spandrel plates were located at each floor, transmitting shear stress between columns, allowing them to work together in resisting lateral loads. The joints between modules were staggered vertically so the column splices between adjacent modules were not at the same floor.[27]

The core of the towers housed the elevator and utility shafts, restrooms, three stairwells, and other support spaces. The core –a combined steel and concrete structure–[29][30] of each tower was a rectangular area 87 by 135 feet (27 by 41 m) and contained 47 steel columns running from the bedrock to the top of the tower. The large, column-free space between the perimeter and core was bridged by prefabricated floor trusses. The floors supported their own weight as well as live loads, providing lateral stability to the exterior walls and distributing wind loads among the exterior walls.[31] The floors consisted of 4 inches (10 cm) thick lightweight concrete slabs laid on a fluted steel deck. A grid of lightweight bridging trusses and main trusses supported the floors. The trusses connected to the perimeter at alternate columns and were on 6 foot 8 inch (2.03 m) centers. The top chords of the trusses were bolted to seats welded to the spandrels on the exterior side and a channel welded to the core columns on the interior side. The floors were connected to the perimeter spandrel plates with viscoelastic dampers which helped reduce the amount of sway felt by building occupants. The trusses supported a 4-inch (100 mm) thick lightweight concrete floor slab with shear connections for composite action.[32]

Hat trusses (or "outrigger truss") located from the 107th floor to the top of the buildings were designed to support a tall communication antenna on top of each building.[32] Only 1 WTC (north tower) actually had an antenna fitted; it was added in 1978.[33] The truss system consisted of six trusses along the long axis of the core and four along the short axis. This truss system allowed some load redistribution between the perimeter and core columns and supported the transmission tower.[32]

The tube frame design using steel core and perimeter columns protected with sprayed-on fire resistant material created a relatively lightweight structure that would sway more in response to the wind compared to traditional structures such as the Empire State Building that have thick, heavy masonry for fireproofing of steel structural elements.[34] During the design process, wind tunnel tests were done to establish design wind pressures that the World Trade Center towers could be subjected to and structural response to those forces.[35] Experiments also were done to evaluate how much sway occupants could comfortably tolerate, however, many subjects experienced dizziness and other ill effects.[36] One of the chief engineers Leslie Robertson worked with Canadian engineer Alan G. Davenport to develop viscoelastic dampers to absorb some of the sway. These viscoelastic dampers, used throughout the structures at the joints between floor trusses and perimeter columns along with some other structural modifications, reduced the building sway to an acceptable level.[37]

Construction

World Trade Center under construction in 1971In March 1965, the Port Authority began acquiring property at the World Trade Center site.[38] Demolition work began on March 21, 1966, to clear thirteen square blocks of low rise buildings in Radio Row for construction of the World Trade Center.[39] Groundbreaking for the construction of the World Trade Center took place on August 5, 1966.[40]

The site of the World Trade Center was located on landfill with the bedrock located 65 feet (20 m) below.[41] To construct the World Trade Center, it was necessary to build a "bathtub" with a slurry wall around the West Street side of the site, to keep water from the Hudson River out.[42] The slurry method selected by Port Authority's chief engineer, John M. Kyle, Jr., involved digging a trench, and as excavation proceeded, filling the space with a "slurry" mixture composed of bentonite and water, which plugged holes and kept groundwater out. When the trench was dug out, a steel cage was inserted and concrete was poured in, forcing the "slurry" out. It took fourteen months for the slurry wall to be completed; it was necessary before excavation of material from the interior of the site could begin.[43] The 1.2 million cubic yards (917,000 m3) of material excavated were used to expand the Manhattan shoreline across West Street to form Battery Park City (along with other fill and dredge material).[44][45]

In January 1967, the Port Authority awarded $74 million in contracts to various steel suppliers, and Karl Koch was hired to erect the steel.[46] Tishman Realty & Construction was hired in February 1967 to oversee construction of the project.[47] Construction work began on the North Tower in August 1968; construction on the South Tower was underway by January 1969.[48] The original Hudson Tubes, carrying PATH trains into Hudson Terminal, remained in service as elevated tunnels during the construction process until 1971 when a new PATH station opened.[49]

The topping out ceremony of 1 WTC (North Tower) took place on December 23, 1970, while 2 WTC's ceremony (South Tower) occurred later on July 19, 1971.[48] The first tenants moved into the North Tower in December 1970; the South Tower accepted tenants in January 1972.[50] When the World Trade Center twin towers were completed, the total costs to the Port Authority had reached $900 million.[51] The ribbon cutting ceremony was on April 4, 1973.[52

Destruction
Main articles: September 11 attacks, American Airlines Flight 11, United Airlines Flight 175, and Collapse of the World Trade Center

The World Trade Center on fire with the Statue of Liberty in the foregroundOn September 11, 2001, terrorists hijacked American Airlines Flight 11 and crashed it into the northern facade of the north tower at 08:46, impacting between the 93rd and 99th floors. Seventeen minutes later, a second team of terrorists crashed the similarly hijacked United Airlines Flight 175 into the south tower, impacting between the 77th and 85th floors.[113] The damage caused to the north tower by Flight 11 destroyed any means of escape from above the impact zone, trapping 1,344 people.[114] Flight 175 had a much more off-centered impact compared to Flight 11, and a single stairwell was left intact; however, only a few people managed to successfully pass through it before the tower collapsed. Although the south tower's floors of impact were lower, a smaller number, less than 700, were killed instantly or trapped.[115] At 9:59 a.m., the south tower collapsed due to fire, which caused steel structural elements, already weakened from the plane impact, to fail. The north tower collapsed at 10:28 a.m., after burning for approximately 102 minutes.[116]

At 5:20 p.m.[117] on September 11, 2001, 7WTC started to collapse with the crumble of the east penthouse, and it collapsed completely at 5:21 p.m.[117] due to uncontrolled fires causing structural failure.[118] 3WTC, a Marriott hotel, was destroyed during the collapse of the two towers. The three remaining buildings in the WTC plaza sustained heavy damage from debris and were ultimately demolished.[119] The Deutsche Bank Building across Liberty Street from the World Trade Center complex was later condemned due to the uninhabitable toxic conditions inside; it is undergoing deconstruction.[120][121] The Borough of Manhattan Community College's Fiterman Hall at 30 West Broadway was also condemned due to extensive damage in the attacks and is slated for deconstruction.[122]

The concrete flooring falling from 110 stories, each floor being crushed by the floor above it, I would surely think that would stir up one hell of a dust cloud as it fell. A note from a previous video clip, the first tower to fall did not fall straight down as people would like to think, with a lot of the top floors striking tower 7, the Post Office and Verizon buildings; roughly 8 hours later was the collapse of tower 7. The summer of 2003 back when I was still driving a truck, I had went to Manhattan Island in a smaller rented truck to deliver some cabinets. We took a cab down to the WTC site, but all I saw was a hole in the ground with a hell of a lot of construction going on. Across the way was a bunch of pictures, artifacts, pictures of buildings and people. As with the day the towers fell, it was a very moving day. It brought out a lot of emotions and sorry, I just don't see the conspiracy.--Robert

[Teresa]

Well.. it looks like we will have to shake hands and agree to disagree on this one..
Unless of course.. you want to duel it out..

10 paces..back to back... on the 10th , turn and fire?
your choice of firearm....
But.....................
(Can we wait until after the holidays though? I have a lot of cooking to do, and I can't be taking time off to sharpen my shootin' skills right now. 

[Varmit]

When did I ever say that planes didn't hit the towers?  I never said that, I said that the damage caused by the planes and fire wouldn't have been enough to collapse the buildings (wtc).  I do not believe a plane hit the pentagon or that one went down in Penn. as there is no plane debris at either site, no skid mark at either site.  I do not believe that the jet fuel fire burned hot enough to vaporize the wreckage, as this result would have been evident at many other plane crashes prior to 9/11, yet is not. As to your videos...

1)  Video #1 shows most of the fuel being consumed during the intial impact and therefore was not used to fuel the fire afterwards, that according to "officals" was what melted the steel beams causing collapse.

2) Video #2 implies that we were attacked for our support of Isreal.  It offers no proof of any kind other than to point towards american foregin policies. 

But like Teresa said, I just don't think that we are going to see eye to eye on this.  Thats okay, you're are still a hellva guy and on a very short list of people I would call my friend.  But before I close heres some more food for thought (calm down Robert, it isn't actually FOOD, thats just an expression )...

These video clips are taken from video titled 911 Loose Change.