West Elk voters turn down bond issue, 622-375
Voters in West Elk USD 282 soundly turned down the $5.55 million bond proposal to consolidate all school facilities onto one campus in balloting on Tuesday.
The final result: Yes 375 votes, and No 622 votes.
This will bring to a halt plans to construct a new elementary school in Howard and the eventual closure of grade schools in Severy and Moline.
The USD 282 Board of Education will hold its regular monthly meeting on Monday night, Nov. 9, at 7:30 p.m. Board members must now decide which direction to take as the school continues with its three-campus school district.
Let the screaming begin!
<passing out cheese to go with the whine>
Is it any wonder with everyone getting their tax bill today!?
Good luck in maintaining the district in the future with that decision. Can't see it being feasible for too many more years.
What isn't feasible is for the county to keep raising taxes and have nothing to show for it, and then to ask for even more.
Unrelated to this thread, but I believe that the tax increase is partly due to the removal of the tax assessment of the equipment that constructed the new HWY 99.
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 08:59:56 PM
Unrelated to this thread, but I believe that the tax increase is partly due to the removal of the tax assessment of the equipment that constructed the new HWY 99.
Doesn't that equipment belong to the company that constructed the highway?
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 08:59:56 PM
Unrelated to this thread, but I believe that the tax increase is partly due to the removal of the tax assessment of the equipment that constructed the new HWY 99.
Huh? There is no way that the tax on construction equipment would equal the tax increases that everyone is getting. Not even close!
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 09:02:14 PM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 08:59:56 PM
Unrelated to this thread, but I believe that the tax increase is partly due to the removal of the tax assessment of the equipment that constructed the new HWY 99.
Doesn't that equipment belong to the company that constructed the highway?
Yes it does, but it is taxed in the county that it was located in.
Well my taxes went up too...Guess that is the price we pay for living in a free county.
Quote from: peanut on November 03, 2009, 09:17:08 PM
Well my taxes went up too...Guess that is the price we pay for living in a free county.
I don't know about free country, but that's the price you pay for living in Elk County. Elk county has some of the highest taxes in the state of Kansas.
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 09:24:43 PM
Quote from: peanut on November 03, 2009, 09:17:08 PM
Well my taxes went up too...Guess that is the price we pay for living in a free county.
I don't know about free country, but that's the price you pay for living in Elk County. Elk county has some of the highest taxes in the state of Kansas.
And No Water!
Back to the main topic of this thread.....
Now that the 5.5 million dollar 'Plan A' has failed, does anybody want to prognosticate what the unpublished, undiscussed 'Plan B' will entail and how much it will cost?
The USD 282 Board of Education will hold its regular monthly meeting on Monday night, Nov. 9, at 7:30 p.m. Board members must now decide which direction to take as the school continues with its three-campus school district.
The board meetings are open to the public, and I believe this has been discussed at previous meetings...
They'll now be forced to make a decision regarding the future of the Severy and Moline grade schools.
Quote from: srkruzich on November 03, 2009, 09:26:05 PM
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 09:24:43 PM
Quote from: peanut on November 03, 2009, 09:17:08 PM
Well my taxes went up too...Guess that is the price we pay for living in a free county.
I don't know about free country, but that's the price you pay for living in Elk County. Elk county has some of the highest taxes in the state of Kansas.
And No Water!
Yeah... all that and two, countem...
TWO paved roads in the entire county (exclusive of towns, of course). Well, there is that matter of the number of govt employees in the county. At last count it was something like 10% of the county population.
Quote from: Patriot on November 03, 2009, 09:29:56 PM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 03, 2009, 09:26:05 PM
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 09:24:43 PM
Quote from: peanut on November 03, 2009, 09:17:08 PM
Well my taxes went up too...Guess that is the price we pay for living in a free county.
I don't know about free country, but that's the price you pay for living in Elk County. Elk county has some of the highest taxes in the state of Kansas.
And No Water!
Yeah... all that and two, countem... TWO paved roads in the entire county (exclusive of towns, of course). Well, there is that matter of the number of govt employees in the county. At last count it was something like 10% of the county population.
GASP You mean the county spent money on blacktop????? OMG
Quote from: srkruzich on November 03, 2009, 09:35:21 PM
Quote from: Patriot on November 03, 2009, 09:29:56 PM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 03, 2009, 09:26:05 PM
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 09:24:43 PM
Quote from: peanut on November 03, 2009, 09:17:08 PM
Well my taxes went up too...Guess that is the price we pay for living in a free county.
I don't know about free country, but that's the price you pay for living in Elk County. Elk county has some of the highest taxes in the state of Kansas.
And No Water!
Yeah... all that and two, countem... TWO paved roads in the entire county (exclusive of towns, of course). Well, there is that matter of the number of govt employees in the county. At last count it was something like 10% of the county population.
GASP You mean the county spent money on blacktop????? OMG
Well, not exactly. I was referring to the two state highways that pass through here. lol
Excuse me for a sec... I need to go 'Experience the Flint Hills'. The signs said so!
The discussions about the dire financial strains of our school district have been going on for many years now. The public should have shown more interest in this issue before now. These meetings are open and the information is there, come and hear for yourself. So many people want to sit back and complain, but don't take the time to go and hear first hand what the entire situation entails. I have been to many of these meetings and am disheartened by the lack of community presence. Now is the time for all citizens of USD 282 to come out and find a way to ensure that our kids have a positive educational future. Yes, I'm pleading for commuity involvement and support for our school board and the tough decisions they have to make.
Well, not exactly. I was referring to the two state highways that pass through here. lol
Excuse me for a sec... I need to go 'Experience the Flint Hills'. The signs said so!
You know, quite honestly, whoever came up with the idea of the 5.5million dollar bond didn't do their homework. According to the Kansas Dept. of Labor, as of Sept. 2009, there are 1,010 working individuals in Elk county. In order to payback that bond each individual would have to pay roughly $5400. So for a two income family thats $10,800. before interest. Seems a little steep to me. I know that there are maintance and structure fatigue issues with some of our schools, however has anyone asked for donations from the parents that send their kids to these schools? And maybe its just me but I haven't seen to many fundraising activities to help raise money for repairs.
Gina, I would like to attend one of these meetings even though my kids go to school out of district. The problem for me anyway, is the time. If it were held on a friday that would be great as I don't work on fridays.
Pretty sound advice. Those who use the school system pay for it.
The next meeting is Monday NIGHT, Nov. 9th, at 7:30 P.M.. I work everyday too, but have made it a priority to get there and get the information. You can even come in by 8:00 P.M.and be there in time to get info.
This post is meant to be informative, not offensive!
I see a "when" but not a "where"
West Elk District Office, Highway 99, Howard, Kansas
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 09:46:48 PM
You know, quite honestly, whoever came up with the idea of the 5.5million dollar bond didn't do their homework. According to the Kansas Dept. of Labor, as of Sept. 2009, there are 1,010 working individuals in Elk county. In order to payback that bond each individual would have to pay roughly $5400. So for a two income family thats $10,800. before interest. Seems a little steep to me. I know that there are maintance and structure fatigue issues with some of our schools, however has anyone asked for donations from the parents that send their kids to these schools? And maybe its just me but I haven't seen to many fundraising activities to help raise money for repairs.
Are you really serious? You obviously don't understand the process by which bonds are sold and paid back to finance the construction of a school. It has nothing to do with the population of working men and women. Please read back through the "Convince Me" and "School Changes" threads. There is plenty of explanation.
The kids are selling tacos and enchilladas right now. I will suggest to the board that we repair the high school w/ soft taco funds. Give me break!
David
Probably can't fix it with tacos, but to those that the rise in taxes were no big deal, then why don't they take that money that they would have been paying had it passed and pay that money directly to the school district?
I have no problem with a 'civic responsibility' for all citizens to help promote and finance the education of our children, but there are limits to everything. I keep seeing how this school district has been struggling with these issues for years to no avail. That seems to be a case of poor management somewhere along the path. Perhaps these 'hard' decisions should have been made in better times, no?
I also see that this district (the one with a shrinking enrollment) has placed a high enough priority on extra curricular sports activities that they keep the district in leagues that require students be bussed for hours on end to attend games at the far end of the state. I have to wonder if money might be well spent to pay an outside efficiency/management expert to evaluate the entire operation and determine where cost savings could be found, if any.
It's really easy to spend OPM (Other Peoples Money)... it takes a tough makeup to spend it wisely and with frugality.
But, I could be wrong.
No Sir, you give me a break! David. Just where do you think the money is going to come from to pay for that new school? Because it sure as hell isn't just going to appear out of nowhere. Taxes will go up. Working men and women would, you know, the ones who pay taxes, would have to pay for it. But I guess the bond is a moot point, seeing as how it didn't pass.
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 10:00:12 PM
Probably can't fix it with tacos, but to those that the rise in taxes were no big deal, then why don't they take that money that they would have been paying had it passed and pay that money directly to the school district?
good idea.
Probably can't fix it with tacos, but to those that the rise in taxes were no big deal, then why don't they take that money that they would have been paying had it passed and pay that money directly to the school district?
Steve, what is your rant about. You neither live in the school district or Elk county. Get over it!
You know you two....there is this wonderful thing on here called an "ignore list" if you hate each other so much. :P
Naaaa.. I'm not sure it's hate, Sarah.... I think it's called protected speech and political discourse. LOL
With school finance, if we need 1.5 million dollars to do repairs on one of the elementary school, the only way we can get that money is through the Local Option Budget (LOB). -L.Hendricks
Any math teachers out there correct me if I am wrong but...
$1,500,000 / 375 taxpaying "yes" voters = $4000 a piece
Roof is fixed, smiles all around, and is cheaper than the bond. Unless I am totally off.
Heck.. Even I would consider tossing a hundred in that pot, Varmit! (Civic mindedness, ya know!)
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 10:21:31 PM
With school finance, if we need 1.5 million dollars to do repairs on one of the elementary school, the only way we can get that money is through the Local Option Budget (LOB). -L.Hendricks
Any math teachers out there correct me if I am wrong but...
$1,500,000 / 375 taxpaying "yes" voters = $4000 a piece
Roof is fixed, smiles all around, and is cheaper than the bond. Unless I am totally off.
Heck thats cheaper than homeschooling. :)
I don't have much money to throw in but I can swing a hammer and would volunteer to work. Anybody out there know how to fix a freakin roof? Maybe put up some insulation or whatever else needs to be done?
My point is I think that there are alot of resources in the county that have not been checked into as a means of saving on repair costs.
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 10:33:41 PM
I don't have much money to throw in but I can swing a hammer and would volunteer to work. Anybody out there know how to fix a freakin roof? Maybe put up some insulation or whatever else needs to be done?
My point is I think that there are alot of resources in the county that have not been checked into as a means of saving on repair costs.
Outstanding perspective! Self reliance (both on the personal and community levels) need to make a comeback. If I'm not mistaken, that's how the park behind Twilight Manor in Howard got done. And a find product it appears to be!
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 10:33:41 PM
I don't have much money to throw in but I can swing a hammer and would volunteer to work. Anybody out there know how to fix a freakin roof? Maybe put up some insulation or whatever else needs to be done?
My point is I think that there are alot of resources in the county that have not been checked into as a means of saving on repair costs.
I'd put in some volenteer time and I don't even have any kids!
You all are just pathetic. You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. You just get on here and congratulate each other for once again stopping any and all progress towards a solution that has been needed for decades. That's the problem with Elk County, all you regressive, uber-right quasi-anarchist Reationaries.
Did you ever think to go to a school board meeting before the bond election? No!
Did you ever think about going to the courthouse and setting in on a Commissioners meeting to see where the money goes? No!
Have you ever gone to Topeka and set in the balcony and watch the Legislature in action, and then go talk to your representative about where the money goes? No!
Have you ever served as a legistative intern, and watched from the inside what goes into the job of representing anal retentive butt-wipes like you? Again, No!
So yeah for you. You can all gather round the burning cross and sing the praises of Nathan Bedford Forrest, you have once again saved this county and this great nation from the evil of progress!
Goodbye, and Good Riddance.
Thou shalt not take the name of The great Civil War leader, Nathan Bedford Forrest In vain!
F You!
"Goodby, and Good Riddance."? Well, one can hope I suppose.
Did you ever notice when liberals get frustrated they start tossing out invectives like candy? I suppose the left has some 'rules' that preclude such innovative solutions as 'self help' to fix the roof. And just think, they call the right the party of 'No'. ;D
Sheesh!.... Get a room! lol
LOL hey i can't help it if my Good looks and charm works that way!
;D
There is so much wrong with this I don't know where to begin....
First off, you're right. I haven't gone to any meetings. You see, I have this little thing called a Job, and another not so little thing called a family. When I am not working, I am with my family.
Secondly, I would like to point out that Elk County is a small community that doesn't have a lot of money to build a 5.5 million dollar school. Hell, we can barely maintain our road equipment. So what is wrong with asking for a little volunteerism from the community? Afterall, isn't that what it says in your signature line, "Ask not what Elk county can do for you, but what you can do for Elk County."
Oh, and one more thing Flint, would you mind toning down the language, this is a public forum.
I think there would be legal liability concerns if the public were to do some of the labor on the repairs of the roof or any other repairs that are necessary.
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
And then have the final product reviewed/certified by a bonded contractor prior to occupancy.
If they were willing.
Either way the repairs to the building do not address the over staffing for the size of the district that is necessary to run three campuses when only one is necessary. You can repair (and waste money on those repairs) three buildings with cheap or volunteer labor all you want but that will not alleviate the situation whatsoever. What people need to realize to a degree is that we are currently at MAX LOB, which means next year if the population of students declines and thus the budget received by the state declines so must the LOB since the maximum LOB is a percentage of the total funding, thus people will have to be eliminated to meet that reduced budget and that is where the problem will grow large and will result in eliminated programs and a quick reduction in the quality of education provided by USD 282.
At this point, perhaps the school district should just be dissolved and have the students go to the closest open enrollment schools and watch as the remaining families in Elk county disappear.
I am totally floored. I had hoped for a decisive victory for my kids, instead ignorance reared its ugly head. I would say 375-622 is directly proportional to the number of voters with school aged children. How quickly education drops off your radar when your kids are grown. Well now what? The school board decision will no doubt cause a loss in teachers, school dependant jobs, and the loss of capabilities/programs. Either Severy or Moline will lose a school (and niether will do very well without its school) and the county will lose out on education and educated citizens yeah!!! Thats just what W.E. needs. More of the same. I hear all kinds of quality comments from folks like cut athletics and extra-curriculars, thats nice just what a young family wants to hear from the town(s) you live in. I want my kids to have the best not a half a$$&D pseudo-education that requires a stint at a community college to even meet most university admission standards thats rich! So now I have to weigh my kids future against my want to stay in Elk County gee thanks. Dont see many young folks getting an education and coming back to Elk County in fact I dont see many young folks at all our average age is 46 and 52% are over 45! They say these last couple of generations are lazy, lack ambition, lack common sense, and so on.... well look what the older generations just said with their voting. Well have fun a Penny's Pub, get some beer and cigs at P&J's and drink up you say we the 375 ought to pay for our kids educations, school repairs and all, well you 622 ought to be proud and state what you voted out loud so we can all appreciate your ignorance. I saw a quote on Terresa's post some time back that said something like "people thought Americans were stupid so Americans went to the poles and removed all doubt!" Well there ya go history repeats itself! I think the gene pool needs a new filter!!
Some cliches/quotes come to mind that discribe this vote to a T;
"you cant polish a turd;"
"that little white spot on chicken crap is still crap;"
"Some drink from the fountain of knowledge - others just gargle"
If you think education is expensive - try ignorance.- Derek Bok-; >:(
So----- could we safely say that you are bitter? 8)
So now it's just the voters today who are the ignorants who created your dilemma? How about the management (or lack thereof) that failed to see these problems years ago? And what of the lack of economic development in Elk County in the last 10 or 15 years that might have led to an economy that could draw and keep people here? I have to wonder, how many HS graduates in the last 10 years from this school district hare still in Elk County vs how many have left to find the very thing their education was to prepare them for: jobs and careers? I reject the notion that 622 people voted against this measure out of pure ignorance. While it's obvious you have suffered a personal defeat from this vote, labeling those who voted their conscience as ignorant, lacking in ambition, lacking in common sense or as being lazy is a bit of a stretch, imho. Moreover, I resent the inference that they can now just 'hang out at Penny's Pub, buy beer and smokes at PJ's', etc. Maybe, just maybe some, if not many, of those who voted against this bond issue have circumstances about which you have no facts or knowledge. But, I could be wrong. Sorry you felt slighted by the outcome of the democratic process today.
Not bitter just fed up with the head first swan dive 282 just took due to the inferior genetics of the baby boomers or the clan of cave bear whatever you call yourselves these days.;D
Quote from: Hunter75 on November 04, 2009, 12:18:40 AM
Not bitter just fed up with the head first swan dive 282 just took due to the inferior genetics of the baby boomers or the clan of cave bear whatever you call yourselves these days.;D
If you don't like this genetic pool or bear cave, it's still a free country.... Move to a pool in which you are more comfortable.
Yes, because actively encouraging more people, especially those with children, to leave will help the situation.
Just about as much as open attacks on the personal integrity and character of the majority who voted no on this issue.
I bet if it was a vote AARP and a shaw it would have passed. The ambition of this area is as fruitful as the new construction and storefronts in 282
That doesn't quite make sense.
Quote from: Hunter75 on November 04, 2009, 12:28:56 AM
I bet if it was a vote AARP and a shaw it would have passed. The ambition of this area is as fruitful as the new construction and storefronts in 282
I'm not sure what that meant, but I can assure you that I would have nothing to do with anything AARP were promoting. As for the new construction and storefronts in town, I'm not payin for them either.
This all just means more folks going somewhere else to spend time and money. I have been deligent about spending all of our money locally but now why bother Eureka, Winfield, El Dorado here I come. So instead of me buying a house locally I will now look North or West where my kids will be in school. So bulldoze another round of shacks for me!
Hey Hunter75, do your homework. Most HS grads. these days are not university ready and require a community college stint. Either that or they have to take remedial courses. Either way, it has nothing to do with the building that they went to school in. And that is a discussion for another thread. Also, I think the reason why a lot of kids leave Elk County is because there are no jobs here. Theres no industry, and thank God for it. Frankly, I don't want new industry, because with it comes more people, more people means more problems, and more crime.
You mentioned that either Severy or Moline would lose a school...well what do you think would happen if we consilidated everybody?
Varmit, I'd like to address your comment about being unable to attend the school board meetings because you have a job and a family. Of the very few people that do attend these meetings, most do have jobs and families. The meetings are once a month, that is not taking too much time away from your family, and they don't start until 7:30 P.M. which is not normal working hours in Elk County. (unless you work at Toot's, Swinging Bridge, Q-Mart, P&J's, or the nursing home)
Hope to see you there!
I am a vote yes person and very proud of it. But the way that you are handling this thread is way off base. No, no one could afford their taxes to go up. My husband and I bought this place in town close to 5 years ago. Taxes have more than doubled. No new school, less teachers, less extra classes for the kids at the high school. So, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that our school is in need of reconstruction on the budget end of things. But lacking enrollement is the main problem. Plus this situation has been going down hill for awhile now. The school board was trying to make a decision to save "Hurt" to both Severy or Moline. By this I mean, they felt that closing one at a time would cause alot of strain and stress on the communities, Severy and Moline. I have heard, and no I haven't attended the last couple of school board meetings, but that the next plan is to move both the elementaries to Howard anyways. They will bring in portable buildings. I don't know this as fact, just hearsay. So, don't jump on me.
As for the fact that no one wants to move back to Howard after they graduate, that is a line of bull. I know of many people that attended WEST ELK, and live here and raise their families. My husband and I both have, I know that Gina and her husband have. But that is not the point. I feel that you are all celebrating something that was neither a win win situation. No one wants their taxes to go up, but at this point from what you guys are saying, just how I understand you, it doesn't matter to you what type of education our children around here get. They need community college anyways is what one person said. Have you been to college, not to be mean but there is nothing wrong with community college. It's basically just smaller class sizes than big universities.
I am truley afraid to speak my opinion on here for getting called names, but I am an educated lady with a BS in Elementary eduation. Own my own business, plus so does my husband. I want what is best for our children. I am a 4-H leader a girl scout leader, member of the Flinthills Assembly of God Church, and I choose to be active as possible in the community. I feel that some of you sit back and don't appreciate what we, Howard and surrounding coummunities have. I made a choice to live here. If it means bigger taxes because of less people so be it. I get a second job. Yes, I am young and can do this as to some of you are older citizens living on disablities or SS checks, understand that. But what I am trying to say is we need a school around here. And we as Elk countians (spelling), should be proud of the education that our children receive.
I really am hurt that it didn't pass. But you that voted no, what is your opinion on what the school should do next? Any suggestions?
:-\
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:23:17 PM
I think there would be legal liability concerns if the public were to do some of the labor on the repairs of the roof or any other repairs that are necessary.
Oh jeeze. come on. We can volenteer for habitat for humanity, we can volenteer to build a park in howard now your arguing Liability issues??
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
I don't think most people would sue, just make sure that if they are hurt seriously that the county include them under their coverage to cover the medicals.
Either way the repairs to the building do not address the over staffing for the size of the district that is necessary to run three campuses when only one is necessary. You can repair (and waste money on those repairs) three buildings with cheap or volunteer labor all you want but that will not alleviate the situation whatsoever. What people need to realize to a degree is that we are currently at MAX LOB, which means next year if the population of students declines and thus the budget received by the state declines so must the LOB since the maximum LOB is a percentage of the total funding, thus people will have to be eliminated to meet that reduced budget and that is where the problem will grow large and will result in eliminated programs and a quick reduction in the quality of education provided by USD 282.
At this point, perhaps the school district should just be dissolved and have the students go to the closest open enrollment schools and watch as the remaining families in Elk county disappear.
[/quote]THey were going to eliminate at least 50% of the jobs anyway by consolidation. Come on, you don't pay 2 kindergarten teachers for one class.
Angie,
I understand where you're coming from, but I'll tell you where at least "I'm" coming from. I did vote no. No, I'm not from Elk county. Spent my whole life in Christian private schools. Went to college with a major in Biology and then have been back and forth to college for others things, so I'm by no means an idiot and am well educated. You own your own business, your husband works, you could get a second job..............that's great. But I'm a stay at home mom and I'm proud of it. Only my husband woks and his hours haven't been all that great due to the economy. We don't have any extra money to throw around, we're living on a shoe string as it is. If we can't afford to live here, regardless of schools, we'll move where we can. Do I have any suggestions for the school? Yes. Let those that have money.........and there is a lot of it out here in some families.............pay. There were a lot of people on here stating that money was no object and that they were willing to do whatever it takes to do this, well then do it. Private schools don't have a lot of money, they don't have fancy buildings, but they also don't have a lot of extracurricular activities that bigger schools do, but they're also not in debt and they don't take government funds and yet somehow, they make it and a some of them are bigger than West Elk and they do it all by what parents pay. I know that a lot of parents out here can't afford that, the same way they can't afford higher taxes, but there are parents that can. There are parents that can afford to help. And there are companies out here that can do some of the work that the buildings need done.
JMO and this is our side of it and after our property tax darn near doubled I'm glad I did vote the way we did as we're already trying to decide if we need to pack up and leave. There are a lot of places in Kansas where we can own a lot more land and twice the house for what we're going to be paying this year and I see nothing in Elk County to warrant it.
You say people need to volunteer. That is all fine and wonderful, but citizens of this community don't even show up for the meetings to get the information on the district's situation. How you going to get them to care enough to volunteer?
I understand you Sarah. I understand that you are a stay at home mom. That is one reason that I decided to do what I do. I wanted to stay with my children and not have to pay out the cost of daycare. I just got the vibe from those, not you, that nothing that Elk county does makes them happy. I agree to about the taxes. It's not going to be easy to come up with the money at all for us. But moving for us is not an option. We are here for the long haul. I just thought that the way that some of the people on this thread acted, not you, others was a little uncalled for. Again, just my opinion.
See, Sarah and I can easily have a disagreement and use no bad words. And it sounds like a conversation, not an attack on people. :laugh:
Quote from: gina on November 04, 2009, 07:28:36 AM
You say people need to volunteer. That is all fine and wonderful, but citizens of this community don't even show up for the meetings to get the information on the district's situation. How you going to get them to care enough to volunteer?
well you have had several people here volenteer. It doesn't take 1000 people.
Quote from: angtown3 on November 04, 2009, 07:31:14 AM
I understand you Sarah. I understand that you are a stay at home mom. That is one reason that I decided to do what I do. I wanted to stay with my children and not have to pay out the cost of daycare. I just got the vibe from those, not you, that nothing that Elk county does makes them happy. I agree to about the taxes. It's not going to be easy to come up with the money at all for us. But moving for us is not an option. We are here for the long haul. I just thought that the way that some of the people on this thread acted, not you, others was a little uncalled for. Again, just my opinion.
See, Sarah and I can easily have a disagreement and use no bad words. And it sounds like a conversation, not an attack on people. :laugh:
LOL I get scared to post too. Nothing like being ran over like a truck at times. :P
I don't have anything against Elk County at all. I actually like it. It was purely a matter of economics for us. We're just broke and we own a little tiny house not much bigger than a cracker box and a little tiny bit of land and a shed that we use for a barn and we're paying as much property tax as a great big house else where.
I wish there was something I could do at home. Trust me. I've looked for things. But we're sort of out of the way.......well, except for the dump trucks......and so not much I can do to make anything extra other than travel around to Farmers Markets which I hope to do next summer, but that doesn't pay much.
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:34:41 AM
Quote from: gina on November 04, 2009, 07:28:36 AM
You say people need to volunteer. That is all fine and wonderful, but citizens of this community don't even show up for the meetings to get the information on the district's situation. How you going to get them to care enough to volunteer?
well you have had several people here volenteer. It doesn't take 1000 people.
But saying and doing are to different things. Many people don't follow through. I know first hand what she is talking about.
Either way the repairs to the building do not address the over staffing for the size of the district that is necessary to run three campuses when only one is necessary. You can repair (and waste money on those repairs) three buildings with cheap or volunteer labor all you want but that will not alleviate the situation whatsoever. What people need to realize to a degree is that we are currently at MAX LOB, which means next year if the population of students declines and thus the budget received by the state declines so must the LOB since the maximum LOB is a percentage of the total funding, thus people will have to be eliminated to meet that reduced budget and that is where the problem will grow large and will result in eliminated programs and a quick reduction in the quality of education provided by USD 282.
At this point, perhaps the school district should just be dissolved and have the students go to the closest open enrollment schools and watch as the remaining families in Elk county disappear.
[/quote]THey were going to eliminate at least 50% of the jobs anyway by consolidation. Come on, you don't pay 2 kindergarten teachers for one class.
[/quote]
Yes that is what they were going to do.... now they will be forced to do that as well as begin to eliminate additional programs when we do not offer that many to begin with.
Quote from: angtown3 on November 04, 2009, 08:10:35 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:34:41 AM
Quote from: gina on November 04, 2009, 07:28:36 AM
You say people need to volunteer. That is all fine and wonderful, but citizens of this community don't even show up for the meetings to get the information on the district's situation. How you going to get them to care enough to volunteer?
well you have had several people here volenteer. It doesn't take 1000 people.
But saying and doing are to different things. Many people don't follow through. I know first hand what she is talking about.
well you can ask Sarah, when i say i will do something come hell or highwater i do it.
I don't make promises I won't keep.
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:15:47 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:23:17 PM
I think there would be legal liability concerns if the public were to do some of the labor on the repairs of the roof or any other repairs that are necessary.
Oh jeeze. come on. We can volenteer for habitat for humanity, we can volenteer to build a park in howard now your arguing Liability issues??
Certainly I will argue liability issues, and if you do not believe that they would come up then you are dreaming. For example, in the past the Lions Club had offered to repair pot holes in the City of Howard and were refused because we would have to be covered by the City's insurance policy in case of accident and because of the liability created if we did not do the work properly.
well jerry its like this. You get the core education covered. The basics. IF you want sports, or band or extra curricular activities then do like i did with my kids, I paid for them. And no i wasn't a rich man. I worked whatever it took to do it. Just because you don't have band, or music or football, or any of these other programs doesn't mean you won't produce or have students that will excell. The programs don't make the students successful. The Students are successful because they see their future and choose to be successful despite the odds.
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
Great, stick your head in the ground.... all the programs help round the student out.... it isn't all about just having the core programs and if you want to make the parents pay for additional programs you are helping to create a second class of students.... those of the parents that cannot pay for the additional classes.
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. ;D
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 04, 2009, 08:15:21 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:15:47 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:23:17 PM
I think there would be legal liability concerns if the public were to do some of the labor on the repairs of the roof or any other repairs that are necessary.
Oh jeeze. come on. We can volenteer for habitat for humanity, we can volenteer to build a park in howard now your arguing Liability issues??
Certainly I will argue liability issues, and if you do not believe that they would come up then you are dreaming. For example, in the past the Lions Club had offered to repair pot holes in the City of Howard and were refused because we would have to be covered by the City's insurance policy in case of accident and because of the liability created if we did not do the work properly.
Well you know what, they built schoolhouses for years and years with volenteer labor long before elk county became what it is. Heck i'll even bet that the two elementary schools had volenteer labor preformed on it.
But if they so choose to not utilize the resources of this area, Not just the county but the area, the volenteers that would help, then so be it. But you know don't complain when folks refuse to allow their taxes to go up. As for me, the offer still stands, I'll help with labor. I can swing a hammer, or wire up a panel, or any number of things.
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. :o
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 04, 2009, 08:20:40 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 08:18:26 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 04, 2009, 08:12:50 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:18:42 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:57:27 PM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:45:09 PM
Quote from: Patriot on November 03, 2009, 11:44:00 PM
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
Sorry but my head is not in any sand. I raised my youngins and worked 2 jobs to give them what was a excellent education, their very well rounded without all those programs. Your arguing that football, basketball, softball and band and all those things make a student successful. Maybe the help. But to ask the public to fund these programs is outside of education. Their extra curricular activities. Not necessary for education. Its play time at the taxpayers expense. IF you took the money out of football, that alone could fund the elementary schools.
And then have the final product reviewed/certified by a bonded contractor prior to occupancy.
If they were willing.
Either way the repairs to the building do not address the over staffing for the size of the district that is necessary to run three campuses when only one is necessary. You can repair (and waste money on those repairs) three buildings with cheap or volunteer labor all you want but that will not alleviate the situation whatsoever. What people need to realize to a degree is that we are currently at MAX LOB, which means next year if the population of students declines and thus the budget received by the state declines so must the LOB since the maximum LOB is a percentage of the total funding, thus people will have to be eliminated to meet that reduced budget and that is where the problem will grow large and will result in eliminated programs and a quick reduction in the quality of education provided by USD 282.
At this point, perhaps the school district should just be dissolved and have the students go to the closest open enrollment schools and watch as the remaining families in Elk county disappear.
THey were going to eliminate at least 50% of the jobs anyway by consolidation. Come on, you don't pay 2 kindergarten teachers for one class.
Yes that is what they were going to do.... now they will be forced to do that as well as begin to eliminate additional programs when we do not offer that many to begin with.
well jerry its like this. You get the core education covered. The basics. IF you want sports, or band or extra curricular activities then do like i did with my kids, I paid for them. And no i wasn't a rich man. I worked whatever it took to do it. Just because you don't have band, or music or football, or any of these other programs doesn't mean you won't produce or have students that will excell. The programs don't make the students successful. The Students are successful because they see their future and choose to be successful despite the odds.
Great, stick your head in the ground.... all the programs help round the student out.... it isn't all about just having the core programs and if you want to make the parents pay for additional programs you are helping to create a second class of students.... those of the parents that cannot pay for the additional classes.
Quote from: Patriot on November 04, 2009, 08:24:08 AM
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. :o
If i'm not mistaken we all do if we do business in elk county. We also pay federal tax which goes to elk county.
WOW!!! I was going to check out the politics section but I don't think I need to....PLENTY of politics right here. Seems to me what needs to happen is come up with another solution...I think Varmit had a good idea, however I do not live in Elk Co. or West Elk School districs...Just my unbiased oppinion.
I pay taxes here!!! :)
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
While some additional weight should probably be given to the views of those who 'gotta pay the bills', I'm of the thought that good ideas and input from others outside the district are also a good thing. Sometimes more heads are better than fewer. No?
Yes! More heads are better than fewer when those heads are rational and helpful with constructive experiences. If those head's intentions are to just stir up controversy and trouble at home, then I say, stay out of it. Present us with sound workable ideas and keep your rants to yourself.
Safe to say that I think there is one thing that we can all agree on here..... Nobody envies the job of the school board members....
I think volunteerism is an excellent idea, but is not a viable alternative when it comes to working on the actual school buildings. I see many things that have been built or repaired at the school grounds by current and past VoAg students such as landscaping and fencing and even some of the structures on the VoAg farm.
I also know firsthand the type of licensing and certifications that are needed to work on the actual school buildings themselves. For example, to work on the roof, a company or individual must be hold a million dollar bond before they even step on the roof. To work on either grade school, a company needs to hold asbestos abatement certificates, lead paint abatement certificates, and be licensed as such.
Quote from: DanCookson on November 04, 2009, 09:24:33 AM
Safe to say that I think there is one thing that we can all agree on here..... Nobody envies the job of the school board members....
I think volunteerism is an excellent idea, but is not a viable alternative when it comes to working on the actual school buildings. I see many things that have been built or repaired at the school grounds by current and past VoAg students such as landscaping and fencing and even some of the structures on the VoAg farm.
I also know firsthand the type of licensing and certifications that are needed to work on the actual school buildings themselves. For example, to work on the roof, a company or individual must be hold a million dollar bond before they even step on the roof. To work on either grade school, a company needs to hold asbestos abatement certificates, lead paint abatement certificates, and be licensed as such.
Absolutely.
okay, THE MAJORITY HAS SPOKEN. How I voted is between me and my ballot. Reading a lot of "how bout we do this?" on here and a lot of name calling, a lot of ideas, some good, some not so good, and if you think you might have a solution to the problem, you need to take it to the school board, not the forum. They are the ones that have to make the decisions. As for the asbestos problems, I know FOR A FACT that all asbestos was removed from the Severy Elementary BY CERTIFIED ASBESTOS WORKERS in the 70's, because it was during the 10 yrs. that I worked for the school district. This was done over the summer months. Moline, I can't vouch for, but I'd almost guess that they done the same thing there at the same time, or shortly before or after Severy. There are always going to be losers and winners in any election and jumping down each other's throats will not solve the problems at hand. Go vent your frustrations on something constructive, or if you like, something distructive, but work together to come up with viable solutions. Now, I'll get down from my soap box and let the rest of you take a stab at me for posting my 2 cents worth, which may be worth more now if you include taxes, etc. ;D :angel:
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 09:14:56 AM
Yes! More heads are better than fewer when those heads are rational and helpful with constructive experiences. If those head's intentions are to just stir up controversy and trouble at home, then I say, stay out of it. Present us with sound workable ideas and keep your rants to yourself.
Well, I won't claim the psychic prowess to determine with certainty the 'intentions' of those who dissent, because intentions (be it stir trouble or attempt self-enrichment/aggrandizement) are sometimes difficult to ascertain. As for myself, here's a list of potential Plan B options. Caveat: These may have been explored, I don't know. These are just things that come to mind.
1. Find a way to bring in sufficient portable buildings to house grades K - 6 at the West Elk Campus. Use available space at the HS building to the maximum extent possible. Geographically central consolidation of this district seems to make good sense given the costs of maintenance, etc. on the existing elementary buildings.
2. Close the buildings at Moline and Severy. If possible deed those properties to the city entities. The citizens in those towns can perhaps find uses for or bring in business that can find uses for the buildings. Do NOT prohibit the use of the facilities as private schools.
3. Use the savings from maintenance on those facilities to help fund the new portables in Howard and/or facilitate deferred maintenance on the HS building in Howard.
4. Do some serious evaluation of the transportation program. Make bus routes and processes as efficient as possible.
5. Make any staff reductions necessary to obtain the maximum productivity from the minimum staff/administration.
6. Keep in mind that extra curricular means just that... 'extra'. Give weight to expenditures that first enhance the quality of education and second to the 'extras'.
In general, try to do all these things the way any good business approaches such challenges: Don't leave out all compassion, but make the tough decisions that will give the most effective results at the lowest cost to the owners (read: taxpayers). Minimize emotion, foregoing desires to placate special interest groups, keeping reason and cost management at the forefront. And finally, don't rely on schools alone to be the raison d'etre for people wanting to live in Elk County. In short, there's gotta be some other economic development if the schools are to survive in any form.
Just some thoughts.
Good points, flo....
Though I somehow suspect that posting ideas here on the forum doesn't mean that the board doesn't hear/see them. I just can't imagine that the board doesn't see these posts. ;)
I see that Teresa has not provided us with appluading hands as of yet. Flo and Patriot, you certainly do deserve to be applauded. You have provided us with good sensible information and ideas. Thank you.
I can see that we all don't agree. But what really needs to be done is supporting one another and get along. If the communities or people are at each others throats, then nothing is going to be done right. Flo is so right on this one!!
I can't comment because I am not there and can't judge for myself. What I do want to say is--------------I have never seen so many people on the forum at one time. It shows that many of you are truly concerned about your community and that is great. Also, judging by the numbers, there was a good turnout for the election.
Here is SoCal, rather than build new schools, the existing schools are kept up to code and new portable buildings are added when new space is needed.
I like the idea of volunteers. After all, these are your kids and you want the best for them. So what if you have to put out a little effort. If you are a craftsman like an electrician, plumber, plasterer, etc., give up some time for a school.
Like I said, not my business, but I am amazed by the number of folks viewing this forum this morning.
Larryj
Larry,
I have stayed out of this too because it does not pertain to me-but---for the ones who voted no---it aint over till the chubby lady sings. We in Longton "soundly" beat a bond issue just a few short years back, but it was made smaller and put back to a vote. Again the masses said no---so it was made smaller once more and too many just threw in the towell and it passed.
Wow, not a great turn out at the polls yesterday. Out of 1728 Registered District 282 voters only 949 voted? It was commented that it was a good number. I don't agree.
I believe that the "NO" voters think they have saved their buildings from being shut down. A "NO" vote was NOT going to stop the closing of the schools. I think they believe they saved their taxes from increasing. Taxes will increase regardless if there is a new school or not. I think they believe they saved the elementary school from being placed in Howard. It was going to determine if we built a nice looking updated facility or sat pods on the existing campus. It is impossible to continue to maintain the 3 separate campuses. The issue was at one time what to do with the buildings. How to fix them, which one to fix and maintain. We have far gone beyond that topic. The issue at hand was to build a new school at Howard which is centrally located or not. If we were not building a new facility we go on with option B, place pods or trailers at the high school location.
Well, "NO" voters, you have been heard. Thank you. We will now move on with Plan B. It should be an adventure moving from one trailer to another for computer classes, library, to eat in a cafeteria, and to use the high school gym occupied by Jr. High & high School kids. I also understand that some of the students may be placed in the high school.
Now let's address those that didn't vote. I am sure there were people who were sick or gone for various reasons that could not help not being at the polls. I am not addressing them. I am addressing the ones who have no excuse or those that say, "It doesn't matter one way or another, so I'm not voting." Well, by not voting you are making a decision to allow others to make a decision for you. And I doubt truly if the issue was brought up if you would keep quiet. You have an opinion; you just chose not to put it in the form as a vote. I won't even get on a tangent about the right we have to vote and it being our obligation as well as a gift.
I made a comment about the numbers of the voters. To me, 55 percent of the registered voters voted is a good number. I am used to SoCal where if it isn't a presidential elections, you would be lucky to see 20 percent of the voters. Businesses are required by law to allow their employees time off to vote. But there is a great apathy towards taking the time to vote.
Larryj
LadyD, according to Rudy's numbers there were 997 that voted,
Quote from: flintauqua on November 03, 2009, 10:40:02 PM
You all are just pathetic. You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. You just get on here and congratulate each other for once again stopping any and all progress towards a solution that has been needed for decades. That's the problem with Elk County, all you regressive, uber-right quasi-anarchist Reationaries.
Did you ever think to go to a school board meeting before the bond election? No!
Did you ever think about going to the courthouse and setting in on a Commissioners meeting to see where the money goes? No!
Have you ever gone to Topeka and set in the balcony and watch the Legislature in action, and then go talk to your representative about where the money goes? No!
Have you ever served as a legistative intern, and watched from the inside what goes into the job of representing anal retentive butt-wipes like you? Again, No!
Firstly I think you owe everyone and apology for this over emotional display of crap. If you can't seem to do this then here is what I have to say about that.
Where do you live and why? How many school board meetings have YOU been to? How many children do you have? How much land do you own and pay taxes on in Elk County? How many commission meetings did you attend when you weren't employed by the county? How many trips to Topeka did you make? Name calling is a bit childish and your way older than that. Where do you get off talking like that to people who still live and struggle here? >:(
Ok, this has been driving me crazy all day. It was a vote. It didn't pass. I am sad about it. I wanted the bond to pass. I was upset. But some of my friends were against it, and we still get along, no name calling. We agree to disagree end of story. If it was meant to be, God will do it in his time, not ours. There must be another plan for this school, and I am not sure what it is. But what I am sure of is that if we, all community members don't get along nothing will be accomplished.
Quote from: angtown3 on November 04, 2009, 03:45:56 PM
Ok, this has been driving me crazy all day. It was a vote. It didn't pass. I am sad about it. I wanted the bond to pass. I was upset. But some of my friends were against it, and we still get along, no name calling. We agree to disagree end of story. If it was meant to be, God will do it in his time, not ours. There must be another plan for this school, and I am not sure what it is. But what I am sure of is that if we, all community members don't get along nothing will be accomplished.
:) :)
You know, I've been thinking about this issue all day and was wondering why can't we perhaps build a smaller building that can be added on to as funds permit, or at least a cheaper building that won't hit the taxpayers so hard? It would seem reasonable that a cheaper building could be built if it was put up for bid. Hearsay has it that the building of this school was never put up for bid with other contractors. Cheaper construction perhaps, or perhaps a smaller building could be designed and added on to and then everyone is happy? I don't know. Just throwing out ideas.
Sarah -
I don't know all your answers, but I do know that adding on to the current building has been discussed and dismissed. It would be too expensive to retrofit the current building for safety codes, etc. with an add-on. We're allowed to leave it as is, but regulations have changed so much since it was built and an add-on would require us to meet all those regs.
Quote from: jarhead on November 04, 2009, 12:03:56 PM
Larry,
I have stayed out of this too because it does not pertain to me-but---for the ones who voted no---it aint over till the chubby lady sings. We in Longton "soundly" beat a bond issue just a few short years back, but it was made smaller and put back to a vote. Again the masses said no---so it was made smaller once more and too many just threw in the towell and it passed.
I see this happening to us.
Don't move the bus barn, gravel the parking lot, have a fundraiser and let the FFA do the landscaping. Get the cost down so the $500,000 we save by closing Moline and Severy will make the majority of the bond payments.
I am not sticking up for flint, but he has a point about the meetings. Of all the people that post on this forum, I have only seen perhaps a handful attend board meetings.
Quote from: Mom70x7 on November 04, 2009, 04:55:27 PM
Sarah -
I don't know all your answers, but I do know that adding on to the current building has been discussed and dismissed. It would be too expensive to retrofit the current building for safety codes, etc. with an add-on. We're allowed to leave it as is, but regulations have changed so much since it was built and an add-on would require us to meet all those regs.
That's not quite what I meant. I meant perhaps building a new smaller building that could be added on to rather than a very expensive large building. Maybe that would help? I don't know everyone's reasons for voting no and even with the costs down I'm not sure it would go through, but it was just an idea of maybe starting with something smaller.
I do not live in the school district or the county, but I do have family there and I am interested in good schools. I don't believe I have had any rants. If so, I'm sorry.
greatguns, I have never heard you rant. I have, however, heard you present some good common sense. We could use some more of that.
Quote from: Sarah on November 04, 2009, 06:18:00 PM
Quote from: Mom70x7 on November 04, 2009, 04:55:27 PM
Sarah -
I don't know all your answers, but I do know that adding on to the current building has been discussed and dismissed. It would be too expensive to retrofit the current building for safety codes, etc. with an add-on. We're allowed to leave it as is, but regulations have changed so much since it was built and an add-on would require us to meet all those regs.
That's not quite what I meant. I meant perhaps building a new smaller building that could be added on to rather than a very expensive large building. Maybe that would help? I don't know everyone's reasons for voting no and even with the costs down I'm not sure it would go through, but it was just an idea of maybe starting with something smaller.
I think that anyone coming into any community these days talking about raising taxes is going to get a Hell no on that. With recent taxes doubling along with this administration doing their best to screw with healthcare taxing everyone more, along with this administration trying to slap a energy tax on our electric and fuel that will double our costs, as well as the constant increase in food costs, folks are not going tot olerate any more taxes.
Quote from: ladyD on November 04, 2009, 01:58:27 PM
We will now move on with Plan B. It should be an adventure moving from one trailer to another for computer classes, library, to eat in a cafeteria, and to use the high school gym occupied by Jr. High & high School kids. I also understand that some of the students may be placed in the high school.
Actually, that is not as bad as it sounds. I have had to do this many times in several schools that I attended (Dad was in the navy, we moved around alot). In fact, it is actually a good thing. Kids get bored easily, a change in enviroment helps keep them alert and stimulated. Also, the few moments spent moving from one trailer to another helps to get their blood flowing again which helps keep them awake.
Quote from: greatguns on November 04, 2009, 06:20:05 PM
I do not live in the school district or the county, but I do have family there and I am interested in good schools. I don't believe I have had any rants. If so, I'm sorry.
No apology necessary as far as I can tell greatguns ::) ;D
QuoteThat's not quite what I meant. I meant perhaps building a new smaller building that could be added on to rather than a very expensive large building. Maybe that would help? I don't know everyone's reasons for voting no and even with the costs down I'm not sure it would go through, but it was just an idea of maybe starting with something smaller.
So call Corey Reese, the superintendent, or one of the board members. Marty Taliaferro is board president. Both are very willing to listen. Let them know what you think.
USD 282 Board meetings typically do not have a "public comment" time during the meeting. If you call the week before (this week) you can usually get on the agenda. That's if you want to speak to the entire board. All the members are very receptive to one-on-one conversation pretty much any time. I know. I've talked with them. Give them some ideas on what you think will work.
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 10:03:39 PM
No Sir, you give me a break! David. Just where do you think the money is going to come from to pay for that new school? Because it sure as hell isn't just going to appear out of nowhere. Taxes will go up. Working men and women would, you know, the ones who pay taxes, would have to pay for it. But I guess the bond is a moot point, seeing as how it didn't pass.
Quote from: Sarah on November 03, 2009, 10:00:12 PM
Probably can't fix it with tacos, but to those that the rise in taxes were no big deal, then why don't they take that money that they would have been paying had it passed and pay that money directly to the school district?
good idea.
Why are you even on this board pissing and moaning varmit, didnt you say you live in grenola and your kids go out of district, probably to central, then you are paying their school taxes, why arent you complaining about the new school they built several years back?
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
yeah sure, are you that far off in lala grenolaland to think that, you voted for obama didnt you?
Quote from: Hunter75 on November 04, 2009, 12:02:03 AM
I am totally floored. I had hoped for a decisive victory for my kids, instead ignorance reared its ugly head. I would say 375-622 is directly proportional to the number of voters with school aged children. How quickly education drops off your radar when your kids are grown. Well now what? The school board decision will no doubt cause a loss in teachers, school dependant jobs, and the loss of capabilities/programs. Either Severy or Moline will lose a school (and niether will do very well without its school) and the county will lose out on education and educated citizens yeah!!! Thats just what W.E. needs. More of the same. I hear all kinds of quality comments from folks like cut athletics and extra-curriculars, thats nice just what a young family wants to hear from the town(s) you live in. I want my kids to have the best not a half a$$&D pseudo-education that requires a stint at a community college to even meet most university admission standards thats rich! So now I have to weigh my kids future against my want to stay in Elk County gee thanks. Dont see many young folks getting an education and coming back to Elk County in fact I dont see many young folks at all our average age is 46 and 52% are over 45! They say these last couple of generations are lazy, lack ambition, lack common sense, and so on.... well look what the older generations just said with their voting. Well have fun a Penny's Pub, get some beer and cigs at P&J's and drink up you say we the 375 ought to pay for our kids educations, school repairs and all, well you 622 ought to be proud and state what you voted out loud so we can all appreciate your ignorance. I saw a quote on Terresa's post some time back that said something like "people thought Americans were stupid so Americans went to the poles and removed all doubt!" Well there ya go history repeats itself! I think the gene pool needs a new filter!!
Some cliches/quotes come to mind that discribe this vote to a T;
"you cant polish a turd;"
"that little white spot on chicken crap is still crap;"
"Some drink from the fountain of knowledge - others just gargle"
If you think education is expensive - try ignorance.- Derek Bok-; >:(
you think that it is the number of familys with kids as to not with kids, it seems more like Howard vs Severy/Longton/ElkFalls,
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:18:42 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:57:27 PM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:45:09 PM
Quote from: Patriot on November 03, 2009, 11:44:00 PM
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
And then have the final product reviewed/certified by a bonded contractor prior to occupancy.
If they were willing.
Either way the repairs to the building do not address the over staffing for the size of the district that is necessary to run three campuses when only one is necessary. You can repair (and waste money on those repairs) three buildings with cheap or volunteer labor all you want but that will not alleviate the situation whatsoever. What people need to realize to a degree is that we are currently at MAX LOB, which means next year if the population of students declines and thus the budget received by the state declines so must the LOB since the maximum LOB is a percentage of the total funding, thus people will have to be eliminated to meet that reduced budget and that is where the problem will grow large and will result in eliminated programs and a quick reduction in the quality of education provided by USD 282.
At this point, perhaps the school district should just be dissolved and have the students go to the closest open enrollment schools and watch as the remaining families in Elk county disappear.
THey were going to eliminate at least 50% of the jobs anyway by consolidation. Come on, you don't pay 2 kindergarten teachers for one class.
I think your quote should be you dont pay for 2 high schools in a county that only needs 1, because there are some kids that are dumber and need an easier school, so they can only go when they want and still graduate, thats not an education
for those of you that dont know im talking about longton
Quote from: gina on November 04, 2009, 07:28:36 AM
You say people need to volunteer. That is all fine and wonderful, but citizens of this community don't even show up for the meetings to get the information on the district's situation. How you going to get them to care enough to volunteer?
i agree totally, volunteer....whats that, why doesnt anyone show up to volunteer to help clean up the bank building in howard?
Here is the other side....Volunteer...what you mean work and not get paid, man f that, im gonna sit right here on the couch watch tv or play my xbox....hey i wonder if the welfare check is here yet im hungry...
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:24:52 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:18:42 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:57:27 PM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:45:09 PM
Quote from: Patriot on November 03, 2009, 11:44:00 PM
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
And then have the final product reviewed/certified by a bonded contractor prior to occupancy.
If they were willing.
Either way the repairs to the building do not address the over staffing for the size of the district that is necessary to run three campuses when only one is necessary. You can repair (and waste money on those repairs) three buildings with cheap or volunteer labor all you want but that will not alleviate the situation whatsoever. What people need to realize to a degree is that we are currently at MAX LOB, which means next year if the population of students declines and thus the budget received by the state declines so must the LOB since the maximum LOB is a percentage of the total funding, thus people will have to be eliminated to meet that reduced budget and that is where the problem will grow large and will result in eliminated programs and a quick reduction in the quality of education provided by USD 282.
At this point, perhaps the school district should just be dissolved and have the students go to the closest open enrollment schools and watch as the remaining families in Elk county disappear.
THey were going to eliminate at least 50% of the jobs anyway by consolidation. Come on, you don't pay 2 kindergarten teachers for one class.
I think your quote should be you dont pay for 2 high schools in a county that only needs 1, because there are some kids that are dumber and need an easier school, so they can only go when they want and still graduate, thats not an education
for those of you that dont know im talking about longton
Then what is the problem?? Take longton and move them to the howard highschool and move the elementary to the longton building, problem solved.
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 04, 2009, 08:15:21 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:15:47 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:23:17 PM
I think there would be legal liability concerns if the public were to do some of the labor on the repairs of the roof or any other repairs that are necessary.
Oh jeeze. come on. We can volenteer for habitat for humanity, we can volenteer to build a park in howard now your arguing Liability issues??
Certainly I will argue liability issues, and if you do not believe that they would come up then you are dreaming. For example, in the past the Lions Club had offered to repair pot holes in the City of Howard and were refused because we would have to be covered by the City's insurance policy in case of accident and because of the liability created if we did not do the work properly.
I got a chuckle from this one, "if we did not do the work properly", when does the city do any work properly, we pay for dirty water that smells like chlorine, month after month
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:31:32 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 04, 2009, 08:15:21 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 07:15:47 AM
Quote from: jerry wagner on November 03, 2009, 11:23:17 PM
I think there would be legal liability concerns if the public were to do some of the labor on the repairs of the roof or any other repairs that are necessary.
Oh jeeze. come on. We can volenteer for habitat for humanity, we can volenteer to build a park in howard now your arguing Liability issues??
Certainly I will argue liability issues, and if you do not believe that they would come up then you are dreaming. For example, in the past the Lions Club had offered to repair pot holes in the City of Howard and were refused because we would have to be covered by the City's insurance policy in case of accident and because of the liability created if we did not do the work properly.
I got a chuckle from this one, "if we did not do the work properly", when does the city do any work properly, we pay for dirty water that smells like chlorine, month after month
I pulled up this summer to that fill station and dumped some of that NASTY water i wouldn't even give to my critters. One sure sign its not fit for consumption is that if a goat won't drink it, no one should drink it.
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 08:33:35 AM
Quote from: Patriot on November 04, 2009, 08:24:08 AM
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. :o
If i'm not mistaken we all do if we do business in elk county. We also pay federal tax which goes to elk county.
im dont have have a cpa in accounting, but last i checked, FEDERAL TAX GOES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
Quote from: flo on November 04, 2009, 09:41:15 AM
okay, THE MAJORITY HAS SPOKEN. How I voted is between me and my ballot. Reading a lot of "how bout we do this?" on here and a lot of name calling, a lot of ideas, some good, some not so good, and if you think you might have a solution to the problem, you need to take it to the school board, not the forum. They are the ones that have to make the decisions. As for the asbestos problems, I know FOR A FACT that all asbestos was removed from the Severy Elementary BY CERTIFIED ASBESTOS WORKERS in the 70's, because it was during the 10 yrs. that I worked for the school district. This was done over the summer months. Moline, I can't vouch for, but I'd almost guess that they done the same thing there at the same time, or shortly before or after Severy. There are always going to be losers and winners in any election and jumping down each other's throats will not solve the problems at hand. Go vent your frustrations on something constructive, or if you like, something distructive, but work together to come up with viable solutions. Now, I'll get down from my soap box and let the rest of you take a stab at me for posting my 2 cents worth, which may be worth more now if you include taxes, etc. ;D :angel:
People that say its "between me and my ballot" voted no, you probably voted for obama too.
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 08:33:35 AM
Quote from: Patriot on November 04, 2009, 08:24:08 AM
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. :o
If i'm not mistaken we all do if we do business in elk county. We also pay federal tax which goes to elk county.
im dont have have a cpa in accounting, but last i checked, FEDERAL TAX GOES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
The last i checked every Government school gets Federal funding which comes out of our federal taxes.
http://www.usakansas.org/content/1/West_Elk_USD_-_Superintendent_Bert_Moore.pdf
Quote from: srkruzich on November 05, 2009, 08:42:19 AM
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 08:33:35 AM
Quote from: Patriot on November 04, 2009, 08:24:08 AM
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. :o
If i'm not mistaken we all do if we do business in elk county. We also pay federal tax which goes to elk county.
im dont have have a cpa in accounting, but last i checked, FEDERAL TAX GOES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
The last i checked every Government school gets Federal funding which comes out of our federal taxes.
according to the budget, usd 282 received $257,969 in federal funds, $148,230 in supplemental federal funds, $114,148 for foodservice, and $422,000 for special education, thats hardly all of our federal taxes
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:57:42 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 05, 2009, 08:42:19 AM
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: srkruzich on November 04, 2009, 08:33:35 AM
Quote from: Patriot on November 04, 2009, 08:24:08 AM
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Just out of curiosity, how many of the people that are posting their opinions on this thread as to what the school district should do, pay taxes for USD 282?
I do. :o
If i'm not mistaken we all do if we do business in elk county. We also pay federal tax which goes to elk county.
im dont have have a cpa in accounting, but last i checked, FEDERAL TAX GOES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
The last i checked every Government school gets Federal funding which comes out of our federal taxes.
according to the budget, usd 282 received $257,969 in federal funds, $148,230 in supplemental federal funds, $114,148 for foodservice, and $422,000 for special education, thats hardly all of our federal taxes
Never said it was all our tax dollars and the taxes collected in each county doesn't all go to the schools either.
A tax dollar is a dollar stolen.
Rez thanks for posting that site with the district information. It is very informative to those who haven't attended any of the board meetings over the past 5 years! For those of you with all of your suggestions regarding what the school district should do, that is just fine and great. But all of these suggestions are not new, the district has considered many of these as they have been brought to their attention through citizens of the community that have attended the board meetings. They have been discussed and thought out completely. Once again, what I am saying is get actively involved and attend the school board meetings so you get the information first hand without any bias or rumor.
PrehistoricRez,
So now only the "stupid kids" go to Longton school ?? What an ignorant ass you are !! If that is your belief though, what years did you attend Longton /Elk Valley school ?
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:36:45 AM
Quote from: flo on November 04, 2009, 09:41:15 AM
okay, THE MAJORITY HAS SPOKEN. How I voted is between me and my ballot. Reading a lot of "how bout we do this?" on here and a lot of name calling, a lot of ideas, some good, some not so good, and if you think you might have a solution to the problem, you need to take it to the school board, not the forum. They are the ones that have to make the decisions. As for the asbestos problems, I know FOR A FACT that all asbestos was removed from the Severy Elementary BY CERTIFIED ASBESTOS WORKERS in the 70's, because it was during the 10 yrs. that I worked for the school district. This was done over the summer months. Moline, I can't vouch for, but I'd almost guess that they done the same thing there at the same time, or shortly before or after Severy. There are always going to be losers and winners in any election and jumping down each other's throats will not solve the problems at hand. Go vent your frustrations on something constructive, or if you like, something distructive, but work together to come up with viable solutions. Now, I'll get down from my soap box and let the rest of you take a stab at me for posting my 2 cents worth, which may be worth more now if you include taxes, etc. ;D :angel:
People that say its "between me and my ballot" voted no, you probably voted for obama too.
When I go to vote, I go into an enclosed booth, whether it is for a new school or a president. The reason for these enclosed booths is that is the AMERICAN way and WHO YOU VOTE FOR IS NOBODY'S BUSINESS BUT YOURS. I did not belittle anyone for their opinions, so don't belittle me for mine.
I'm going to add a P.S. to this. My late husband and I were married just days short of 37 years when he passed. During that time we NEVER asked each other who they voted for. That is a very private matter and NOBODY ELSE'S BUSINESS. And I'm still not going to tell you who or what I voted for, sorry.
QuoteI'm going to add a P.S. to this. My late husband and I were married just days short of 37 years when he passed. During that time we NEVER asked each other who they voted for. That is a very private matter and NOBODY ELSE'S BUSINESS. And I'm still not going to tell you who or what I voted for, sorry.
I agree - Jim and I rarely discuss what our actual votes were, although we've discussed the issues back and forth quite a bit.
The funny - when we
have disclosed who we voted for, we often find we're on opposite sides. :D :D :D
Heh, this rez guy is a real winner. He thinks Billy voted for Obama, i guess you need to do a little more reading on some of these people before you start talking about them.
As for the bond issue, from my point of view, i wouldn't move to a county that didn't have a good school system. That means i wouldn't bring my business and tax revenue with me. That affects everyone in the district, whether they have kids in the school or not.
Our school district just got a 20 million dollar grant from the federal government for renovations on our schools. I've heard that there is still a lot of grant money out there from the reinvestment act. Has anyone checked out the possibility of applying for this money? Has anyone contacted their representatives for help?
Rez
That crack about Longton was "hitting below the belt".
I think its time for the Moderator to take action....and somebody get Rez some bupropion.
Quote from: LisaT on November 04, 2009, 02:58:21 PM
Quote from: flintauqua on November 03, 2009, 10:40:02 PM
You all are just pathetic. You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. You just get on here and congratulate each other for once again stopping any and all progress towards a solution that has been needed for decades. That's the problem with Elk County, all you regressive, uber-right quasi-anarchist Reationaries.
Did you ever think to go to a school board meeting before the bond election? No!
Did you ever think about going to the courthouse and setting in on a Commissioners meeting to see where the money goes? No!
Have you ever gone to Topeka and set in the balcony and watch the Legislature in action, and then go talk to your representative about where the money goes? No!
Have you ever served as a legistative intern, and watched from the inside what goes into the job of representing anal retentive butt-wipes like you? Again, No!
Firstly I think you owe everyone and apology for this over emotional display of crap. If you can't seem to do this then here is what I have to say about that.
Where do you live and why? How many school board meetings have YOU been to? How many children do you have? How much land do you own and pay taxes on in Elk County? How many commission meetings did you attend when you weren't employed by the county? How many trips to Topeka did you make? Name calling is a bit childish and your way older than that. Where do you get off talking like that to people who still live and struggle here? >:(
Does someone need a hug? Or something else? I think you should have to both hold hands until you both apologize.
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:08:11 AM
Why are you even on this board pissing and moaning varmit, didnt you say you live in grenola and your kids go out of district, probably to central, then you are paying their school taxes, why arent you complaining about the new school they built several years back?
First of all, I am on here because it is a public forum and open to all. Secondly, I am a citizen of Elk county and even though my kids go to school out of district this issue still affects me and my family. Third, I didn't complain several years back because I wasn't living here when they built the school and I didn't have kids when they built the school, I was still in school when they built the school. By the way, my taxes do not go to cowley county, I do not write a tax check to cowley county.
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:13:30 AM
Quote from: Varmit on November 03, 2009, 11:42:02 PM
Well, then have them sign a waiver or something. I don't think that the folks in Elk county (and again I could be way off here) are that "sue happy" that if they were volunteering to something like this, and got hurt, that they would sue the school or whatever.
yeah sure, are you that far off in lala grenolaland to think that, you voted for obama didnt you?
Actually, if I had voted for obama (which has nothing to do with this) I would be all for the bond. I am not.
Varmit, I didn't vote for Obama and I voted for the bond to pass. And your check goes to Elk county yes, but look at you tax statement, where does your school money go? I think that living in Grenola your school taxes go to Cowley county. Not sure, but would check on that.
But what is your suggestion to do with the school? Put yourself in the place of me who has 3 young girls in this school system. What would you have done then? I still say that we need to try the vote again!! There is no way you, Varmit would bus your children an hour to school, if you lived in Howard. I won't. So I am going to get as much information as I can by attending the School Board meeting Monday night. I have attended several, not all, but do care what happens. As I stated before in earlier thread, I feel that I as a parent have failed my children. I have one in preschool, one in 1st grade and one in 6th. So, it really does matter what happens to the school for me and my family. I feel like I have not done everything that is possible to insure a proper education for my children. And my children are very bright girls, with bright futures ahead of them. I am not going to hold them down, because I can't afford it. Money is a small price to pay, for the happiness of my childrens future!!!
Quote from: PrehistoricRez on November 05, 2009, 08:31:32 AM
Certainly I will argue liability issues, and if you do not believe that they would come up then you are dreaming. For example, in the past the Lions Club had offered to repair pot holes in the City of Howard and were refused because we would have to be covered by the City's insurance policy in case of accident and because of the liability created if we did not do the work properly.
I got a chuckle from this one, "if we did not do the work properly", when does the city do any work properly, we pay for dirty water that smells like chlorine, month after month
[/quote]
QuoteI think your quote should be you dont pay for 2 high schools in a county that only needs 1, because there are some kids that are dumber and need an easier school, so they can only go when they want and still graduate, thats not an education
for those of you that dont know im talking about longton
Speaking of dumber kids...I would like to point out that Jerry was talking about the liability issue that would arise if the Lions Club didn't do the work properly, not the city. You might want to speak to someone about taking some remedial reading comprehension classes.
Angtown, I have mentioned several ideas on what to do with the school. For the record, I have 3 kids, 11, 9, and 6 years old. They spend about two hours on the bus each day. Doesn't hurt them a bit.
As for them getting a proper education, I look more for the quality of teachers they have then the building they are in. As for their future, once they graduate, it is up to them.
But it is my choice not to make my children ride the bus that long. I don't want that for them. And won't let that happen. As for the quality of teachers, you are right. West Elk has some of the best in the state.
Quote from: angtown3 on November 06, 2009, 06:12:21 AM
Varmit, I didn't vote for Obama and I voted for the bond to pass. And your check goes to Elk county yes, but look at you tax statement, where does your school money go? I think that living in Grenola your school taxes go to Cowley county. Not sure, but would check on that.
But what is your suggestion to do with the school? Put yourself in the place of me who has 3 young girls in this school system. What would you have done then? I still say that we need to try the vote again!! There is no way you, Varmit would bus your children an hour to school, if you lived in Howard. I won't. So I am going to get as much information as I can by attending the School Board meeting Monday night. I have attended several, not all, but do care what happens. As I stated before in earlier thread, I feel that I as a parent have failed my children. I have one in preschool, one in 1st grade and one in 6th. So, it really does matter what happens to the school for me and my family. I feel like I have not done everything that is possible to insure a proper education for my children. And my children are very bright girls, with bright futures ahead of them. I am not going to hold them down, because I can't afford it. Money is a small price to pay, for the happiness of my childrens future!!!
If they move the school to Howard my kids will have to ride the bus for an hour. Should I have voted yes or no?
That is your choice. We lived a couple miles outside of town and last year the girls had to get on the bus at 625 or so. So it's my choice not to do that to them. Voting yes or no has nothing to do with the location of where the school is going to be. We are looking at budget cuts. Do you want them to combine classes? K-1, and so on? Do you want your children to have any business classes at the high school. There will free up money easy the burden of the money if the bond would have passed. That is my point.
I have to say the reason, I am kind of upset more and more is no one sees the big picture. I have friends, who have been renting a house in town. They are trying to decided whether to buy a house and stay, or not because of the school situations. Many of you have stated that people don't look at this situation to being why are communities are not growing. But it kind of is. I mean if younger couples with children come looking in this area, and see the school system in such a mess, would you move here? I sometimes wish we could move. Not that I don't like the community and small town, but what will my kids do if this school system gets closed or what we are heading for goes broke? What will we do then?
Heres a solution to the school issue. If the citizens that voted yes to a bond and a new school want one, then why don't they get together and build one? They can offer whatever classes they want, hire the teachers they want, have whatever programs they want, etc. That way, they get their new school, the "no" voters get what they want, its a win-win situation.
Quote from: angtown3 on November 06, 2009, 07:00:02 AM
I have to say the reason, I am kind of upset more and more is no one sees the big picture. I have friends, who have been renting a house in town. They are trying to decided whether to buy a house and stay, or not because of the school situations. Many of you have stated that people don't look at this situation to being why are communities are not growing. But it kind of is. I mean if younger couples with children come looking in this area, and see the school system in such a mess, would you move here? I sometimes wish we could move. Not that I don't like the community and small town, but what will my kids do if this school system gets closed or what we are heading for goes broke? What will we do then?
Angie,
You know I'm sort of torn on the whole situation, but people don't move "just" because of the schools. We're looking at moving and our main concerns are area as far as work is concerned and property tax. Those two things are also extremely important and unfortunately, not only does Elk county not have any industry to speak of to offer jobs, but the property tax is really high. So, that alone will tend to keep people from moving here. Not all, but quite a few. Well, that and the no water issue.
So, the schools are only part of Elk County's concerns. And it seems that the people in Severy and Moline were VERY against the issue. The main ones for it were the ones in Howard and so it does seem it's an issue of the county seat against it's own county. And what about his second high school? A high school in Longton? will it be closed too?
YES! The school is the main reason for our family to stay in Elk County. We have moved to this area for our kids it is safer and the schools are safer also. We do have work in Elk County so that should not be a reason to leave the county but we will be willing to drive for a more sound school system if need be. We love it here and do not want to move. But we will do the best thing for our kids. Everyone says nobody is moving to this county to increase enrollment but we might not be much but we have 2 kids
Quote from: kdtmv2003 on November 06, 2009, 07:54:19 AM
YES! The school is the main reason for our family to stay in Elk County. We have moved to this area for our kids it is safer and the schools are safer also. We do have work in Elk County so that should not be a reason to leave the county but we will be willing to drive for a more sound school system if need be. We love it here and do not want to move. But we will do the best thing for our kids. Everyone says nobody is moving to this county to increase enrollment but we might not me much but we have 2 kids
Excuse my wording. I should say that not everyone moves to an area just because of the schools. I re-read my post and I did make it sound as if I was lumping everyone together. My apologies.
Quote from: Sarah on November 06, 2009, 08:01:34 AM
Quote from: kdtmv2003 on November 06, 2009, 07:54:19 AM
YES! The school is the main reason for our family to stay in Elk County. We have moved to this area for our kids it is safer and the schools are safer also. We do have work in Elk County so that should not be a reason to leave the county but we will be willing to drive for a more sound school system if need be. We love it here and do not want to move. But we will do the best thing for our kids. Everyone says nobody is moving to this county to increase enrollment but we might not me much but we have 2 kids
Excuse my wording. I should say that not everyone moves to an area just because of the schools. I re-read my post and I did make it sound as if I was lumping everyone together. My apologies.
That is fine. We all have our reasons for being here or staying here.
Quote from: Sarah on November 06, 2009, 08:01:34 AM
Quote from: kdtmv2003 on November 06, 2009, 07:54:19 AM
YES! The school is the main reason for our family to stay in Elk County. We have moved to this area for our kids it is safer and the schools are safer also. We do have work in Elk County so that should not be a reason to leave the county but we will be willing to drive for a more sound school system if need be. We love it here and do not want to move. But we will do the best thing for our kids. Everyone says nobody is moving to this county to increase enrollment but we might not me much but we have 2 kids
Excuse my wording. I should say that not everyone moves to an area just because of the schools. I re-read my post and I did make it sound as if I was lumping everyone together. My apologies.
I think we all have differing reasons for wanting to live here. For some it's good & safe schools, for others is being away from the rat race of the city, for some a chance to start a new business, for some a get away to hunt and vacatoin. But for those who choose to reside here, I think we need to admit that there is one common thread: affordability!
If the cost of living here exceeds our ability to pay for it, then all the other 'reasons' are moot. Keeping that in mind, I think we have to admit that things like jobs, good water, quality schools are all important. And only good jobs, however, will lead to the ability to afford quality schools and good water. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: This county desperately needs to explore ways to develop its economy. If we don't, then all the bond issues will do is provide nice schools for folks who can't afford to live out here.
Quote from: Patriot on November 06, 2009, 08:10:47 AM
Quote from: Sarah on November 06, 2009, 08:01:34 AM
Quote from: kdtmv2003 on November 06, 2009, 07:54:19 AM
YES! The school is the main reason for our family to stay in Elk County. We have moved to this area for our kids it is safer and the schools are safer also. We do have work in Elk County so that should not be a reason to leave the county but we will be willing to drive for a more sound school system if need be. We love it here and do not want to move. But we will do the best thing for our kids. Everyone says nobody is moving to this county to increase enrollment but we might not me much but we have 2 kids
Excuse my wording. I should say that not everyone moves to an area just because of the schools. I re-read my post and I did make it sound as if I was lumping everyone together. My apologies.
I think we all have differing reasons for wanting to live here. For some it's good & safe schools, for others is being away from the rat race of the city, for some a chance to start a new business, for some a get away to hunt and vacatoin. But for those who choose to reside here, I think we need to admit that there is one common thread: affordability!
If the cost of living here exceeds our ability to pay for it, then all the other 'reasons' are moot. Keeping that in mind, I think we have to admit that things like jobs, good water, quality schools are all important. And only good jobs, however, will lead to the ability to afford quality schools and good water. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: This county desperately needs to explore ways to develop its economy. If we don't, then all the bond issues will do is provide nice schools for folks who can't afford to live out here.
Got a question wasn't there supposed to be a nice windfall from the windfarms being built in elk county? Shoot you could fund not only the school but actually bring in water into the county to attract more industry.
I have said this before, but I am going to say it again. My husband drove from Severy to Wichita every day to work a job that paid good and still raise our kids in a better community and school. He did this for 25 years until the children were grown and he didn't have 400 to drive on. He drove the old 96 with it's hills and curves. To me, not living in Elk County because of the lack of good paying jobs doesn't float. Wichita is one hour and ten minutes from Howard. Emporia is about the same. Winfield and Independence, about 45 minutes. I know the cost of gasoline is prohibitive now, but back then, the wages weren't so good either. And there is this thing called car pooling. My husband was very seldom alone on his trip to work. Mostly the car was full. That was our choice so that our kids could live the life of a small community.
srkruzich,
Not sure, but I'm guessin that waiting on the windfarms may be like waiting on the lottery. That process is only one possibility. But, yes it was supposed to bring in some serous bucks. Not sure what the 'latest' number is, but I'm also not sure if that would benefit he schools.
Quote from: Wilma on November 06, 2009, 08:17:13 AM
I have said this before, but I am going to say it again. My husband drove from Severy to Wichita every day to work a job that paid good and still raise our kids in a better community and school. He did this for 25 years until the children were grown and he didn't have 400 to drive on. He drove the old 96 with it's hills and curves. To me, not living in Elk County because of the lack of good paying jobs doesn't float. Wichita is one hour and ten minutes from Howard. Emporia is about the same. Winfield and Independence, about 45 minutes. I know the cost of gasoline is prohibitive now, but back then, the wages weren't so good either. And there is this thing called car pooling. My husband was very seldom alone on his trip to work. Mostly the car was full. That was our choice so that our kids could live the life of a small community.
Wilma, your going to find in the next year or so, the cost of gas is going to make driving to wichita impossible except on a weekly or monthly basis. Cap n Trade is going to devestate this country. Uhmm what your going to find if this happens is that people are going to have to rely on local jobs and resources as the transportation costs are going to be unbelievable. This cap n trade is going to make last years 4.00 a gallon gas look cheap.
Quote from: Wilma on November 06, 2009, 08:17:13 AM
I have said this before, but I am going to say it again. My husband drove from Severy to Wichita every day to work a job that paid good and still raise our kids in a better community and school. He did this for 25 years until the children were grown and he didn't have 400 to drive on. He drove the old 96 with it's hills and curves. To me, not living in Elk County because of the lack of good paying jobs doesn't float. Wichita is one hour and ten minutes from Howard. Emporia is about the same. Winfield and Independence, about 45 minutes. I know the cost of gasoline is prohibitive now, but back then, the wages weren't so good either. And there is this thing called car pooling. My husband was very seldom alone on his trip to work. Mostly the car was full. That was our choice so that our kids could live the life of a small community.
But gas is 3 times higher now. My husband did work in Wichita for awhile when we first moved out here and I'll tell you, almost half of his paycheck was eaten up in gas driving back and forth. Not everyone can get a $40 an hour job at Boeing or Cessna.
Quote from: Wilma on November 06, 2009, 08:17:13 AM
I have said this before, but I am going to say it again. My husband drove from Severy to Wichita every day to work a job that paid good and still raise our kids in a better community and school. He did this for 25 years until the children were grown and he didn't have 400 to drive on. He drove the old 96 with it's hills and curves. To me, not living in Elk County because of the lack of good paying jobs doesn't float. Wichita is one hour and ten minutes from Howard. Emporia is about the same. Winfield and Independence, about 45 minutes. I know the cost of gasoline is prohibitive now, but back then, the wages weren't so good either. And there is this thing called car pooling. My husband was very seldom alone on his trip to work. Mostly the car was full. That was our choice so that our kids could live the life of a small community.
Wilma,
I admire the gumption that you and yours have/had to make the sacrifice of the commute. But that does not change the real possibility that some economic growth here in the county might be a good thing. How many more of our kids might choose to stay IF they could find work here? And the commute is a choice. Not all are going to make that choice. Why can't we look at giving people the opportunity to make it?
On a similar note, I've heard rumors for years that 'some folks don't want new business in the county cuz they don't want the change'. Well, that's just sad. While I really don't want to see Elk become some kind of metropolis, I do think that without some kind of growth what we'll see is a continuation of the trends of the last 60 years... shrinking population of ALL ages. Perhaps when there are only 10 folks left living out here then the job growth naysayers will be happy. (Darn, *that* was an emotional rant, wasn't it?)
Quote from: Patriot on November 06, 2009, 08:20:39 AM
srkruzich,
Not sure, but I'm guessin that waiting on the windfarms may be like waiting on the lottery. That process is only one possibility. But, yes it was supposed to bring in some serous bucks. Not sure what the 'latest' number is, but I'm also not sure if that would benefit he schools.
Well quite frankly, if it did bring in some serious bucks, the wisest use of that money would be first to build water lines and bring water in. That will in turn bring industry. No business will locate here without the basic infrastructure that will support it. We need to be planning for the future in that regards as Like i posted cap n trade if passed will essentially destroy commuting to wichita, independance or any other larger town.
The industry will most likely need to be near moline since railway will be the way to move product.
Once you get industry here, through enticing them into the area with infrastructure, low taxes, qualified workforce, the county can build from there and provide the school they want, and other resources.
Might even attract a walmart you know and the sales tax generated by that would keep the tax in the county instead of in other counties that have a walmart.
Quote from: Sarah on November 06, 2009, 08:23:52 AM
Quote from: Wilma on November 06, 2009, 08:17:13 AM
I have said this before, but I am going to say it again. My husband drove from Severy to Wichita every day to work a job that paid good and still raise our kids in a better community and school. He did this for 25 years until the children were grown and he didn't have 400 to drive on. He drove the old 96 with it's hills and curves. To me, not living in Elk County because of the lack of good paying jobs doesn't float. Wichita is one hour and ten minutes from Howard. Emporia is about the same. Winfield and Independence, about 45 minutes. I know the cost of gasoline is prohibitive now, but back then, the wages weren't so good either. And there is this thing called car pooling. My husband was very seldom alone on his trip to work. Mostly the car was full. That was our choice so that our kids could live the life of a small community.
But gas is 3 times higher now. My husband did work in Wichita for awhile when we first moved out here and I'll tell you, almost half of his paycheck was eaten up in gas driving back and forth. Not everyone can get a $40 an hour job at Boeing or Cessna.
Sarah:
BINGO! And in this economy even getting a $15 an hour job is getting tough.
I hate Walmart!! LOL!! Really, it's not fun to take 3 kids with you shopping, which I usually do, and go into that place and come out without a head. No thank you on a Walmart, my opinion, but I will take Family Market anyday!!
I don't necessarily like walmart either but a wally world right here in elk or near elk would provide a LOT of jobs.
Quote from: srkruzich on November 06, 2009, 09:20:08 AM
I don't necessarily like walmart either but a wally world right here in elk or near elk would provide a LOT of jobs.
I vote for south of Severy (right inside Elk County) or just east of Longton. Inside Elk Co, we get some sales tax revenue....
But, alas, with the population base here, methinks we need not worry about a WallyWorld. Hey.... maybe an Alco! lol
I don't think you have enough population to support another Walmart. They really do their homework. We have only two and New Castle County has 510,000 people.
Quote from: Varmit on November 06, 2009, 07:08:33 AM
Heres a solution to the school issue. If the citizens that voted yes to a bond and a new school want one, then why don't they get together and build one? They can offer whatever classes they want, hire the teachers they want, have whatever programs they want, etc. That way, they get their new school, the "no" voters get what they want, its a win-win situation.
Wow.... At that point would the citizens that voted yes be able to deny access to kids whose parents found it necessary to cast a no vote??? I would assume that most everyone viewing this forum went to a public school that was not funded solely by a small group of people....
Everyone has opinions and is very entitled to such. Everyone has ideas and EVERYONE wants a solution. This is a very emotional issue and people inherently want what is best for their children, community, and family. That may come in the way of a great education, or fear of losing your town, or fear of taking food off the table because of a tax burden.
We cannot lose sight of the big picture that this vote was just that.... A vote. All it has done is close the door on a solution. We still have the problem however, and a solution must be found. I hope that the board meeting on the 9th will be well attended and we can move in a positive direction for the future of our school district and communities as a whole group.
How about "classroom buses" that go to where the kids are? Don't laugh!Think about it.
Quote from: DanCookson on November 06, 2009, 10:36:08 AM
Quote from: Varmit on November 06, 2009, 07:08:33 AM
Heres a solution to the school issue. If the citizens that voted yes to a bond and a new school want one, then why don't they get together and build one? They can offer whatever classes they want, hire the teachers they want, have whatever programs they want, etc. That way, they get their new school, the "no" voters get what they want, its a win-win situation.
You know i for one wasn't supported by taxpayers in school. My parents took their responsibility for educating me seriously and paid for it themselves. I paid for MY college education myself. So I am a strong proponent of schooling being covered by those who choose to have kids. I personally don't have a obligation to pay for another persons kids schooling since neither I nor my kids partook of government education.
QuoteWow.... At that point would the citizens that voted yes be able to deny access to kids whose parents found it necessary to cast a no vote??? I would assume that most everyone viewing this forum went to a public school that was not funded solely by a small group of people....
First of all, the county is facing the exact same things that private schools face. Small student population, limited budget yet the private schools do produce highly educated students. Most students in private schools enter the 9th grade being able to do college level work. Thats far above any Government school out there. So all the bells and whistles programs that aren't necessary are'nt what makes educated students. When i went to school, you learned because that was your job. You didn't have to be enticed with anything. either you did it or got your butt busted when you brought home bad grades. Not saying that the bells and whistles aren't nice, just not necessary.
Deny access if they don't want to foot the bill. Actually the idea isn't bad. Don't you have to shell out bucks to get a college education? Personally I have seen so many kids through the years piss off their education because its free to them. IF they had to pay for it or earn it, then it would mean a whole lot more to them. I had some bozo tell me one time that it was my duty and obligation to fund my kids college education and I asked him why? He said its the way its done. I responded to him that if i fund their education, the only incentive that gives them is that they can live off of daddys money and party til the cows come home in the college dorms. But if i tell them there is no money, that you have to work a job and have to get grants, and earn your degree, then they will be too busy working hard to get the money and if their having to spend the money they gave up time in their life to earn to pay for that education, they will appreciate it more and make damn sure they get good grades.
One of my boys has 8 years in the Marine Corp and has earned 80,000 dollars for college. Guess what. He gave up 8 years of his life, fought in several battles of this war, faced death untold number of times. You know good and well he's going to be utilizing that money for the best education he can get and he's going to make darn sure he gets the best grades too.
The message that was sent by the voters this time is, that there comes a time when you have to cut something in order to get the job done. Businesses do it all the time. Company i worked for cut their contributions of 1.25 per 1.00 put into 401k down to .50 per 1.00 put in just to keep jobs. It was nice while it lasted but it did not affect the product being produced.
We are fixing to see some serious hard times with this current administration spending us into oblivion. There is going to be hyperinflation hit us in the near future, and if this administration succeeds in taxing everything from heating to fuel to food production to the air we breath, your going to find that there isn't going to be anything left for schools.
srkruzich, I don't get your meaning. Are you just trying to get us to read these a second time? maybe you think we just skipped over them when they were posted. ??? ??? ??? ::)
Well said Dan!!
Quote from: flo on November 06, 2009, 12:15:20 PM
srkruzich, I don't get your meaning. Are you just trying to get us to read these a second time? maybe you think we just skipped over them when they were posted. ??? ??? ??? ::)
I think the quote tags are messed up. I had the same problem when quoting earlier. For some reason it threw in the beginning quote tag twice making the entire message a quote (though, maybe I just messed that up.. can't remember :D). His reply is actually in that whole quote, just have to read through to find it. I believe his actual replies were (please correct me if I'm wrong):
QuoteYou know i for one wasn't supported by taxpayers in school. My parents took their responsibility for educating me seriously and paid for it themselves. I paid for MY college education myself. So I am a strong proponent of schooling being covered by those who choose to have kids. I personally don't have a obligation to pay for another persons kids schooling since neither I nor my kids partook of government education.
QuoteFirst of all, the county is facing the exact same things that private schools face. Small student population, limited budget yet the private schools do produce highly educated students. Most students in private schools enter the 9th grade being able to do college level work. Thats far above any Government school out there. So all the bells and whistles programs that aren't necessary are'nt what makes educated students. When i went to school, you learned because that was your job. You didn't have to be enticed with anything. either you did it or got your butt busted when you brought home bad grades. Not saying that the bells and whistles aren't nice, just not necessary.
Deny access if they don't want to foot the bill. Actually the idea isn't bad. Don't you have to shell out bucks to get a college education? Personally I have seen so many kids through the years piss off their education because its free to them. IF they had to pay for it or earn it, then it would mean a whole lot more to them. I had some bozo tell me one time that it was my duty and obligation to fund my kids college education and I asked him why? He said its the way its done. I responded to him that if i fund their education, the only incentive that gives them is that they can live off of daddys money and party til the cows come home in the college dorms. But if i tell them there is no money, that you have to work a job and have to get grants, and earn your degree, then they will be too busy working hard to get the money and if their having to spend the money they gave up time in their life to earn to pay for that education, they will appreciate it more and make damn sure they get good grades.
One of my boys has 8 years in the Marine Corp and has earned 80,000 dollars for college. Guess what. He gave up 8 years of his life, fought in several battles of this war, faced death untold number of times. You know good and well he's going to be utilizing that money for the best education he can get and he's going to make darn sure he gets the best grades too.
The message that was sent by the voters this time is, that there comes a time when you have to cut something in order to get the job done. Businesses do it all the time. Company i worked for cut their contributions of 1.25 per 1.00 put into 401k down to .50 per 1.00 put in just to keep jobs. It was nice while it lasted but it did not affect the product being produced.
We are fixing to see some serious hard times with this current administration spending us into oblivion. There is going to be hyperinflation hit us in the near future, and if this administration succeeds in taxing everything from heating to fuel to food production to the air we breath, your going to find that there isn't going to be anything left for schools.
So the Marine will go to college on MY tax dollars. Nobody asked my opinion about that! If I don't approve of the war he is fighting, shouldn't I protest my money going to him because I don't approve? Sounds socialist to me. (I'm just poking, I'm all for it, and grants ( Pell and otherwise) and school ( again, this is just for the sake of argument and means nothing. But it's the same kind of logic I see here sometimes.)
Quote from: DanCookson on November 06, 2009, 10:36:08 AM
Wow.... At that point would the citizens that voted yes be able to deny access to kids whose parents found it necessary to cast a no vote??? I would assume that most everyone viewing this forum went to a public school that was not funded solely by a small group of people....
Everyone has opinions and is very entitled to such. Everyone has ideas and EVERYONE wants a solution. We cannot lose sight of the big picture that this vote was just that.... A vote.
To answer your question, absolutely, the "Yes" folks could deny access to kids whose parents didn't want to pay. In essence, the school built by the Yes folks would be a private school. You can't send your kids to a private school if you don't pay. The No folks would still send their kids to the public schools we have now. And I think that the Yes crowd should recieve a tax cut of sorts if their kids were in attendence at a school they funded.
Earlier, someone posted something to the effect that no solutions were being presented here, well, I just did.
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 06, 2009, 12:48:58 PM
So the Marine will go to college on MY tax dollars. Nobody asked my opinion about that! If I don't approve of the war he is fighting, shouldn't I protest my money going to him because I don't approve? Sounds socialist to me. (I'm just poking, I'm all for it, and grants ( Pell and otherwise) and school ( again, this is just for the sake of argument and means nothing. But it's the same kind of logic I see here sometimes.)
Well you know what, it could be argued that but he works for his money. The govt hired him to do a job and this is what he earned. Secondly, the military is ONE expenditure the government is responsible for constitutionally and taxs collected for that expenditure is constitutional. and Third, whether or not we are in a war doesn't matter as we still need guys like him to make sure we don't have a war on our soil!
ITs not about taxes in general its all about sucking more and more tax dollars to fund government to be a nanny government. Imagine the prosperity and wealth that could be had by all if we didn't have to support such a behemouth that our government has become.
Varmit, you're on the right track for sure.
Diane, thev veterans' pensions began with the veterans of the Revolutionary War.
Nothing wrong about that. It's all these other people that should not be drawing from
the Fed's.
in other words, who it is that's drawing the tax dollars makes a difference, huh? Sounds like a double standard to me. srk, you may have paid for your tuition and books, but who paid to keep that college open for you to attend?????????
Double standard to what?
You sound like you are supportive for Federal funds & entitlements to others besides veterans?
Well, I sort of em
Quote from: redcliffsw on November 06, 2009, 02:29:29 PM
Double standard to what?
You sound like you are supportive for Federal funds & entitlements to others besides veterans?
My dad was a veteran and I should have gotten some thing, but didn't. My mother didn't even get his retirement and they were legally married. It's cause he wasn't married at the time, and never changed it. I think that they government does alot of things that we think are wrong.
by double standard, i meant srkruzich didn't think that education needed to by "bought" with government money, after all he paid for his own, but it is okay for his son to take government money to pay for an education. Yes, he is in the service of his country, but it's still government money. He is saving all his money for his education, but who is paying for his keep while he's serving his country? That's what that money is for. I am very proud of every American who serves and I thank hiim for that and I don't begrudge him anything he is paid. I also do not begrudge an American who has a brain and wants to use it for higher education, to apply for any government money he is entitled to. He just might not have the funds to p, and the costs of a higher education is a lot more as each year passes and jobs are a lot less plentiful as each year passes.
Quote from: flo on November 06, 2009, 02:20:41 PM
in other words, who it is that's drawing the tax dollars makes a difference, huh? Sounds like a double standard to me. srk, you may have paid for your tuition and books, but who paid to keep that college open for you to attend?????????
My tuition and taxes.
Quote from: okiemon on November 06, 2009, 06:34:15 AM
If they move the school to Howard my kids will have to ride the bus for an hour. Should I have voted yes or no?
What time does the elementary school day stop now? I can't make my employees work from 7:30 to 5 five days a week legally without paying them overtime but my kids are at school longer than a normal business day. Have you heard one word about the safety of my children driving on the highways everyday? Why is driving north any different than driving south? How is it better one way than the other? My kids get home at almost 5. They are not on a rural route. They would have to get on the but at 6:15 or 6:30 now. We drop them off at the High school to catch the bus by 7:30. Who cares how you voted? I assume you are don't live close to the high school. Do you plan on your kids stopping their education at 6th grade? If not to stay in this school system they will have to ride a bus to school. With or without a different facility that will not change. If you are going to allow them to drive to school then that blows your entire saving money because of the down economy rant.
Quote from: flo on November 06, 2009, 07:26:37 PM
by double standard, i meant srkruzich didn't think that education needed to by "bought" with government money, after all he paid for his own, but it is okay for his son to take government money to pay for an education.
Excuse me he doesn't take,he earned it. There is a difference between taking money without preforming a service like Pell grants, and other government giveaways and actually working for that money.
Sorry you can't even compare the two.
QuoteYes, he is in the service of his country, but it's still government money.
No its a paycheck not a entitlement.
QuoteHe is saving all his money for his education, but who is paying for his keep while he's serving his country?
Again, the military is a constitutional function of government, and they are employers in that constitutional function.
QuoteThat's what that money is for. I am very proud of every American who serves and I thank hiim for that and I don't begrudge him anything he is paid. I also do not begrudge an American who has a brain and wants to use it for higher education, to apply for any government money he is entitled to.
Again he is NOT entitled to anything, he Works for his money.
There is a difference
Quote from: srkruzich on November 06, 2009, 08:16:40 AM
Got a question wasn't there supposed to be a nice windfall from the windfarms being built in elk county? Shoot you could fund not only the school but actually bring in water into the county to attract more industry.
Why are you for wind farms and water lines if you want smaller less intrusive government. Who do you think is funding these proposed projects? Why is government bad if it helps your neighbor but the best thing on earth if it helps you and yours? You have stated thousands of time the big govt is the root of all evil yet the two things in this one single sentence that you are promoting are funded entirely by government or only financially viable by government subsidies and tax abatement's.
I am for smaller government by eliminating the wasteful spending of local, state, and federal dollars in keeping three schools open when two would serve the purpose more efficiently and without degrading student achievement. Why is a teacher part of an indoctrination government
giveaway but a US soldier
works for the exact same green back/direct deposit from the exact same treasury? Government funding is government funding. If you get a vision card. You are tax supported. If you kid goes to public school you are tax supported. If you wear a uniform you are tax supported. If you drive on county roads you are tax supported.
I am for wind farms because even though the government subsidy is the only reason we are seeing growth in the sector, I believe it is the biggest green power booster for rural Kansas. It works better than solar here as we have more wind than sun. It is centrally located and wide open. There is no other industry that has even offered to come to our area besides solid waste and the same no contention voted that down in the same area of the county years ago choosing a blighted rock quarry over a potential gold mine. .
Why didn't the existing water district in the southern part of the county or the existing water district in the northern part of the county expand the water lines to the middle? Because of the cost of doing so. Lack of communication between the world of the south and the world of the north has many bad outcomes over their storied history. Get over it. It was the lack for foresight on the water plans of the past that did not overbuild the systems to accommodate all the potential customers of the area. It was more us and them. We have water lines down here and you don't. Why do we have to reinvent the wheel to provide the same services to all areas of the community? Which is exactly what you are proposing to do with the school system. You are trying to nickle and dime a project that if you would look out side your own world would find that is better for everyone.
Why on earth would we want an elitist private school in elk county? That would really be a conflict with your new Wal-Mart. You can't even buy caviar in wallyworld.
By the way this is brilliant. Put a W at each of the existing grade schools. The economy will create itself. This one is really the best brainstorm you have had yet. As if this demographic is more than a blip on the parking lot painters cost overruns for a new wallymart. Send 75% of the non existing labor force to work for 8.50 an hour. Keep nurturing the China trade deficit. Kill all other local businesses. Lowest price at what cost ? You keep shopping there and we will all speak Chinese. You preach anti-socialist attitudes yet you all serve the kool-aid from wally dixie cups. Send any and all profits not to Elk County, or even Kansas but to line the coffers of Bentonville, AK. I think the only one this would benefit would be an Arkansas resident like flint so his property taxes would go down..
That wall e philosophy explains the cheap at any cost attitude you seem to project.
One robot one world.
I hope you have an Eve. Otherwise it will be lonely at the top of the refuse you are spewing.
Recycle Reduce Reuse
"verbosity." Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary. 2009.
Main Entry: ver·bose
Pronunciation: \(ˌ)vər-ˈbōs\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin verbosus, from verbum
Date: 1672
1 : containing more words than necessary : wordy <a verbose reply>; also : impaired by wordiness <a verbose style>
2 : given to wordiness <a verbose orator>
synonyms see wordy
— ver·bose·ly adverb
— ver·bose·ness noun
— ver·bos·i·ty \-ˈbä-sə-tē\ noun
ignorant
ig⋅no⋅rant /ˈɪgnərənt/ [ig-ner-uhnt]
–adjective
1. lacking in knowledge or training; unlearned: an ignorant man.
2. lacking knowledge or information as to a particular subject or fact: ignorant of quantum physics.
3. uninformed; unaware.
4. due to or showing lack of knowledge or training: an ignorant statement
Some words speak volumes.
Nice. Unsupported by fact, but nice.
Quote from: Patriot on November 06, 2009, 10:06:40 PM
Nice. Unsupported by fact, but nice.
You have proven my assumption by your own words...........These are your words:
Not sure, but I'm guessin that waiting on the windfarms may be like waiting on the lottery. That process is only one possibility. But, yes it was supposed to bring in some serous bucks. Not sure what the 'latest' number is, but I'm also not sure if that would benefit he schools.
Ya added tax money is always bad for the entire county.
If we don't, then all the bond issues will do is provide nice schools for folks who can't afford to live out here
You obviously don't know the net worth of anyone here.Goodby, and Good Riddance."? Well, one can hope I suppose.
Ok I agree with this one.Did you ever notice when liberals get frustrated they start tossing out invectives like candy? I suppose the left has some 'rules' that preclude such innovative solutions as 'self help' to fix the roof. And just think, they call the right the party of 'No'. ????
Outstanding perspective! Self reliance (both on the personal and community levels) need to make a comeback. If I'm not mistaken, that's how the park behind Twilight Manor in Howard got done. And a find product it appears to be!
Really not the grant that was awarded to fund the concrete.I have no problem with a 'civic responsibility' for all citizens to help promote and finance the education of our children, but there are limits to everything. I keep seeing how this school district has been struggling with these issues for years to no avail. That seems to be a case of poor management somewhere along the path. Perhaps these 'hard' decisions should have been made in better times, no? We just changed management. How can you tell if it is bad?
I also see that this district (the one with a shrinking enrollment) has placed a high enough priority on extra curricular sports activities that they keep the district in leagues that require students be bussed for hours on end to attend games at the far end of the state. I have to wonder if money might be well spent to pay an outside efficiency/management expert to evaluate the entire operation and determine where cost savings could be found, if any. W.E. already did that.
It's really easy to spend OPM (Other Peoples Money)... it takes a tough makeup to spend it wisely and with frugality. my money is my money.
But, I could be wrong. You said it there!
Now that the 5.5 million dollar 'Plan A' has failed, does anybody want to prognosticate what the unpublished, undiscussed 'Plan B' will entail and how much it will cost? How do you put a price tag on stupidity?
Let the screaming begin!
<passing out cheese to go with the whine>
I don't think you really understand.
sheesh, i thought the politics forum was heated.
ADP makes a lot of good points. Especially about Walmart. Its not a solution, its a big problem. And its funny to see a "conservative" backing a company that sends so much of our american dollars over to China.
The busing issue was for angie but, since you asked
[/quote] Have you heard one word about the safety of my children driving on the highways everyday? Why is driving north any different than driving south? How is it better one way than the other?
[/quote]
I never said anything about the safety of my children while on the bus. As a matter of fact I don't recall even hearing about anybody being injured on one of our buses.
If they move the grade school to Howard everybody but the Howard kids will spend hours on the bus. My high school daughter gets on the bus at 6:35 and gets back home at 5. Let call that 2 hours a day though its closer to 3. My granddaughter will start school soon and if she has to go to Howard kindergarten though 12th grade she will spend 6.5 months on the bus. Why shouldn't Howard kids share that burden?
[/quote] Do you plan on your kids stopping their education at 6th grade? If not to stay in this school system they will have to ride a bus to school. With or without a different facility that will not change.
[/quote]
They will have to ride the bus but, 6 miles to Moline doesn't take as long as the 12 miles to Howard.
Quote from: okiemon on November 06, 2009, 11:59:32 PM
If they move the grade school to Howard everybody but the Howard kids will spend hours on the bus. My high school daughter gets on the bus at 6:35 and gets back home at 5. Let call that 2 hours a day though its closer to 3. My granddaughter will start school soon and if she has to go to Howard kindergarten though 12th grade she will spend 6.5 months on the bus. Why shouldn't Howard kids share that burden?
Howard kids have been taking the same bus ride I am asking your kid to ride to school for 37 years. I fail to see your point. What burden? If it is a burden we are bearing it currently.
They will have to ride the bus but, 6 miles to Moline doesn't take as long as the 12 miles to Howard.
The potential to have an accident on a school bus in greater with every mile they are on it. We have a very good tract record.
With one campus you would not have multiple routes and cross busing. You would get on the bus and go to school. Not stopping in Moline to pick up Moline kids then going to Severy. You would not stop in Severy to pick up Severy kids then go to Moline. You would pick up the route from the farthest away from the school to the school. Period. Your kid at the 12 miles away could possibly be at school in 25-30 minutes. If you look at the logistics it would shorten all busing mileage. From any point in the district the center of the it is not Moline or Severy. How could it cause your child to be on the bus longer than anyone else if you put the thing in the center?
"They will have to ride the bus but, 6 miles to Moline doesn't take as long as the 12 miles to Howard." What we are currently doing is very very wasteful. Driving two different directions with buses meeting in the middle only to cross and go to the opposite end of the county is not productive. One campus will shorten both Moline and Severy elementary students bus trips compared to how long they are riding on the bus currently. A child in rural Moline will be on the bus less time the entire 13 years of schooling with one campus. A child in rural Severy will be on the bus less time for the entire 13 years of schooling with one campus.
I currently have a child in every school. They all seem happy about the length of the bus ride so why would this change in the future. They are on the bus longer now than if we have a central facility. One facility is cheaper to operate than two. One centrally located facility will save money.
Quote from: Anmar on November 06, 2009, 11:44:51 PM
sheesh, i thought the politics forum was heated.
ADP makes a lot of good points. Especially about Walmart. Its not a solution, its a big problem. And its funny to see a "conservative" backing a company that sends so much of our american dollars over to China.
My use of walmart was an example of a tax revenue source. People in elk, greenwood, go to walmart. THey drive right now 40 miles to the one in Augusta or el dorado and i suppose independence has one also.
The tax money is leaving the counties and being spent in other counties.
Its simple as that.
Howard kids have been taking the same bus ride I am asking your kid to ride to school for 37 years. I fail to see your point. What burden? If it is a burden we are bearing it currently.
Moilne and Severy kids have done the same for 37 years. With a school in Howard the Howard kids will no longer have that long bus ride.
The potential to have an accident on a school bus in greater with every mile they are on it. So why should my kids have to take all the risk?
Your kid at the 12 miles away could possibly be at school in 25-30 minutes.
I don't think the buses go any farther east then our house. If she picks up very many kids after mine, she will never make it to Howard in less than an hour.
I thought some Howard kids ride the school bus. Is that not correct?
Howard grade school kids have been riding a school bus to Severy or Moline since the very early 70's. Severy and Moline high school kids have been riding the bus (if they don't get to drive a car) to Howard for the same length of time. I thought it was about time that someone brought up that what Severy and Moline kids might be asked to do is only what Howard kids have been doing for so long. Whose turn do you think it is now?
Quote from: okiemon on November 06, 2009, 11:59:32 PM
I never said anything about the safety of my children while on the bus. As a matter of fact I don't recall even hearing about anybody being injured on one of our buses.
If they move the grade school to Howard everybody but the Howard kids will spend hours on the bus. My high school daughter gets on the bus at 6:35 and gets back home at 5. Let call that 2 hours a day though its closer to 3. My granddaughter will start school soon and if she has to go to Howard kindergarten though 12th grade she will spend 6.5 months on the bus. Why shouldn't Howard kids share that burden?
Quote
Why should Howard kids have to share that Burden? It's not our fault where we live at, and it's definitely not your fault either! But honestly, what do the bus ride have to do with the kids? Are they getting to school and getting an education. I would sure hope so. I honestly think that is what we should we worrying about: Are the kids getting an education? And for FYI: yes, I ride the bus every day! ::)
QuoteAre they getting to school and getting an education. I would sure hope so. I honestly think that is what we should we worrying about: Are the kids getting an education?
You go, girl! :D
Thanks Heather!
OK, People...I leave the Forum for one week...Due to heavy needs at the school...And this is what I walk back into...I can see it was the wrong week to be gone.
First of all...Clean up the language. I've read through this now, twice, top to bottom. Blue language is not appropriate, under any circumstances. If I see any more, I'll notify Teresa that we have a need to block persons from being on here. This is indeed a family site and should be treated as such.
Secondly...Stick to the topic at hand. If I were to selectively delete posts that weren't related to this topic, we've have 9 pages of posts instead of the present 20.
Thirdly...And I say this, having dedicated many years to the public in Elk County and having paid taxes in Elk County and having had children in the Elk County public schools...The vote was cast. Get over it. You've got a long, arduous road ahead of you, now that you've made the choice to not build a central building in Howard. I would predict, probably with some accuracy, that you've just voted in a situation where you're going to have to deal with the RIFing of teachers (Reduction in Force...Doesn't matter if the teacher is tenured...If the position is deleted, out goes the teacher, regardless) and related staff. Instead of creating jobs, you've just taken action to reduce not only the level of the work force but to reduce the resulting taxes that were taken from their paychecks...And believe me...That amount is considerable. You are all in for a hard road ahead...And it will only be made harder by those of you who choose to argue incessantly rather than shut up and do the hard work needed to keep things moving ahead.
Lastly...Play nice, please?
Catwoman
Welcome back, Cat--------------------missed you.
Larryj
Hey, Larry... ;D...Things at school are rolling into high gear...It's that time of year...Very little discretionary time left in the day. I've missed being here, too...And getting to read your "wry" comments. ;D
Quote from: Wilma on November 07, 2009, 08:12:08 AM
Howard grade school kids have been riding a school bus to Severy or Moline since the very early 70's. Severy and Moline high school kids have been riding the bus (if they don't get to drive a car) to Howard for the same length of time. I thought it was about time that someone brought up that what Severy and Moline kids might be asked to do is only what Howard kids have been doing for so long. Whose turn do you think it is now?
huh? Did you not just post we each spend equal time on bus? If we move the grade school to Howard how much time will the Howard kids spend on the bus compared with everybody else?
Where did I post that we spend equal time on the bus. And yes, Howard kids have been doing since the very early 70's what the Moline and Severy kids would be asked to do if the grade school were located in Howard. What about that do you not understand?
I don't remember just what year it was, but I know it was close to 1972 that Severy high school kids were moved to Howard. Howard junior high was bussed to Severy. Howard grade school kids were bussed to either Moline or Severy. This past year Moline kids up to the mid grades are bussed to Severy and Severy grade school from mid grades to junior high are bussed to Moline. Doesn't it make sense to centralize the grade school? Should Severy have to go to Moline or Moline to Severy?
That is about 12 miles too much bussing twice a day. Is it asking too much that what Howard kids have done for 30 some years be shared by the other communities?
After reading this discussion I have to wonder what the children are being taught outside of school. I understand as much as anyone what an emotional subject this is, but being for it... or against it... I have to wonder what will happen to the children being exposed to the attitudes from both sides. How many will carry these ideals to school, and into their groups of peers? How many will bicker, argue, with their friends because their families are "for it" or "against it"? ???
I sincerely hope that all who are so emotionally wrapped up in this that they see fit to write some of the nasty posts aren't teaching their children by example (that is the fastest way the pick things up in my experience!) It would be a shame to drive wedges between children over matters they have no control over. :-[
This is all supposed to be for the kids! Maybe we could all take a deep breath and portray an acceptable example for the younger ones who are watching and learning. (They ARE listening, watching and learning!) I know of several older students who actually read this forum!
No matter what side of the issue we are on... we MUST set a positive example until this matter is resolved. I truly don't believe that mud slinging will help anyone's cause no matter what your views are.... My grandad always said "you catch more flies with sugar then vinegar"........... If you're trying to change the opinion of others those might be good words to consider........
Nothing wrong with teaching the kids how to stand up for a cause..... Let's just do it in a positive respectable manner!! :)
Agreed! ;)
Quote from: Wilma on November 07, 2009, 01:50:01 PM
Where did I post that we spend equal time on the bus. And yes, Howard kids have been doing since the very early 70's what the Moline and Severy kids would be asked to do if the grade school were located in Howard. What about that do you not understand?
Y'all have about got me convinced that I don't know what I'm talking about.
A Moline child stays in Moline for grades kindergarten through 6th grade(7 years) then he buses to Howard for grades 7 though 12(6 years).
A Howard child buses to Moline or Severy for grades kindergarten though 6th grade(7 years) then stays in Howard for grades 7 though 12(6 years).
Howard kids bus for 7 years
Moline kids bus for 6 years
Put the grade school in Howard
Howard kids stay in Howard for 13 years
Moline kids bus for 13 years
Agreed! :D
Agreed! :D
We should just leave it the way it is.
I was just wondering how you feel about Moline students being bussed from Moline to Severy, if Moline were to be closed? Just curious, not trying to start anything.
Actually that is happening right now. Grenola, Elk Falls, Belknap, and Moline 1st, 2nd, and 3rd graders are bussed to Severy. While Severy, Fall River, and Piedmont 4th, 5th, and 6th graders are bussed to Moline.
Yes, that is what is happening now. I was talking about how many years students from Howard have been bussed, not just the years each student is bussed. The first students to be bussed are almost old enough to be grandparents now and if it continues like this, their grandchildren will be bussed as they were. I just feel that the people in Howard have had their children bussed to another town while the people in Moline and Severy have not. Isn't it time to change this? A centralized grade school would be the least amount of bussing. Granted the Moline and Severy children would still be bussed, but wouldn't it be better for them to be bussed to Howard than some Moline children to Severy and some Severy children to Moline?
I just wish this West Elk community could stop worrying about Howard vs. Moline vs. Severy. Let's stand united! Let's work for what is best for ALL the kids!!!!!!
My point was Howard kids are bussed to and from the school in Howard.
Quote from: Wilma on November 07, 2009, 06:38:51 PM
Yes, that is what is happening now. I was talking about how many years students from Howard have been bussed, not just the years each student is bussed. The first students to be bussed are almost old enough to be grandparents now and if it continues like this, their grandchildren will be bussed as they were. I just feel that the people in Howard have had their children bussed to another town while the people in Moline and Severy have not. Isn't it time to change this? A centralized grade school would be the least amount of bussing. Granted the Moline and Severy children would still be bussed, but wouldn't it be better for them to be bussed to Howard than some Moline children to Severy and some Severy children to Moline?
I moved to Moline in the fall of 1978, my senior year. Had to ride the bus to Howard everyday.
I don't know if this is correct or not but, haven't Moline 7th though 12th grade kids been bused to Howard for as long as Howard kids have been bused to Moline?
Not to change the subject, but, is the school district obligated to provide transportation for the students to and from school? I can remember a time when there were no school buses.
What I don't understand is what the past has to do with the issues we face now. What has happened over the past thirty-some years will not continue. We have to accept that and move on to decide what will be best for students now. There is no even trade off. No one is going to get exactly what they want. I don't know if one or both grade schools will be closed, but whatever happens we need to be positive about it and do what is best for our kids.
Quote from: gina on November 07, 2009, 08:07:58 PM
There is no even trade off. No one is going to get exactly what they want. I don't know if one or both grade schools will be closed, but whatever happens we need to be positive about it and do what is best for our kids.
Good attitude gina... :)
Quote from: Wilma on November 07, 2009, 07:50:15 PM
Not to change the subject, but, is the school district obligated to provide transportation for the students to and from school? I can remember a time when there were no school buses.
Certain students are provided with busing by law. Prek and Kindergarten must be pickup up. I think students with special needs must be provided with appropriate transportation. Any one over 2.5miles from the school building. We also must have a bus large enough to carry every student that is on the route whether or not they ride that day or not. That is why you see half full buses.
We get funding for transportation from the state and fed. We own the buses. We spend capital to purchase them that could be spent on other programs. Do we really need to? We just spent 150k to replace three out of date units. We paid for them up front but that investment has a $7500 dollar a year principal cost. But what is the opportunity cost of that funding? What else could we have used it for? We got rid of three, down sized to two smaller busses, and now we have another 20 years to drive the new ones. You can't drive a school bus after it is twenty years old. But how old is the rest of the fleet? What is the current value of the bus fleet? If it is funded by the mile should we be purchasing it by the mile? What does it cost to operate? Would a bus service provide the same service for more or less money?
Thank you, PEP. So we are required to provide transportation to all the students. Very few of them live within that 2.5 miles. So bussing isn't something that could be cut. Better just get used to the fact that the students are going to be riding a bus.
Next question. Are there regulations as to how long or how far a student has to ride a bus?
I have a question, (hope someone answers it). Does the school bus pick up children in the city limits of Howard to be taken to the high school?
Jane
I know that this is a serious matter for all of you and I can appreciate that seriousness. As you know, I like to see humor in all things, so don't be offended by my offering the following:
Another quote from Mr. Bill Cosby.
When talking to his children about attending school, he said: "I had to walk to school in the snow, barefoot, uphill, both ways!"
Larryj
Jane
At enrollment this year I was told that you must live over 6 blocks from the school unless you have a kindergartener or preschooler. If they stop to pick up one of these younger students, siblings of those students may also ride that bus... but other children from the neighborhood could not board the bus.
Hope I got this straight, and it answers your question..... :)
Quote from: Jane on November 08, 2009, 07:26:32 PM
I have a question, (hope someone answers it). Does the school bus pick up children in the city limits of Howard to be taken to the high school?
Jane
Yes. I have seen two buses leaving the highschool to go the gradeschools in the morning but I assume that if the students aren't walking, driving themselves, or being driven to school, they ride the bus. There are students that live in Howard. They don't have a hugh truency rate at WEST ELK. I have seen kids walking along the highway and along Elk street towards the school but maybe they just overslept. I don't live in Howard so I don't have a clue how the Howard students get to school.
http://www.kake.com/home/headlines/69699502.html
Quote from: jprxmkt on November 11, 2009, 09:07:01 AM
http://www.kake.com/home/headlines/69699502.html
Interwesting... vewwy, vewwy interwesting! I particularly liked the last comment posted on the KAKE webpage:
Quote
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 10, 2009 at 08:57 PM
I think its interesting its being reported both schools are closing when the school board hasn't made any official decision. I wonder who the source for this news story actually was and what agenda they may be pushing?
And anybody who's been about for more than a day or two know that Deb Farris has a long history of liberal slanted reporting. I wonder how this plays with the story yesterday that a large advocacy group in Kansas is planning to sue the state again for more money to the schools (as they did a few years back). When are we gonna recognize that 'mo money' isn't always the answer.
Go back to Ted Kennedy's ploy for years and years.... look how much more money has been thrown at school systems (in the name of education).... and what have we gotten for our money? College graduates who can't tell you what the three brances of government are or how they interact? College entrants who have to take remedial basic math courses to succeed. This is not to say that Elk County has these issues in large numbers. It is to say that, generally speaking, fancy buildings, more bureaucracy, the latest model of student desk and a high tech scan/fax/copier in every administrator's office, and a better insurance/retirement plan for teachers can NOT be equated with a good education!
The tenure system, the lack of ongoing teacher proficiency qualifications/exams, the political/financial self interests of the NEA, and a curriculum driven by pop culture ARE a drag on good education.
I, too, have to wonder who whined to KAKE-TV. Hell, we aren't even in KAKE's primary viewing area!
Interwesting... vewwy, vewwy interwesting!
Quote from: Patriot on November 11, 2009, 10:43:35 AM
Interwesting... vewwy, vewwy interwesting! I particularly liked the last comment posted on the KAKE webpage:
And anybody who's been about for more than a day or two know that Deb Farris has a long history of liberal slanted reporting. I wonder how this plays with the story yesterday that a large advocacy group in Kansas is planning to sue the state again for more money to the schools (as they did a few years back). When are we gonna recognize that 'mo money' isn't always the answer.
Go back to Ted Kennedy's ploy for years and years.... look how much more money has been thrown at school systems (in the name of education).... and what have we gotten for our money? College graduates who can't tell you what the three brances of government are or how they interact? College entrants who have to take remedial basic math courses to succeed. This is not to say that Elk County has these issues in large numbers. It is to say that, generally speaking, fancy buildings, more bureaucracy, the latest model of student desk and a high tech scan/fax/copier in every administrator's office, and a better insurance/retirement plan for teachers can NOT be equated with a good education!
The tenure system, the lack of ongoing teacher proficiency qualifications/exams, the political/financial self interests of the NEA, and a curriculum driven by pop culture ARE a drag on good education.
I, too, have to wonder who whined to KAKE-TV. Hell, we aren't even in KAKE's primary viewing area!
Interwesting... vewwy, vewwy interwesting!
You know, I wondered the same thing as to why KAKE shows such great interest in Elk County lately. You don't see them reporting near as much on other counties as Elk county. Just seems odd to me. shrug But I could be wrong. I also noticed what they said about what the answer was, when from the way I understand it is there has been no definite answer to the problem as yet. Leave it to the news to add facts where there is none and to leave out the ones that are there.
Sarah,
If one follows the Elk County Forum, one knows that the media may not have added facts... they may have been handed misinformation. No wait! Did I just suggest that someone in our community (or worse in the employ of the taxpayers) would engage in a disinformation campaign using the media? Yup, I did. Just sayin.
I do need to state something concerning our current staff, teachers mainly. The West Elk School district is the lowest paid in the state, starting base pay. Ok, I know you were relating to general schools not just WE, but do you know how much a family insurance plan through the school is? And do you know what the board gives each individual towards that family plan? Well, when I was teaching in the district, it cost out of my check, close to 400.00 that is including the 100.00 fringe from the board. That is alot! Especially for a group policy. And only bringing home, the little pay that they do get doesn't help. Do you think that our teachers should really take a cut iin pay? I don't. I know the hours that they put into making sure our students are taught above the call of duty. Not only are they learning the basics, but they are learning things that used to get taught at home. Things such as manners, how to take care of themselves, and the list goes on and on. You don't become a teacher to get rich. You become a teacher because you love teaching students. You love the connection that you and your students have. I for one know that, many teachers pay for things out of pocket. My daughter was in Kindergarten last year. Her teacher cared enough for her students that at their birthdays, she got each of them a present. No, it wasn't a big present, but you know what, those kids loved and respected her, because she showed them that they were important on their special day. Many kids around here come from broken homes, or homes I wouldn't want my dogs to live in. So, I think that the teachers at WE do an outstanding job!! Test scores not only show it, but look at the number of students that are in other activities that are not just sports. We should be proud of our teachers!
I don't see it being one sided. It was told that the plan b was to close the two grade schools no matter what the bond did or didn't do. I don't like the comment an that page that states that Howard is the ones that will benefit. How is that? I mean, aren't we all wanting what is best for our children? No new school or not, something has to be done. I feel that closing the both is much better than closing one and not the other. We already have so much madness about this whole issue, that we me included are not thinking and putting our children first. If closing the two school will help to slow the money problem down, I am all for it. Don't like it, but its a no win situation.
Quote from: angtown3 on November 11, 2009, 12:04:23 PM
I do need to state something concerning our current staff, teachers mainly. The West Elk School district is the lowest paid in the state, starting base pay. Ok, I know you were relating to general schools not just WE, but do you know how much a family insurance plan through the school is? And do you know what the board gives each individual towards that family plan? Well, when I was teaching in the district, it cost out of my check, close to 400.00 that is including the 100.00 fringe from the board. That is alot! Especially for a group policy. And only bringing home, the little pay that they do get doesn't help. Do you think that our teachers should really take a cut iin pay?
...
Thanks for being kind enough to recognize that my comments were not directed at WE in particular. Sometimes conceptual discussions are just that... conceptual and not to be taken personally. Unless of course, the shoe fits.
Your question asking if I think that our teachers should really take a cut in pay infers that I support such a case. I do not. As a matter of fact, I'm usually in favor of severely cutting administrative staff, 'nice to have' and/or non-curriculum oriented expenditures, and such long before advocating the reduction of teaching staff or teacher compensation.
Just so we're clear.
If you will read the "news story" carefully, you'll see who got KAKE involved.
Quote from: flo on November 11, 2009, 01:33:36 PM
If you will read the "news story" carefully, you'll see who got KAKE involved.
They got a comment from two people, but are they the ones that told them? I don't know that just because they are the ones they interviewed, someone can call and tell a story without them being the source of it. shrug
Has anyone read the comments that have been posted on the KAKE facepage about this story? After reading it and noticing the mispelled words, it would be a wonder if anyone doesn't think Elk County needs better schools. I also noticed that Deb Farris's e-mail address is posted along with her article. It could have been anyone that alerted her to the story. Her facts are wrong, though. She should have verified her facts before going on air with them or posting them.
I noticed that the super wouldn't go on air. Don't you think that is because this is such a big decisions that its hard to make. I read the things people posted and noticed that 2 students posted things on there. It's actually nice to hear what they think about the issue and she their view. I played the feed and my youngest was kinda taken back. She said, they are closing our school. When, mom, when. I just told her that not right away, and that she would get to finish school this year. But to see the shock in her face, was enough for me. I haven't told my children anything about the issue, until something is determined by the board and is in print. And then it's not 100% clear if it will stay that way or not. But what got me is that a 4 year old is concearned. She loves school, and I plan on her attending the school, where ever it may be for years to come. I just hope we have one that long!!
QuoteI noticed that the super wouldn't go on air. Don't you think that is because this is such a big decisions that its hard to make.
The administrators are meeting tomorrow to come up with alternatives. Then they'll recommend to the school board, for discussion at the December meeting.
At least that was the plan mentioned at last Monday's school board meeting.
I hadn't hear about the 'News Story' until in Social Studies today in class. By the way our teacher told me it had said they were done, closing the schools, moving in the modulars ASAP. The first thing I did when I got out of practice today was come and watch this video. Thats just amazing. I can't believe all the mis-leading information and such.
Welcome to the world, Heather. You have a lifetime ahead of you of mis-information, etc. Don't believe anything you hear and only half of what you see unless it is coming from me.
Of course, I would believe anything you would tell me!! =]
I particularly liked Deb making reference to the Elk County School District instead of West Elk. Tells me they didn't even bother to check facts just went on what they heard from whomever contacted them. Albeit, I would assume they are right on the closing of schools in both Severy and Moline. Just a matter of time, whether it is this school year or next. I am in hope that the communities, through their board representatives, get to make that decision and not have some plan no one wants handed down to them from the State of Kansas.