It was just reported to me by a reliable source that regularly attends the West Elk Schoool board meetings that there is an audit and public survey happening right now.
The public survey is located at http://westelk.us/we1/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=30&Itemid=55
on the right hand side of the page.
The reason for posting this is because I was told that Mr. Reese our school superintendent and our paid employee, paid by our property taxes said something to the effect that he did not want the general public to know about this survey, only select people, such as parents of students, teachers and faculty, I would sure like to know why, wouldn't you?
Is it for control?
Is it Elk Konnected, LLC at work?
Isn't the School Board President also on the Steering Committee of the privately owned company Elk Konnected, LLC?
Isn't there other board members also on the Steering Committee of the privately owned company Elk Konnected, LLC?
Does our hired employee the school Superintendent Mr. Reese have an affiliation with the privately owned company Elk Konnected, LLC?
When can we start trusting our elected officials and hired help?
Feed back, answers appreciated.
The survey has been on the West Elk website for several weeks. I don't see how that's hiding anything, so I'm confused by your response. I would assume that if Mr. Reese wanted it hidden, it wouldn't be that easily available to the public.
Quote from: Mom70x7 on October 25, 2011, 08:22:10 PM
The survey has been on the West Elk website for several weeks. I don't see how that's hiding anything, so I'm confused by your response. I would assume that if Mr. Reese wanted it hidden, it wouldn't be that easily available to the public.
Well why didn't they publish it in the newspaper?
Then Why did he make such a remark at the school board meeting?
Well, I didn't know anything about it until Ross put it on this forum. I did my survey. How about the rest of you?
Quote from: Janet Harrington on October 25, 2011, 08:53:03 PM
Well, I didn't know anything about it until Ross put it on this forum. I did my survey. How about the rest of you?
Good job Janet.
Don't you agree it should be published in the paper and possibly here on the forum?
Do you think Elk Konnected, LLC wants us to know about it?
Elk Konnected has nothing to do with the surveys. They're from someone from Emporia State University. It's also been discussed at School Board meetings during the past year.
I got a letter about it from the school. It seems to be school oriented so that's why it's not gone out to the general public.
Lisa, parent of a West Elk Patriot
Quote from: farmgal67357 on October 26, 2011, 01:32:34 AM
I got a letter about it from the school. It seems to be school oriented so that's why it's not gone out to the general public.
Lisa, parent of a West Elk Patriot
Wake up and smell the roses. It is not school oriented in that fashion. It is a public survey being kept from the public. Otherwise why would Mr. Reese make such a reported statement as to keep it only for parents of students, teachers, staff a select few etc?
Where are the ethics in that?The school district is owned by the County Citizens that pay property tax's that are used to support?
The school district is not owned by Mr. Reese, he is an employee of the taxpayer.
The school is not owned by the City of Howard, but is owned by the taxpayer.
The school is not owned by the school board, but is owned by the taxpayer.
Ask how many kids from this school district go to school in other school districts?
Then ask why? See if you get any answers? I bet you get the answer it's secret to protect the children.
But you see the childrens namse don't have to be exposed. It is more about attitude and protecting the staff rather then protecting the children, IMHO., perhaps the situations would not have goe on for an extended period of time, just saying?
Think about it. Are teachers and staff always right? Wake up call.
Observe the recent situation in Wichita, suppose there was more openess in the school management
Why do you think the school board members are elected by the taxpayser?
Is Mr. Reese Elk Konnected, LLC?
QuoteOur school district has volunteered to be part of a school efficiency and effectiveness review.
That is from the website ^
I see nothing inappropriate regarding this, Ross. Why would I want input from someone not affiliated with the day to day operation (board, teachers, students, parents, staff)?
That would reflect bias and unfounded data to be included in the results and not be a proper survey.
ready
Well perhaps you are right Ready. However at the end on each survey there is a place to enter comments.
As one man told me, he thinks they are way over spending.
He feel the cost per child is extremely high and he was able to voice that.
One question is,
West Elk USD 282 Board of Education allows sufficient time for public input at meetings.
I don't believe that question is strictly aimed at teachers, students, and administrators do you?
They don't allow input unless you get on the agenda a week before the meeting.
At least our County Commissioners have an open public forum at the start their of their meeting.
However to address the school board you must get your self on the agenda at a least a week before the meeting.
Suppose something comes up that you wish to address the school board about four days before the meeting, what then? You
then have to wait three weeks before you can address the board, that's what.
All school district taxpayers have the right to address the schoolboard, does the school board make it easy to do so --- IMHO ----no.
It' not just my opinion, but I believe it is a proper right of those that pay the aministrators and teachers to be involved.
QuoteWest Elk USD 282 Board of Education allows sufficient time for public input at meetings.
I don't believe that question is strictly aimed at teachers, students, and administrators do you?
I agree with you there, however in my county, our commissioners have their agenda in which one has to wait a week before speaking.
Not sure about the school district.
I would think if I didn't have any kids in school, then who I spoke with (teachers, parents, other staff) would be my sounding block on issues I find at risk. If inconsistent, then make an appoinment with the board.
ready
Quote from: readyaimduck on October 26, 2011, 06:00:35 AM
That is from the website ^
I see nothing inappropriate regarding this, Ross. Why would I want input from someone not affiliated with the day to day operation (board, teachers, students, parents, staff)?
That would reflect bias and unfounded data to be included in the results and not be a proper survey.
ready
It's NOT a public survey. You know who has gotten bored. He feels the need to cook up another conspiracy thread.... :P
Lisa
Quote from: farmgal67357 on October 26, 2011, 09:08:53 PM
It's NOT a public survey. You know who has gotten bored. He feels the need to cook up another conspiracy thread.... :P
Lisa
I disagree. There is nothing on the school site or survey site that says it is not open to the public. Furthermore, part of the group of surveys is for Parents/Patrons.
pa·tron/ˈpātrən/
Noun:
A person who gives financial or other support to a person, organization, cause, or activity.
We, as tax payers in WE's school district, fund the school and are therefore patrons of west elk. We should have every right to have a say in what the school does with the money since it comes from us. If the school or parents have a problem with that, don't use our money... fund it yourself.
Quote from: farmgal67357 on October 26, 2011, 09:08:53 PM
It's NOT a public survey. You know who has gotten bored. He feels the need to cook up another conspiracy thread.... :P
Lisa
Another conspiracy thread? Where's the first one? Oh the EK thread? That's NOT a conspiracy thread. There is some really good information in that thread that proves misuse of taxpayer funds. THANKS ROSS for bringing it all to light!!
MT, you are correct. It does have a section for Patrons. Sounds VERY public to me!---Jennifer
Quote from: mtcookson on October 26, 2011, 11:03:53 PM
I disagree. There is nothing on the school site or survey site that says it is not open to the public. Furthermore, part of the group of surveys is for Parents/Patrons.
pa·tron/ˈpātrən/
Noun:
A person who gives financial or other support to a person, organization, cause, or activity.
We, as tax payers in WE's school district, fund the school and are therefore patrons of west elk. We should have every right to have a say in what the school does with the money since it comes from us. If the school or parents have a problem with that, don't use our money... fund it yourself.
What I meant was that it wasn't broadcast all over the place that there was a survey. I apologize that I wasn't more specific, I've not been sleeping and my brain is having some serious synaptic issues!
Lisa
Quote from: farmgal67357 on October 27, 2011, 08:40:45 AM
What I meant was that it wasn't broadcast all over the place that there was a survey. I apologize that I wasn't more specific, I've not been sleeping and my brain is having some serious synaptic issues!
Lisa
You are Konnected aren't you?
I believe
the conspiracy you are talking about perhaps supported by you is to keep the general population of Elk County in the dark, right?
Hence as you say:
Quote from: farmgal67357 on October 27, 2011, 08:40:45 AM
What I meant was that it wasn't broadcast all over the place that there was a survey.
But least ways the word is spreading now isn't it. I'm sorry to hear you are having trouble sleeping. Older folks like me have that problem and therefore I take what I call an old timers nap 15 to 30 minutes to refresh. You might try that, I know it helps me.
Guess what?
Lots of Elk County concerned citizens and taxpayers and voters are watching local politicians and taxpayer paid employees and that is a good thing. And I hope they keep watching.
County Commissioners and School Board Members and Admistrator's fall in to those catagories.
And as long as they do what they are elected or hired to do they have nothing to be concerned about.
Meaning being watched should be no problem to them and perhaps they may recieve recogniton for a job well done.
This is totally off the subject, but I just noticed it. Ross, I love, love, love, your profile picture.
Quote from: farmgal67357 on October 27, 2011, 08:40:45 AM
What I meant was that it wasn't broadcast all over the place that there was a survey. I apologize that I wasn't more specific, I've not been sleeping and my brain is having some serious synaptic issues!
Lisa
By what Ross was saying, it sounds like that's exactly how they wanted it unfortunately. Just a way to potentially skew the survey in their favor.
Quote from: mtcookson on October 28, 2011, 12:03:27 AM
By what Ross was saying, it sounds like that's exactly how they wanted it unfortunately. Just a way to potentially skew the survey in their favor.
It makes me believe it is the Elk Konnected way, they want to engage only a few and only their way, don't ya think?
I have been told that the President of the School Board has made a remark at the Board meeting of having Elk Konnected sponsor a meeting that would have to do with some aspect of the School Board responsibility? I simply ask why does the Board want to shirk their responsibilities and turn them over to Elk konnected, if this is true?
Would it be because Elk Konnected works their magic with an out of County Professional Facilitator to get a few citizens to do as it wants? And because he can have people that simply ask questions evicted by calling for the Sheriff?
Would it be because Elk Konnected would not be required to provide documentation of anything they do?
Would it be because it woiuld not reach the majority of the School Districts taxpayer's?
Why? Would it be because our elected officials of the School Board have elected as President of the Board an Elk Konnected Steering Committee Member?
Why?
If you all will go back to replies nos. 5 and 6, you will find the reason that this survey was not made a general public survey. The entity (which is NOT West Elk) wanting the survey does not want comment from uninformed citizens who tend to spout opinions instead of informed facts. And you have to admit that most of what we get on this forum is opinion.
Quote from: Wilma on October 28, 2011, 07:43:31 AM
If you all will go back to replies nos. 5 and 6, you will find the reason that this survey was not made a general public survey. The entity (which is NOT West Elk) wanting the survey does not want comment from uninformed citizens who tend to spout opinions instead of informed facts. And you have to admit that most of what we get on this forum is opinion.
Fortunately they do not have that right according to the Law. :) Since every dime the school uses is someone elses money i.e. taxpayer dime. :)
Do you mean that the school district does not have the right to carry out a survey that has been requested by another public entity, according to that entity's specifications?
Really, would you want the opinions from a town full of non-farmers about how you should farm? How about a town full of non-farmers telling you to get rid of your goats and stop trying to raise honey bees? Would those opinions be of any use to you?
Someone, or a group of someones, at a university are doing a study and our school district volunteered to help them by having people fill out a survey about how the district works for them. That's what I was told by my husband. I'm sure when all the data has been collected and studied, there will be some paper written and a grade given. That's it. Although I'm, sure West Elk will be interested in the results.
Lisa
Well, there were some questions on that survey that I couldn't answer or give a score on, but if this survey is being conducted for the purpose of writing a paper and the survey is not made available to the entire West Elk School district, then the survey will be a corrupt survey. If only having a select group answer the survey and that select group are those that would give favorable scores, then it is not a true finding of what is really going on.
But, you know what, I always hated that part of my studies in college because I have always had the opinion that polls and surveys are corrupt and do not represent what is the truth.
Quote from: Wilma on October 28, 2011, 07:43:31 AM
If you all will go back to replies nos. 5 and 6, you will find the reason that this survey was not made a general public survey. The entity (which is NOT West Elk) wanting the survey does not want comment from uninformed citizens who tend to spout opinions instead of informed facts. And you have to admit that most of what we get on this forum is opinion.
Surveys like this are not facts they ar opinions. Facts need to be documented in some way.
The answers to the questions are simply opinions.
However, perhaps the remarks could be considered facts if they could be proven.
Then is everything you say on this forum opinion since you haven't proven any of it?
Quote from: Wilma on October 28, 2011, 04:26:40 PM
Then is everything you say on this forum opinion since you haven't proven any of it?
Wilma, that is an absolutely great response.
Quote from: Wilma on October 28, 2011, 04:26:40 PM
Then is everything you say on this forum opinion since you haven't proven any of it?
Yes, it is my opinion as I have stated in the posts, unless it's a question?
Questions are different from opinion.
Quote from: frawin on October 28, 2011, 04:47:09 PM
Wilma, that is an absolutely great response.
Why is that a great response?
Don't ya'all read so well?
I've often said IMHO plenty of times.
In some cases a question is an opinion.
Quote from: Wilma on October 28, 2011, 05:58:05 PM
In some cases a question is an opinion.
If you want interpret it that way feel free to do so, however it is not a correct interpretation. That is your privilege.
I was told by a school board member to do the survey, but I do have kids in the school system. If this person said that Mr. Reese said this I would have no idea. I have been in several different schools throughout the years, and WE is no different than any other school. Every school around has their share of issues, just so you all know!! Of course this is my opinion!!! LOL
Quote from: Janet Harrington on October 28, 2011, 03:49:23 PM
Well, there were some questions on that survey that I couldn't answer or give a score on, but if this survey is being conducted for the purpose of writing a paper and the survey is not made available to the entire West Elk School district, then the survey will be a corrupt survey. If only having a select group answer the survey and that select group are those that would give favorable scores, then it is not a true finding of what is really going on.
But, you know what, I always hated that part of my studies in college because I have always had the opinion that polls and surveys are corrupt and do not represent what is the truth.
I had to put N/A on the bus questions because my kid doesn't ride the bus. I know they sent all the parents of student letters about the survey, and they talked about it at a school board meeting. Don't know if that equals the "entire West Elk school district", though. I do think they tried to notify the people they needed the information from.
Lisa
News Flash
The people running the survey will be at the West Elk School Board Meeting on November 14th to talk to the school board and the public. I have been told the meeting will be starting early at 5:30 pm and that the School Board will go into an immediate Executive Session to speak with half of the group running the survey, while the other half of the group speaks with the public.
Here is your chance to be heard, will you take it?
West Elk has been labeled the most expensive school in the state of Kansas so I have been told. And I don't find that hard to believe by the amounts of money they are spending. It is like a spending spree over there in my opinion. And they just could not afford to keep the Grade Schools open. go figure?
Remember
November 14th at 5:30 pm at the West Elk Administration building. If they figure a lot of people will show up they may move it to the school building.
Quote from: Ross on November 02, 2011, 07:24:24 PM
The people running the survey will be at the West Elk School Board Meeting on November 14th to talk to the school board and the public. I have been told the meeting will be starting early at 5:30 pm and that the School Board will go into an immediate Executive Session to speak whit half ot the group runninig the survey, hwile the other half of the group speaks with the public.
How could
anything relating to an
anonymous survey ever qualify for an executive session under the Kansas Open Meetings Act? Sounds like at least a technical violation in the making.
K.S.A. 75-4319: http://kansasstatutes.lesterama.org/Chapter_75/Article_43/#75-4319 (http://kansasstatutes.lesterama.org/Chapter_75/Article_43/#75-4319)
Pay particular attention to the method required for formally entering executive session. There must be a motion, second & vote. The motion must contain 3 elements:
(1) the justification for closing the meeting,
(2) the subjects to be discussed during the closed or executive meeting and
(3) the time and place at which the open meeting shall resume.
Such motion, including the required statement, shall be recorded in the minutes of the meeting and shall be maintained as a part of the permanent records of the body or agency. Discussion during the closed or executive meeting shall be limited to those subjects stated in the motion. Authorized subjects are identified by law.
Justification and
subject are 2 different things. Lawful subjects are listed in the statute and are addressed in detail by the attorney general at the following location: http://www.ksag.org/page/open-and-honest-government (http://www.ksag.org/page/open-and-honest-government)
Check out the links on that page entitled "A Citizen's Guide to KORA KOMA", :Frequently Asked Questions about the Kansas Open Meetings Act (KOMA)", and "Kansas Open Meetings Act (KOMA) Guidelines".
Caveat Emptor, citizens, 'let the buyer beware', we are still a nation under the rule of law. But, I could be wrong.
I wasn't at the meeting when the information was disclosed about the early start of the meeting for the people doing the survey wanting to talk with the school board and the people.
But once again it was reported to me that the superintendent did not want the general public, the taxpayers to know about the meeting.
I happen to trust the person that informed me of what is going on.
In my humble opinion it reeks of Elk Konnected,LLC or a form of Plutocracy? And keep the taxpayers in the dark?
Elk Konnected does have members on the school board and the Superintendent is Konnected isn't he.
The President of the School Board is on the steering Committee isn't he?
But, I'd bet you a donut and a cup of coffee there will be no circle of chairs and no facilitator from Public Squares Communities, LLC out of Wichita County at this meeting. I'm hoping for something far more honest.
And I hope to see a lot of people at the meeting.
Perhaps you misunderstood what you heard. Perhaps it is not an executive meeting, but just simply separate meetings of two different groups. Didn't the survey have different sections for different groups? Doesn't an executive meeting have to take place within a regular meeting? Is this a regular scheduled meeting of the school board? Why should the general population hear what they have to say to management, much of what they would not understand or misunderstand. And I imagine that management will hear everything that is being told to the general population.
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 06:36:00 AM
Perhaps you misunderstood what you heard. Perhaps it is not an executive meeting, but just simply separate meetings of two different groups. Didn't the survey have different sections for different groups? Doesn't an executive meeting have to take place within a regular meeting? Is this a regular scheduled meeting of the school board? Why should the general population hear what they have to say to management, much of what they would not understand or misunderstand. And I imagine that management will hear everything that is being told to the general population.
Perhaps you think I misunderstood which is fine with me.
It is a regular meeting starting early, unless they call it a special meeting with a seperate notice and a seperate agenda, but all in all it's the same thing. A school board meeting orf our elected officials. So what's the point? Executive session either way.
Does the term public information mean anything to you?
Perhaps the executive meeting is to discuss problems relating to children or parents or some such matter that is not public information. I never suggested that it was a bad thing.
So are you saying general public/ taxpayers arei n your opinion ignorant?
I am sure that the school board will recieve the information provided, that's the purpose of all of this afterall.
A school board meeting is simply that, and when the board members go into a private meeting among themselves or with others it is an executive session. I do not believe they are permitted by law to have private meetings otherwise.
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 06:36:00 AMWhy should the general population hear what they have to say to management, much of what they would not understand or misunderstand.
That sounds like something a democrat would say to the people. Sorry, but not everyone is an idiot. I'm sure most people would actually understand perfectly well.
WOW!!!! We are still in America, aren't we?
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 06:36:00 AM
Why should the general population hear what they have to say to management, much of what they would not understand or misunderstand.
Because, Komrade, the law (and common sense) says they should! What is it about Sunshine Laws that YOU don't understand? Perhaps you should avail yourself of the opportunity to learn: http://kansasstatutes.lesterama.org/Chapter_75/Article_43/#75-4319 (http://kansasstatutes.lesterama.org/Chapter_75/Article_43/#75-4319)
No opinion Komrade, just facts.
Unbelievable, Wilma. Simply unbelievable! "Management"? How about elected government servants of the people?
Quote from a supervisor many years ago, "You will never go broke buy
underestimating the intelligence of the American public," Maybe he was right... next year's West Elk School budget: $9,500,000.00!
It's beginning to look like the school arm of government here is as disKonnected from things as the county government has been. Funny how the same Konnections keep popping up. No?
Here is some interesting info for you.
I made a remark about the spending spree our school board has been on, well check this out.
The default setting compares the districts with the lowest and highest 2010 revenue per-pupil: USD 207 Ft. Leavenworth ($8,237) and USD 282 West Elk ($21,794).
Two other districts, Greensburg and Chapman, actually had higher revenue but both were rebuilding from tornado damage.
You don't see anything wrong with these numbers? It's your property tax. And in my opinion being poorly used.
Why don't they concentrate more on teaching and less on spending?
At the cost per student we should have every student making straight A's don't you think? Instead of being just an average school?
Oop's I forgot the link for the info in my previous post.
There is a lot of good info at
http://kansasopengov.org/
Enjoy!
I seem to remember Elk konnected being involved with meetings for the closing of Severy and Moline grade schools.
And weren't they involved in trying to pass a $5.5 million dollar school bond? And now they have our School Board covered by Elk Konnected just like they do our County Government. Can anyone explain to me what is going on? Am I wrong in what I concieve as to be goinig on?
We have a good conversation going on at http://www.cascity.com/howard/forum/index.php/topic,11780.0.html with and about Elk Konnected, LLC. For right now Elk Konnected, LLC has said they are not going to return to the honest, open dialog at http://www.cascity.com/howard/forum/index.php/topic,11780.0.html but I think otherwise. If they are truely interested in what they say, an honest and open dialog they will return. Otherwise, in my opinion they have been lying to us.
There is a lot of good and bad reading over there, but quite informative. If you haven't been there come join us.
Quote from: Ross on November 03, 2011, 10:50:37 AM
Can anyone explain to me what is going on?
Shadow government? Plutocracy? Cronyism? Liberal progressive socialism? Just sayin. If it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck...
What does any of this have to do with a West Elk survey being done by some college person writing a paper for school...or so it seems? And it's "i before except after c."
A commercial for a different thread? Who said West Elk is just an average school? Where is that written?
I agree that more education money should filter down to the classroom..... especially in grammar and spelling! As it is the kids could learn their basics on computer and never even need a teacher, but then who would they blame when they don't know how to spell or are too shiftless to bother? :P
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 03, 2011, 11:56:39 AM
A commercial for a different thread?
Or perhaps a continuing public service announcement about systemic cancers?
Huh? ???
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 03, 2011, 12:18:06 PM
Huh? ???
Didn't figure you would get it. It's a local thing. Nevermind.
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 03, 2011, 11:56:39 AMAnd it's "i before except after c."
science
weird
beige
conscience
deity
eight
foreign
forfeit
freight
heifer
height
heinous
heir
heist
seismic
seize
neighbor
neither
omniscient
weight
vein
veil
sovereign
society
- plus many more
Sorry... I had to. :laugh:
I didn't get it either, Diane.
Wouldn't a regular neeting that starts early be a special meeting? I am not really up on the ways and means of meetings, but it seems to me regular meetings always start at the same stated time on the same stated day of the month, or whatever. Anything other than that would be a special meeting. But then, I don't know if a special meeting can be treated differently than a stated meeting. I do seem to recall that a special meeting needs to have a specific purpose and the meeting can't be used for anything other than that purpose. If the stated meeting has been called to meet earlier than usual, then that part of it should be a special meeting with the stated meeting following. Now try to sort that one out.
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 03, 2011, 11:56:39 AM
What does any of this have to do with a West Elk survey being done by some college person writing a paper for school...or so it seems? And it's "i before except after c."
I do believeit's more than just a a college person writting a paper for school other wise why the meetings.
And look at what I just found on West Elk's web site.
Monday, Nov. 14
5:30-6:15 pm
Parent Meeting for
Efficiency AuditSchool business is not just parent business, it is taxpayers business.
School Board business is taxpayers business.
I believe there are Some students who don't even live in the district, do their parents have more rights than taxpayers?
Why isn't the information made public in the newspaper?
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 03, 2011, 11:56:39 AM
A commercial for a different thread? Who said West Elk is just an average school? Where is that written?
I agree that more education money should filter down to the classroom..... especially in grammar and spelling! As it is the kids could learn their basics on computer and never even need a teacher, but then who would they blame when they don't know how to spell or are too shiftless to bother? :P
That's unique isn't it? Inviting others to a different thread to get involved.
Our school has not reached Blue Ribbon Status for all the money it spends, we are not on the list. so we must be average.
Five Kansas Schools Recognized as 2011 National Blue Ribbon Schools
The National Blue Ribbon Schools Program honors public and private elementary, middle and high schools that are either academically superior or that demonstrate dramatic gains in student achievement to high levels. The schools are selected based on one of two criteria: High performing schools and Improving schools.
Or are you saying we are below average.
I don't believe we are below average and I know we are not Blue Ribbon even under Improving Schools. Therefore, I hope we are average.
As far as spelling there is always spell check, which I sometimes forget to use. LOL I'm human and screw up and hit the wrong key on the keyboard. But I agree with you there needs to be as much emphasis on reading, writing and arithmatic as there is on technology, actually more. The kids probably know more about computers then their teachers. And grade school and high school are not trade school. Did you know you can put up a web site and design it all in ten minutes on the internet, and add to it on a daily basis. Why then is it necessary to learn to design one in high school? So, I agree with you on the education part.
Quote from: Patriot on November 03, 2011, 12:16:49 PM
Or perhaps a continuing public service announcement about systemic cancers?
ROFLMAO
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 01:03:19 PM
...I am not really up on the ways and means of meetings...
Yet if you would avail yourself of readily available information on the KS Attorney General website, you could alleviate your ignorance on such matters. Among other interesting facts, you would find that there is NO 'notice requirement' for boards & commissions subject to the KOMA. There's not even an agenda or minutes requirement, other than minutes recording executive session motions. Also, executive sessions can only be called during an open public meeting.
But then, ignorance is bliss. Or so I'm told.
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 01:03:19 PM
I didn't get it either, Diane.
Wouldn't a regular neeting that starts early be a special meeting?
If the School Board is there it is still a School Board meeting and open to the taxpaying public.
Simple.
Quote from: Ross on November 03, 2011, 01:13:18 PM
If the School Board is there it is still a School Board meeting and open to the taxpaying public.
Simple.
And if two or more members discuss ANY board matters in private (on the phone, via email, telegraph or telephone or even through a go between 3rd party), under any circumstances other than a proper executive session, it's a violation of state law. Also simple.
Speaking of the Kansas Open Meetings Act (KOMA)... Did you know that such matters are so critical that Kansas law requires a court to give priority treatment to any KOMA case/complaint filed. Did you know that any citizen can bring such a civil action and the AG and County Attorney's may bring criminal complaints on the complaint of any citizen? This meetings thing must be some important stuff. Wonder if our elected officials take it seriously enough. They should, don't you think?
I know all that.
Ross, this announcement you posted:
"Monday, Nov.14
5:30 - 6:15 pm
Parent Meeting for Efficiency Adult"
doesn't say anything about a school board meeting, does it? So what does it have to do with all this? If this isn't a school board meeting why are we so upset about it? It seems to me that it is just a meeting of citizens. Parents to be more specific.
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 01:29:20 PM
...doesn't say anything about a school board meeting, does it? So what does it have to do with all this? If this isn't a school board meeting why are we so upset about it? It seems to me that it is just a meeting of citizens. Parents to be more specific.
If 2 or more board members are present and engage in discussions of matters relating to school business, planning, etc., it IS a board meeting and subject to KOMA rules. It does matter, even if it's not called a 'school board meeting'. Same applies if 2 or more members meet in an 'executive session' at the same time. Why do you hate the law so much?
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 01:29:20 PM
I know all that.
Ross, this announcement you posted:
"Monday, Nov.14
5:30 - 6:15 pm
Parent Meeting for Efficiency Adult"
doesn't say anything about a school board meeting, does it? So what does it have to do with all this? If this isn't a school board meeting why are we so upset about it? It seems to me that it is just a meeting of citizens. Parents to be more specific.
I did not say anything at all about the School Board Meeting and it was not posted by the School Board.
Howeverit was stated at the school board meeting as starting the meeting early.
So if the School Board is involved it is a School Board meeting, I'd imagine and especially since they said they would meet in executive session with the survey people. Don't ya reckon?
If it is a school board meeting concerning the survey it is an open meeting, not just parents. But taxpayers as well.
Don't you understand the school belongs to the taxpayers?
That's OK MT, just my way of catching a misspelling. ;) There are lots of exceptions aren't there? I have to friendly poke him once in awhile.
I believe it is quite evident the someone associated with our school district doesn't want all the taxpayers there for some reason or another.
The newspaper article only invites the parents of school kids.
The headline reads:
Parents encouraged to attend meeting at West Elk
It continues, "A meeting for West Elk parents will be held Nov. 14 in the West Elk auditorium at 5:30 pm."
Wait a minute why not invite all of their employeers, the taxpayers, the owners of the school?
Why not invite all the people that elected the School Board to office.
Why not? ? ?
Don't they want an untainted survey? ? ?
Otherwise what's the point ? ? ?
I will put my two cents in, however I do not live in your county. that being said:
I think I see where you are coming from Ross et al (albeit a little strong on the suppositions. :))
The statement in the paper was: ENCOURAGED all parents. It did not say ONLY parents of West Elk.
Also, if I am a taxpayer for a school district, and have no kids there I would certainly want to find out where my pennies were going to....espcially if there are a few athletic parents with pull and want to see a football stadium built, and the arts stopped to pay for it!
Don't know if I explained it well, I just want the best for the school, and I hate to break it to you all, but sports are highly overrated as far as life skills.
ready
Quote from: Diane Amberg on November 03, 2011, 04:42:05 PM
That's OK MT, just my way of catching a misspelling. ;) There are lots of exceptions aren't there? I have to friendly poke him once in awhile.
Definitely a lot of exceptions. I have to admit I did use that rule a lot, just always got a chuckle for the exceptions. :laugh:
Quote from: readyaimduck on November 03, 2011, 06:06:57 PM
I think I see where you are coming from Ross et al (albeit a little strong on the suppositions. :))
The statement in the paper was: ENCOURAGED all parents. It did not say ONLY parents of West Elk.
ready
Good to hear from you Ready.
What you said is sort of the point, they did not encourage anyone else to attend.
The same attitude as with the on line survey, they didn't encourage anyone else to participate.
I just got an e-mail I am going to post in a moment I hope you and everyone else appreciates it.
I e-mailed the Center for Innovative School Leadership at http://www.emporia.edu/cisl/ .
Surprise, surprise an immediate reply On Nov 3, 2011, at 5:13 PM only I wasn't on line to get it that quick.
I expected to wait until tomorrow to ge a response since I e-mailed after 5 pm.
My E-mail to them:
Mr. Sailors,
I have read some of your web site and I have a couple of questions I would appreciate answers to.
Is it proper for the School to only invite parents to partake in your survey?
Are all taxpayers in the School District permitted to participate?
The answers to the questions are of some importance to me as a taxpayer.
Thank You for your time.
Sincerely,
Ross
======================================================================
His response:
All are welcome to fill out survey as far as we are concerned
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 3, 2011, at 5:13 PM, =======================================================================
If you wish to question these facts here is his Contact Information taken from the web site http://www.emporia.edu/cisl/personnel.html
Bill Sailors, Director of the Center for Innovative School Leadership
Ph. 620-341-5823
E-mail wsailors@emporia.edu
Fax 620-341-6674
Their main web site is http://www.emporia.edu/cisl/personnel.html
I think you are taking the "Encourage parents to attend" to mean "Everybody else stay away". I take it as a special request for parents to be there, also, not exclusively. No where does it say for parents only. Stop being paranoid and look at it as something that is especially for parents but open to anyone who wishes to attend.
Quote from: Wilma on November 03, 2011, 06:39:17 PM
I think you are taking the "Encourage parents to attend" to mean "Everybody else stay away". I take it as a special request for parents to be there, also, not exclusively. No where does it say for parents only. Stop being paranoid and look at it as something that is especially for parents but open to anyone who wishes to attend.
That's bull pucky.
Why?
Taking the flipside: perhaps the parents are never involved in any of the saysos...so the district is asking for once in their life, their input.
Parents have kids that attend school, and are not involved. Then when a decision is made the parents are mad.
Just a thought. Parents aren't what they used to be when i was in school! Most parents had a say in what went on.
Perhaps this is a way to urge the input back into the decisions????
ready
The survey, which ended October 31st, had different sections for people to fill out. I think there were four - one for school board members, one for teachers and staff, one for parents, and one for community members.
My understanding is that the upcoming meeting is to discuss the survey with the parents. I see no harm in that.
There is a regularly scheduled board meeting later that evening. When I read about it, I assumed the time between the two meetings was for people to eat supper.
Quote from: Mom70x7 on November 03, 2011, 08:00:28 PM
The survey, which ended October 31st, had different sections for people to fill out. I think there were four - one for school board members, one for teachers and staff, one for parents, and one for community members.
My understanding is that the upcoming meeting is to discuss the survey with the parents. I see no harm in that.
There is a regularly scheduled board meeting later that evening. When I read about it, I assumed the time between the two meetings was for people to eat supper.
My understanding from someone who attended the School Board Meeting is for this meeting to gather further verbal input. I guess we will just have to attend to find out.
You may call it anything you want but anytime the elected officials gather it is called a School Board Meeting and they said at the last School Board meeting they will go into Executive Session to talk with the group. Please read previous post aboout school board meetings.
Do you mean that if the school board members all belong to the same church and all attend on the same day that it is no longer church but a school board meeting?
Now Wilma, THAT would be a meetiin' , by God! :)
ready
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2011, 01:35:36 PM
Do you mean that if the school board members all belong to the same church and all attend on the same day that it is no longer church but a school board meeting?
Quote from: readyaimduck on November 04, 2011, 01:45:03 PM
Now Wilma, THAT would be a meetiin' , by God! :)
ready
You got that right Ready.And probably an act of God.But actually IF it happened and they were there to discuss any actions pertaining to do with the school it definitely would be it's all the same, a school board meeting. I wouldn't care if they met in the outhouse behind the church still it's still the same, a school board meeting. Aren't you glad you asked an extreme question?
Quote from: Wilma on November 04, 2011, 01:35:36 PM
Do you mean that if the school board members all belong to the same church and all attend on the same day that it is no longer church but a school board meeting?
Wilma,
Go read the Attorney General links that have been provided regarding the KOMA. It is not the location of the gathering, but the discussion that triggers KOMA provisions. Educate yourself so you can help with the analysis please. God knows the answers have been provided.... clear, unambiguous answers... unlike the Elk DisKonnected 'answers.'
The survey people are at the special school board meeting today at 5:30 pm at the high school.
I hope to see you there.
If the school board only wanted parents to attend, they would have sent letters to only the parents and not made it public about this meeting. Geeze people. How simple is that? If you are not a parent and they wanted to keep this secret, you would have never known about it.
Well, it looked to me that they were quite successful in keeping the taxpayers and the general public away from the meeting.
There were only about a dozen people how pathetic is that?
There were two professors there that talked with the people and asked for input on various subjects including the quality of teachers through financing of the school. Guess who finances the school, you the taxpayer.
The professors were really decent. I did ask them if they only wanted parents of students in attendence or everyone.
They said they wanted everyone that was willing to come. The better the turn out, the ,ore input and the better the survey.
As I said only a dozen or so showed up, that to me is a pretty dismal turn out.
Oh well.
It would be interesting to read their survey of this meeting. And i use the word interesting as in: Our ball is red, so therfore it is not blue.
Unfortunately, I am not so sure why people in general, didn't attend.
I know what you wrote, Ross. Letters were sent out to parents and there was a link to fill out the questionaire.
Perhaps it was more of an inadequacy to reach people, as not all parents are computer savvy.
Sometimes we only have 3 in church. Is it the fault of the preacher, the congregation, the musician?
Hell if I know. People attend when they think they will no longer have what was given.
Same with church and politics.
Dam!!!!!! I should separate those two! ?) :) :(
taxpayers will pay for what they believe in and are able to, irregardless of the survey.
opinions are everywhere. Money is not at this time. Priorites are important, and most are feeling it.
Those in control will try to get more.
Trust me, the farmers will be next.
ready and out
How were people deliberately kept away from the meeting? "They" somehow did it? How about normal apathy?