I noticed an Elk County deputy parked in the plant parking lot today. Apparently his wife works there and I guess he stopped to have lunch. Since I couldn't figure out why he was there, I called the Elk County Sheriff's Office to see why he was parked there. (Understand that the plant parking lot is not a public parking lot.) I thought it was odd that he would drive over just to have lunch with his wife. What I learned was that he was on county business in Independence and was continuing on to Caney for some more county business. The plant was on his way and how nice it was that he came to share lunch with his wife.
We have a lot of relatives that come out to the plant to have lunch with the employees, but they usually go to the cafeteria to eat. We do have some of the best food in the area.
Anyway, that got me to thinking. Would you, as a taxpayer, consider that to be a misuse of public funds? Do you think it is a benefit that the law enforcement officers get to take a vehicle home every night?
Now, I already know the answers to these questions. I just want to see what you have to say. Let me know your opinions.
(Here is a hint. On the part about taking vehicles home by law enforcement officers, we have laws about that.)
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 12, 2011, 03:34:06 PM
I noticed an Elk County deputy parked in the plant parking lot today. Apparently his wife works there and I guess he stopped to have lunch. Since I couldn't figure out why he was there, I called the Elk County Sheriff's Office to see why he was parked there. (Understand that the plant parking lot is not a public parking lot.) I thought it was odd that he would drive over just to have lunch with his wife. What I learned was that he was on county business in Independence and was continuing on to Caney for some more county business. The plant was on his way and how nice it was that he came to share lunch with his wife.
We have a lot of relatives that come out to the plant to have lunch with the employees, but they usually go to the cafeteria to eat. We do have some of the best food in the area.
Anyway, that got me to thinking. Would you, as a taxpayer, consider that to be a misuse of public funds? Do you think it is a benefit that the law enforcement officers get to take a vehicle home every night?
Now, I already know the answers to these questions. I just want to see what you have to say. Let me know your opinions.
(Here is a hint. On the part about taking vehicles home by law enforcement officers, we have laws about that.)
Taking them home as long as they aren't allowed to conduct personal business then thats fine. They need to have the vehicle in case they are called for a situation. On the lunch, doesn't theofficer get a lunch break?
Letme rephrase on the lunch. Doesn't the officer get a lunch break and if his county business takes him into his lunch break and he happens to be close to where his wife is, its not any different for him to eat there than to go to mcdonalds. So i see no problem with that. BUT if he goes on his break using the county vehicle to do his shopping then theres a problem. That can be done after work and in his own personal vehicle. Lunch on the other hand is a different thing.
Law enforcment officers do go to lunch. Do they get a lunch break? No. They are still on call, so they don't actually get a lunch break. Guess I could say it this way, they get paid while they are eating. However; they have to leave when they are called out. Many a meal has been left on the table because of calls.
Now, in this incident, he was traveling on county business and apparently planned his day to have lunch with his wife. He had to drive right by the place that she works at, so he came and had lunch. That isn't something he can do all the time. I think that is nice. But, if he had driven out of Elk County just to come have lunch with his wife in Montgomery County, then it would have been a misuse of public funds.
We get to discussing how our county employees and politicians use our money, so I just wanted to see if people knew the difference. It is such a fine line sometimes. The reason I called to find out is because of this fine line. I could have been a jerk and started a real controversary about him being at the plant having lunch with his wife in a county vehicle. However; I chose to call and find out why he was there in a county vehicle. That way there isn't any rumors being started and I don't have to fume about why he was there in the county vehicle. Besides, maybe he was there to get me. Who knows? LOL
So, I recently learned that the Elk Valley School District has a huge cell phone bill. Something like $12,000.
Wow. I learned that letters were sent out about the cell phones. I'm just wondering what is happening about this. I did learn that two school board members there are certainly trying to find the answers to why.
Wonder if West Elk has the same problem. Guess I will be calling and finding out.
I have more items to share about misuse or abuse of taxpayers money and will do so as soon as I can word the statements without naming names and pointing fingers.
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 18, 2011, 06:57:05 PM
So, I recently learned that the Elk Valley School District has a huge cell phone bill. Something like $12,000.
Wow. I learned that letters were sent out about the cell phones. I'm just wondering what is happening about this. I did learn that two school board members there are certainly trying to find the answers to why.
Wonder if West Elk has the same problem. Guess I will be calling and finding out.
Amazing isn't it!
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 18, 2011, 07:00:05 PM
I have more items to share about misuse or abuse of taxpayers money and will do so as soon as I can word the statements without naming names and pointing fingers.
Since the abuses are a matter of public trust and if they are verifiable (and presumably on the part of elected or government employees) why the need for anonymity? Doesn't the public (employer) deserve the disclosure necessary to make informed decisions about those they employ? Especially those elected directly by the voter? Perhaps, in these economic times, we should be less concerned about political correctness and more about the public's right to transparency in government. Without the 'who', how does the taxpayer place appropriate accountability?
The names I am talking about are the names of the ones who have shared this information with me. Sometimes it takes me awhile to write something to get my point across, so just be patient.
As for the Elk Valley cell phones, I believe that a couple of school board members are right on top of that issue.
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 19, 2011, 07:22:12 PM
The names I am talking about are the names of the ones who have shared this information with me. Sometimes it takes me awhile to write something to get my point across, so just be patient.
Understandable. I mistook your original statement.
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 19, 2011, 07:22:12 PM
As for the Elk Valley cell phones, I believe that a couple of school board members are right on top of that issue.
Let's hope 'a couple' can end up getting 'a majority' to make positive changes.
I just saw what I think is a waste of tax payers money. Maybe they know something I don't but saw a truck slowly going down highway 160 spraying Johnson Grass. The JG has already gone to seed so what's the purpose on spraying it now. Even if they kill the existing plants and roots, got the seeds for a fresh crop next year. With-in a month or longer we will probably get a hard frost or freeze and turn the JG brown then it will look like they got a hell of a kill on it. I wonder if there is even any chemical in the spray or just green coloring---maybe Miracle Gro ?Enough damn chemicals floating around causing cancers and for what it costs I wonder if it wouldn't do more good to just keep the ditches mowed down---plus give us a fighting chance to see a deer before they jump out of the tall grass/weeds. Wonder which big shot up there in Topeka gave his brother in law a contract to "kill" the weeds ?
Jarhead, Myrna and I went to Howard this past weekend and we noticed they had been spraying Johnson grass and we both said they were insuring they would have a job spraying it next year because it had already gone to seed.
Hasn't this been one of my pet peeves for years? Let the stuff go to seed, then spray it. Maybe they just had some spray left over from the first batch they mixed last spring and had to get rid of it.
I think this was probably the state contract people doing this. I, too, do not understand why. Governor, can you answer that? Why spray Johnson Grass after it has gone to seed?
Is it misuse of public funds when "Deputy Dog" stops at a convenience store, (in his patrol truck in uniform), buys some beer, then puts that beer in the back of his truck, gets back into his patrol truck, then drives away?
Is that an okay thing to do? Wouldn't you, as Mr. "Phillip Public", think that he was on duty?
This happened at P & J's by a local county yokel. Witnessed by a friend of mine. My friend spoke with the sheriff about this. However; "Deputy Dog" is still working. Did the sheriff suspended "Deputy Dog" for doing this? Probably not. At least, I hope that he was counseled or coached about this looking bad to "Phillip Public".
I am reminded of a story. We had the occassion to stop an Elk County citizen whom we suspected of using and dealing meth. He was arrested for driving while suspended and open container. The open container was a bottle of Zima. We tested the Zima for meth with a field test that we had. The Zima tested positive for meth. I decided that we needed to test a bottle of Zima that we had purchased to see how the meth test would react. I had either my husband or a relative go buy a six pack of Zima. We took a new bottle, opened it, tested it with the meth field test kit, and guess what!!!! The Zima we had purchased tested positive for meth. Anyway, the point here is, I didn't go out and buy the Zima in uniform and with a patrol vehicle. I sent a citizen to take care of that business for me.
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 20, 2011, 06:47:35 PM
Is it misuse of public funds when "Deputy Dog" stops at a convenience store, (in his patrol truck in uniform), buys some beer, then puts that beer in the back of his truck, gets back into his patrol truck, then drives away?
ABSOLUTELY. It's personal use of the vehicle. Sorry but you go home, get in your vehicle and use your own gas and drive yourelf up there to get your beer, cigs, or groceries.
QuoteIs that an okay thing to do? Wouldn't you, as Mr. "Phillip Public", think that he was on duty?
That would raise ethical questions. Is he on duty buying beer? Is he going off on duty to find a spot to park and inbibe? Is he taking it to the station ...the list is endless. No one would think anything of it if he is in his personal vehicle.
QuoteI am reminded of a story. We had the occassion to stop an Elk County citizen whom we suspected of using and dealing meth. He was arrested for driving while suspended and open container. The open container was a bottle of Zima. We tested the Zima for meth with a field test that we had. The Zima tested positive for meth. I decided that we needed to test a bottle of Zima that we had purchased to see how the meth test would react. I had either my husband or a relative go buy a six pack of Zima. We took a new bottle, opened it, tested it with the meth field test kit, and guess what!!!! The Zima we had purchased tested positive for meth. Anyway, the point here is, I didn't go out and buy the Zima in uniform and with a patrol vehicle. I sent a citizen to take care of that business for me.
That is a interesting situation. And the only problem that i could see is that it was handled by a civilian. I would have sent a off duty leo to do it. Something about chain of custody of the evidence as well as the "test".
Come on let's get real. Did the "deputy Dog " drink the beer in the cop buggy or even put it where it was available to grab one ? I think you said no. I guess the same could be said if any cop in the Cop Mobil pulled up to Toots to grab a burger or pull into Kirk's mini mart and gets a soda. Maybe they should go home and jump in their personal car before doing it. I know quite a few years back I followed an Elk County cop SUV, like maybe a Blazer or something like it, and followed it to a grocery store in Independence. I even went it the store and visited with the "deputy Dog" while him and his wife---and two grandkids did their grocery shopping. Where was all the outrage back then ?
Some areas allow personal use of the vehicles as they say it gives the impression of police presence, which might give someone who is up to no good pause. Also, depending on the situation, such use may be considered as "income" and may be taxable. There is a means test for this.
Quote from: jarhead on September 20, 2011, 07:56:04 PM
Come on let's get real. Did the "deputy Dog " drink the beer in the cop buggy or even put it where it was available to grab one ? I think you said no. I guess the same could be said if any cop in the Cop Mobil pulled up to Toots to grab a burger or pull into Kirk's mini mart and gets a soda. Maybe they should go home and jump in their personal car before doing it. I know quite a few years back I followed an Elk County cop SUV, like maybe a Blazer or something like it, and followed it to a grocery store in Independence. I even went it the store and visited with the "deputy Dog" while him and his wife---and two grandkids did their grocery shopping. Where was all the outrage back then ?
Well, was this ever brought to my attention? No, it wasn't. A sheriff cannot do anything about stuff that he or she doesn't know.
You can look at it this way too. IF i own a company, and i have a couple employees working for me and because i am so wealthy i can afford 2 vehicles that my employees can take home since i would need them on their way at a moments notice to go collect bees. Sooo I let them take the co vehicle home. THE IRS RULES say i can write off everything about the truck if it is only used for company business. That means and includes if company business takes joe off to joplin to retrieve a hive, and he stops for lunch on the way back, he is allowed to do that by IRS Rules. BUT if joe stops off at his favorite watering hole and buys a 12 pack to drink after work, SINCE i do not allow Joe to drink on the job nor drive my truck after drinking a beer, then the IRS SAYS personal use. IF i send Joe to the store with the sole purpose of buying a keg for the company kegger i'm going to throw that night, then It would be considered company business by the IRS. BUT if i didn't use that keg at the company Kegger and took the keg and gave it to joe or put in my own bar, then its personal USE and therefore in violation of that irritating little IRS rule. these are just a couple examples of proper and improper use.
The scenarios that was portrayed are the same thing. The one that jarhead said about deputy dawg going to grocery store and shopping in his patrol car is improper use period. It definately is not a distinguised use of said vehicle.
NOW i am not sure anymore of how the law is on it, nor the IRS Rules on it, but there was a provision in the IRS Code. That you had to keep a Log of every stop and start of the vehicle that gave date time location and milage. Now if you do that or it used to be that way, then you could use said vehicle for multiple duty personal and company use. I don't know if its still that way. but THAT way is a pain in the ass and is subject to constant auditing by the IRS and is why most companys say no personal Use.
The sherriffs vehicles are not a corporations vehicle they are the taxpayers vehicles designated for the sole purpose of enforcing the law, protection as well as other police duties. Now picking up beer for your weekend bash would not constitute police duties. Picking up a six pak of zima for test analysis, would constitute a police duty and would be provable with all the evidence contained in a evidence bag and the witnesses that are at the event.
Simplest rule is this. IF its personal go home drive your own vehicle. IF its business use your business vehicle. Don't try and justify anything. IF its a grey area i would use my personal vehicle.
You know all these ethical/unethical scenarios are fine and dandy on paper The real test is in real life. AND unfortunately i have lived long enough to realize some truths. 1. Given time any leo will take advantage of the benefits given them. It will start out like small like his car was broken down so he used the patrol car to go up and buy parts to fix his car Thats personal use but it seems they all justify the action. SHrug. Is it a biggie, not really in that he didn't do anything wrong other than violate trust. It proceeds from there to the next justification to do something else and then it just gets easier.
Second truth is that for every good cop out there it seems that there are 3 bad ones that the good one has to work around. By bad they sluff off, violate laws, let their buddies in the police force pass on infractions, fix tickets ect ect.
Third truth is that when it comes to justice in this countrys court system, justices is bid out to the highest bidder. You can buy your way out of anything you get yourself into if you have enough money. Thats a proven fact! IMO there arent very many honest judges anymore. I read not to long ago one judge who sentenced his convict to read a book the heart of the problem and come back and discuss it with him a couple months later as his sentence. http://ffrf.org/publications/freethought-today/articles/state-church-bulletin-april-2011/ And darned if the lawyers didn't slap him down as fast as they could! The justice is not there. THose who try get shot down every time.
Last of all, when the population at large do not trust the leo's nor the court systems, then we as a nation are not far from anarchy. There can be no Rule of law when the law keepers are also the law breakers.
So, I understand that a couple of months ago, the Elk County Road Department purchased a huge dump truck. It is a red truck, don't know the brand. I know it has alot of wheels on it. It looks bigger than the white trucks.
I guess this truck came from somewhere in Tennessee. Is that right? I was told that our road supervisor flew to Tennesse with his wife and drove the truck back. Is that correct? Did the taxpayers pay for the wife's plane ticket? I can't imagine that something like that would have happened. Unless of course, she has a license to drive a truck like that and helped with the driving.
Also, is it correct that there were 4 trucks just like this red truck for sale in Kansas City, Missouri, and all 4 were cheaper in price and had less miles on them? If that is correct, why did we buy a truck in Tennesse?
I so wish that I could be in Elk County on Mondays, so that I could go to the courthouse and find out this information. I have to have another taxpayer tell me about it. However; am I being told incorrect stuff or am I being told correct stuff? I just don't know and can't research it. Maybe someone that reads this forum can tell me.
Quote from: Janet Harrington on September 24, 2011, 07:36:34 PM
...am I being told incorrect stuff or am I being told correct stuff? I just don't know and can't research it. Maybe someone that reads this forum can tell me.
Can't say about the truck, Janet. But I can tell you that the things you are mentioning aren't even close to being the tip of the iceberg. And I know my sources are accurate.
My very reliable source says that when the Road Boss flew to Virginia to pick up the maroon truck his wife was not with him. There's no legal way she could have rode back in the truck with him anyway, because there is NO passenger seat in that truck!
Speaking of interesting uses of public funds.. I heard a rumor that the Sheriff receives a set amount of taxpayer funds for prisoner meals, that the sheriff personally makes meal decisions and buys food for the prisoners..... and any money not spent is kept by the sheriff as personal income. Any truth to this one?
Quote from: Patriot on September 25, 2011, 09:35:47 AM
Speaking of interesting uses of public funds.. I heard a rumor that the Sheriff receives a set amount of taxpayer funds for prisoner meals, that the sheriff personally makes meal decisions and buys food for the prisoners..... and any money not spent is kept by the sheriff as personal income. Any truth to this one?
That isn't uncommon patriot. many counties across the US do that! it keeps the food costs down when the sherriff can get a bonus!
Quote from: srkruzich on September 25, 2011, 12:18:24 PM
That isn't uncommon patriot. many counties across the US do that! it keeps the food costs down when the sherriff can get a bonus!
Uncommon? No. Unethical/unprofessional? Looks like there's an undue temptation for a single official to make an extra buck. And an effort to avoid the task of proper budgeting and management. All on the backs of the incarcerated. Let's remember, jails also house folks who have not yet been convicted. Yep, let's serve em the discounted bologna this week, I've got a car payment due. Do tell Janet. Is this the Elk County process? If so, when did it start?
Quote from: Patriot on September 25, 2011, 12:47:30 PM
Uncommon? No. Unethical/unprofessional? Looks like there's an undue temptation for a single official to make an extra buck. And an effort to avoid the task of proper budgeting and management. All on the backs of the incarcerated. Let's remember, jails also house folks who have not yet been convicted. Yep, let's serve em the discounted bologna this week, I've got a car payment due. Do tell Janet. Is this the Elk County process? If so, when did it start?
Well the problem is that its not done without the consent of the public. This is a commonly openly practiced process and its entirely legal.
Back in dahlonega, the same thing was done. The sherriff procured food some of which came off his farm, other food off farms of other people in the county, and processed and served. The inmates got halfway decent food. Hell it was better food than we buy from the grocery store. but he managed to produce it and serve it for around 1.60 a day. I don't know about unethical in that he did provide the food and like i said it was better than most folks eat from the store. He did a good job of it, and his wife did the cooking for the county of which she was a damn fine cook. Literally the inmates were eating good! IF he had gone the route of buying institutional supplies it would have cost way more than that and sucked 100 times worse.
I don't know how its done here. But there is a massive potential of abuse! I know in some county jails they only feed 2 meals a day for inmates and it consists of mostly starch's. Taters, mac n cheese, bread and mystery meat. LOTS Of SOS served!
Quote from: srkruzich on September 25, 2011, 04:15:27 PM
Well the problem is that its not done without the consent of the public. This is a commonly openly practiced process and its entirely legal.
Agreed. Just like GE shipping American jobs overseas while their Chairman heads Obama's Jobs Commission. Just like Solantra getting big taxpayer loan guarantees then filing bankruptcy, when their poor financial condition was, or should ha been, easily seen in advance. Perfectly legal, sure. Ethical, moral, in good taste or an honest protection of the public trust? I think not.
Just becuse something is legal, that doesn't make it right.
Quote from: Patriot on September 25, 2011, 04:30:14 PM
Agreed. Just like GE shipping American jobs overseas while their Chairman heads Obama's Jobs Commission. Just like Solantra getting big taxpayer loan guarantees then filing bankruptcy, when their poor financial condition was, or should ha been, easily seen in advance. Perfectly legal, sure. Ethical, moral, in good taste or an honest protection of the public trust? I think not.
Just becuse something is legal, that doesn't make it right.
What is Solantra, I know about the Solyndra Loan.
Quote from: frawin on September 25, 2011, 04:45:19 PM
What is Solantra, I know about the Solyndra Loan.
My mistake, Frank. I meant to reference Solyndra. Thanks for the correction.
Janet could explain this better than I can and maybe she will later.
The sheriff receives a set amount for each meal that he serves. Let's say that he gets $2.00 per meal and he serves 10 meals. Thus he receives $20.00. Out of this $20.00 he has to pay for the food that is served whether it costs him more or costs him less. He has to keep track of just how many meals he serves and to whom he serves them. This is turned into the County Commissioners and they pay him the set amount per meal. There is no way that he can make a big profit from this without starving the prisoners. He has to pay for the food before he is paid for the meals. Any questions?
Only a comment:
He has a budget for foods at $2 per prisoner.
If he exceeds that budget in one month with an influx of out of county peoples and the reimbursement doesn't come in...then he has to pay out of pocket till that other counties check comes in.
Floating money.
His budget is for inmates food costs, and their is a bottom line, and if it goes over then he has to move monies from one account to that one to balance.
IF, and that is a big very slippery slope IF he/she is making money, then it is skimmed off something else.
Janet.....advise.
ready
Steve:
I agree that foods can be purchased in a very low bulk way and cooked well.
I was a food supervisor for 10 years and always came in under budget for food, but portions were State approved and the taste was there (even a puree peanut butter & jelly sandwich that looked like one)
I also might mean as in our case, the comissioners dictated who we can order supplies from.
If I went local and bought homegrown stuff at half the cost, it wasn't ok as it had to come from a BONEFIDE supplier that met the 'needs' of the commisioners...just saying.
Those are questions to ask at the next meeting.
ready
First, let me say thank you to kshillbilly for setting me straight on the road boss' wife not going to Tennessee to help with the truck. Thank you for that.
Now, on the sheriff's meal. You guys have pretty much answered everything that was asked. The sheriff has to make the meals for the amount that the commissioner agreed to pay. So if the sheriff is getting $2.00 a meal per prisoner that is $6.00 per day. Now, he has to feed three meals a day. There have to be a minimum of 2 hot meals and 1 cold meal. The sheriff can feed 3 hot meals if he so chooses.
Does the sheriff make a profit on these meals? Nope. Like my mother said, if the sheriff is making a profit, then he is starving the prisoners. I sure hope that the county commissioners are paying more than $2.00 a meal. Like I always told the commissioners, can you eat on $6.00 a day. Nope. No one can.
The sheriff's dispatchers are the ones who make the meals using the groceries that the sheriff provides. If he has meal plans, I would be surprised. We used to write down what we fed for every meal and were able to show that to whoever needed to see it.
And, yes, the sheriff pays for the food before he gets paid by the commissioners.
As for the out-of-county prisonsers, the county gets paid a set fee from the other county. The sheriff then uses this money to help support his budget. However, he still can't go over his budget. This money goes into the general fund to be used for whatever the commissioners say it will be used for. Doesn't mean the sheriff will get to use it, but most of the time it supports his budget.
Quote from: Patriot on September 25, 2011, 09:35:47 AM
Speaking of interesting uses of public funds.. I heard a rumor that the Sheriff receives a set amount of taxpayer funds for prisoner meals, that the sheriff personally makes meal decisions and buys food for the prisoners..... and any money not spent is kept by the sheriff as personal income. Any truth to this one?
Patriot, I think I forgot about this part of the questions. No, there is not any truth to the sheriff keeping this as personal income. If the sheriff did make a profit, he would have to report it as income, but it doesn't ever make a profit.
Thanks for the info.
The sheriff department actually made money last year, quit a bit as I heard and it did go into the county fund to be used for what the commissioners decided it to go to. As I recall before the current sheriff was in office the sheriff department used to order out food from local restaurants quit frequently for the prisoners. I have no idea how anyone could pay for that with $2.00 a meal. I sure can't eat out for that. So it's good to know that some are in the black during this economic condition.
Speaking of misuse of funds, Elk Valley School pays the "maintenance supervisor" a sum of $7,000 per year and for what? To say when a bus needs it's oil changed? Couldn't the bus drivers write the mileage down and say when it's time, well apparently not. So the maintenance supervisor says a certain bus needs some maintenance done. Who does it but the same maintenance supervisor? Let's say the bus needs some repairs. Who does the repairs? The maintenance supervisor, that's who. Then who inspects and makes sure the maintenance and repairs were done? The maintenance supervisor of course. How convenient.
Quote from: george on September 25, 2011, 08:22:59 PM
Speaking of misuse of funds, Elk Valley School pays the "maintenance supervisor" a sum of $7,000 per year and for what? To say when a bus needs it's oil changed? Couldn't the bus drivers write the mileage down and say when it's time, well apparently not. So the maintenance supervisor says a certain bus needs some maintenance done. Who does it but the same maintenance supervisor? Let's say the bus needs some repairs. Who does the repairs? The maintenance supervisor, that's who. Then who inspects and makes sure the maintenance and repairs were done? The maintenance supervisor of course. How convenient.
Interesting. Where can I find a job where I'm paid to direct the customer to my other paid job?
Quoteyou eat on $6.00 a day. Nope. No one can.
perhaps not you and I Janet, however those who are incarerated CAN sustain on 2 hot meals, and one cold on $2/day.
I will get a llist of meals and break it down for my county at cost...
ready
And if my facts are wrong...I will those purchase, fix and eat those damn meals all week!
I worked at a Hospital that detailed out meals to the jails...in otherwords piggy backed on the budget of the hospital, and that cost was much lower then the nursing home.
Has your county opted for the nursing home to fix those meals? (have to have the ability to transport to the jail, or another alternative.)
Hell, I would fix chicken salad sandwiches/apple/carrots/milk as the cold meal on the premises and still pass Health inspections!
Unfortunetly the prices for most foods are jacked as we are 'outside of walmart'.
Jeesh...
ready
I used the $2.00 per meal as an example. I don't know if that is what the sheriff is paid per meal or not. Surely it is more than that now.
The way the county makes money from this is that with out-of-county prisoners, the other county is charged per meal for their prisoners. The charge is higher than what the sheriff is paid for providing the meal. The other county pays the county for the meals and whatever is over what the sheriff gets, the county keeps. Elk County also charges for providing secure shelter for out-of-county prisoners. So what Elk County receives is for board and room, not just for meals. The money comes from the room and the supervision of the prisoners.
While Janet was sheriff, she made special deals with the food providers in Howard for prepared meals. Her cost of the meals was the same as she was paid for them. She usually picked up the meals, using her official vehicle, of course.
City of Newark has a bid contract with Mc Donalds.That's what the prisoners get. Officer goes through the drive through and picks up the meals. Fodder for lots of jokes!
If I had, say, a three month sentence imposed by the City of Newark, I wonder what a steady three meal a day diet from McDonalds would do for me?
Nothing good I'm sure! They do try to add salads and chicken and things but there sure aren't a lot of veggies.
With proper portions it actually won't be bad. The fries and soda are the worst part for you. The worst part of the meat is the trans fat. The saturated fat isn't bad, your body actually needs it.
Waldo, what would a 3 month diet of McD's do for you? About 30 pounds, I imagine.
Quote from: readyaimduck on September 25, 2011, 08:42:24 PM
perhaps not you and I Janet, however those who are incarerated CAN sustain on 2 hot meals, and one cold on $2/day.
I will get a llist of meals and break it down for my county at cost...
ready
you have to remember that unless the prisoner is working, they dont need more than 800 calories a day. IF they are sitting and laying around thats all that is needed to keep them healthy.
Quote from: W. Gray on September 26, 2011, 10:09:52 AM
If I had, say, a three month sentence imposed by the City of Newark, I wonder what a steady three meal a day diet from McDonalds would do for me?
Being that mcdonalds has some of the highest calorie and fat food on the market, you would nto be in good health. thats for sure!
Good lord, i can make enough biscuits gravy and eggs, chop up the sausage for the gravy and stretch it a whole lot farther than serving a piece of meat, to feed a jail cheap. Less than 10 dollars for it and it would feed quite a few inmates. I can make a hell of a lot of biscuits with 25lb of flour! and it only costs 7 dollars.
3 pounds of sausage for another 7 dollars and 3 dozen eggs for another 3 dollars, add with that grits and you can serve up breakfast for a week or more on less than 20 dollars.
Quote from Waldo:
If I had, say, a three month sentence imposed by the City of Newark.
Aint no way a judge with any ethics at all would give you just three months for the evils you have done Waldo---20 to life ----or--Walking the mile---walking the Green Mile !!!
Quote from: george on September 25, 2011, 08:22:59 PM
The sheriff department actually made money last year, quit a bit as I heard and it did go into the county fund to be used for what the commissioners decided it to go to. As I recall before the current sheriff was in office the sheriff department used to order out food from local restaurants quit frequently for the prisoners. I have no idea how anyone could pay for that with $2.00 a meal. I sure can't eat out for that. So it's good to know that some are in the black during this economic condition.
George, I don't know who you are, but I was the sheriff before the current sheriff. I did order out at S & J Cafe whom I negotiated with to accept what I was paid for meals, so if the county paid me $2.00 for the meal, then I paid S & J Cafe $2.00 for the meal. They were damn fine meals, too. S & J Cafe was an excellent place to eat. We also contracted with Friendship meals for the same thing, but that got to be too cumbersome when the state or federal government had to have names and ages all the time.
Friendship Meals did meals for us when the ice storm hit, too.
Now, let me explain how this works. The sheriff's office gets paid per day for each prisoner that he houses that is from out-of-county. Not per meal. Per day. It used to be $30.00 a day. I don't know what he gets now.
That jail holds 10 prisoners. I understood that there was 11 in there on Saturday. However; there isn't any regulations anymore of how many you can hold as long as everyone is in a cot and off the floor.
Okay, back to getting the money. The sheriff's officer, (not the sheriff), gets paid per day for each prisoner. The sheriff then gets paid for each meal per prisoner plus gets a fee per day for each prisoner.
The meal money helps pay for the groceries. It is up to the sheriff to come out even on the meals. If he wants to feed those prisoners steak and go over his daily meal costs, then he loses, because he doesn't get paid anymore then the set meal fee. The fee per day is for the sheriff to do the laundry, etc., for these prisoners. The county pays for all jail supplies and jail clothing.
Now, that was the way it was when I was in there. If the current sheriff may have a different deal. I don't know and I can't go and find out because I have to work.
As for the sheriff making a profit from the out-of-county prisoners, that isn't his to keep. That is the county's to use to off-set costs wherever the coummissioners see fit. To find out where that money goes, one would need to ask the treasurer and/or the county clerk.
Quote from George:
Speaking of misuse of funds, Elk Valley School pays the "maintenance supervisor" a sum of $7,000 per year
Damn George, seven grand a year sounds kinda excessive . Might be if they cut out some of that crap they wouldn't have had to raise the mill levy. I'm starting to think that as long as it's someone else's money the powers that be don't give a rats ass how they blow it. Starts with the feds and rolls right on down the hill.
Janet,
If, hypothetically, the sheriff received a 'food' check from the county made out personally to the sheriff, and if the sheriff purchased food with that money from his personal bank acct., and if the sheriff was then allowed to keep any excess funds, how would you view that 'deal'?
Speaking of abuse/misuse of county funds, equipment & personnel... try this one on.
http://www.cascity.com/howard/forum/index.php/topic,11780.msg176263/topicseen.html#msg176263 (http://www.cascity.com/howard/forum/index.php/topic,11780.msg176263/topicseen.html#msg176263)
Quote from: Patriot on September 27, 2011, 08:03:55 AM
Janet,
If, hypothetically, the sheriff received a 'food' check from the county made out personally to the sheriff, and if the sheriff purchased food with that money from his personal bank acct., and if the sheriff was then allowed to keep any excess funds, how would you view that 'deal'?
I would view that deal in the negative. I don't believe that is what is happening here. Does anyone know? Of course, if a sheriff did do that, that would be income that would have to be reported by the sheriff and he/she would have to pay taxes on that. However; I do not believe, IMHO, that a sheriff should profit on feeding the prisoners.
I do believe that there is a KSBA law that says "NO MEMBER SHALL RECEIVE COMPENSATION FOR ANY WORK OR DUTIES PREFORMED FOR THE DISTRICT"
So if Elk Valley is paying mileage to part of the school board members to attend meetings wouldn't that be in violation of the law? If the district were paying for some of the board members home internet bill would that not be considered "compensation" also? Why would they need the internet? In case the school sends them a PM to keep them abreast of school business? After spending $12,000/annually on cell phones couldn't they just call them?
I wonder if West Elk does some of the same things Anybody out there know ?
I will be more than glad to check on that. I can do that tomorrow if I get a chance to make a phone call while I am at work. If not, I will work on that next week unless someone else can do it.
To follow up on my statement of $ for jail guests....In our county, it is between $1.20-$1.30 a day (that would be for three meals. (following the dietary guildelines set by the State for x amount of oz per protein/fruits/carbs, etc)
It gets convoluted when you have 50 'guests' (I hate that word, but for the sake of PC will use it) at 7 am for breakfast, then 10 get bonded out at 10am...then, the balance of the food needs to be used up for the remaining jerks...sorry, GUESTS.
It can be done....however it is a floating balance and unpredictable as to how many to prepare for.
When I did it several years ago, buying in bulk of a flat of eggs (30 to a flat) were 7 cents per egg. If I had a connection for a local farmer....might be different, however how many locals have that many chickens laying hens year out (other than the "chicken house" that we used to call that yellow house on the north of 400 before the Severy turnoff)?
I don't think in this area we are feeding our 'guests' that well..however they do get food and the minimum is just as well with me.
You see, "give them bread and water" got thrown out by the higher ups....cuz' that was a mistreatment and inhumane.
Well, Exxxxxcccccccccccccuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuzzzzzzzzzzzzeeeee me!
sorry for ranting.
ready..... to eat crow (3oz protien, 1 oz carb, bones to chew for iron and feather for my pillow to think about what I had done)
crap I forgot the portion of fruit.....and bread.
ok a crow apple fruit pie.
That should meet the standards!
Quotedo believe that there is a KSBA law that says NO MEMBER SHALL RECEIVE COMPENSATION FOR ANY WORK OR DUTIES PREFORMED FOR THE DISTRICT
So if Elk Valley is paying mileage to part of the school board members to attend meetings wouldnt that be in violation of the law? If the district were paying for some of the board members home internet bill would that not be considered "compensation also? Why would they need the internet? In case the school sends them a PM to keep them abreast of school business? After spending $12,000/annually on cell phones couldn't they just call them?
George....interesting questions
Home internet bill would be a perk, and should be deducted from their salary I would gues...I said guess
however not pertinent to their job.
If they need to call them for school business in
disaster or outings....a cell phone is necessary...as well as a land line - not a PM message, as the electricity would be out then.
I think the computer age has warphed, ...ahem into the schools as the usual basics of "instant' notification.
Would love to see the bills on cell phone usage of Elk School districts...Payment plans for ONE teacher not the family pack plan.
ready to ....text lol
Quote from: readyaimduck on September 29, 2011, 07:42:14 PM
George....interesting questions
Home internet bill would be a perk, and should be deducted from their salary...
Correction... reported as income to the IRS via Form 1099 Misc in the amount of the actual cost.
Quote from Readyaimduck:
Home internet bill would be a perk, and should be deducted from their salary I would gues...I said guess
Did I miss something here ? I thought George said it was some board members that were getting their internet paid for and now you tell me it should be deducted from their salary -----the board members draw a salary ?
You're right Jar.
George was right in sayin that THEIR internet bill was paid for. If that is the case, then that is a compensation which is illegal.
and School Board members do not get paid...I was wrong.
Why do you try to confuse me with facts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;D
hell I was on a roll....now I will have to actuallly read all your drool!!!! :P
ready to eat my crow pie :(
QuoteGeorge was right in sayin that THEIR internet bill was paid for.
And that goes without saying
if George is right.
Quote from Janet:
« Reply #58 on: September 29, 2011, 06:16:23 pm »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I will be more than glad to check on that. I can do that tomorrow if I get a chance to make a phone call while I am at work. If not, I will work on that next week unless someone else can do it.
Janet,
Did you ever find out if all this is something that other schools do?
Not yet, jarhead. I haven't had a minutes time to myself at work for some stupid reason. But, I will do so as soon as I can. I will also be in Howard on Friday, so I may just stop in and ask. Either way, I will get an answer. I just don't know how soon.