Before I even get started...I now some (if not a lot) of folks on here think I'm paranoid or nuts or whatever, and thats fine. I'm okay with it. That being said I started this thread in order to put out a few ideas and tips for folks who know whats coming. I hope that I'm wrong about our future, but my gut tells me I'm not.
There has been a lot of talk on the radio and in the news and by bloggers about how to prepare for the worst case sceniro. And thats all well and good so long as you don't lose focus on the ultimate objective, which is simply to survive, everything else is secondary to that. Having a secure location stocked with food, medical supplies, weapons and ammo is always a good idea. But it is not taking the worst possible scenario into consideration. Lets say the SHTF and you have to go to your bunker. "No big deal" you say, you're all set. You have plenty of food, water, supplies to last you and your family for a long time, great! But what happens when that location is comprimised? Best case...you have time to stock up some provisions for "the road". Worst case...you have to leave NOW. Hopefully, you have planned for this. You've taken the time to outfit yourself with a pack containing a weeks worth of food, some basic medical stuffs, weapons and ammo. If you have a family each member has their own pack. If not, well...you're screwed.
BUG OUT PACK
Food--Putting to much focus into building a "bunker" or shelter is just as bad as not being prepared at all. Stocking up on canned goods is a good thing but don't neglect the dry goods. Canned foods while easy to prepare or cook, also add up weight wise real quick making it difficult to travel with them. Dry goods (beans, pastas, etc) are easy to store and don't take up a lot of room, but require water to cook. Nuts, dry cereal, grainola bars, jerky, dehydrated fruits, are much easier to travel with and can be eaten on the run. Now bear in mind that we're not talking about three course meals here. You want to take enough food to keep you alive and moving not fat and happy. You'd be surprised at how little food you actually need. A handfull of trail mix and a few pieces of jerky and your good for the day. Army Ranger school canidates live off of one MRE a day, ain't too happy about it, but it can be done. Point being, the lighter the food the more you can pack.
Good advice Varmint...we don't pick the scenarios we just have to be ready for whatever they end up being. Don't forget the can opener folks.
Water--Some folks have a tendency to overstate this provision. Don't get me wrong, it is important but don't try and stuff twenty or thirty bottles of water in your pack. Water purification tablets are smaller, lighter, and can provide you with more water than you can carry. The standard combat packing list for our Troops calls for a two quart water bladder or "camel back", two 1qt canteens worn on a web belt, and two 2qt collapsable canteens attached to an assualt pack, or in this case your bugout pack. Some folks will tell you to have a way to boil water to sanitize it. Good idea. But DO NOT rely on this. It takes time and fire. Fire makes smoke, which is a good way to give your position away.
Weapons/Ammo--Here is where a lot of debate will start. You'll here everything from black powder to AK's being recommened. Personally, for the purposes being discussed, I like a .22mag. It is small, lightweight, realitively quiet, you can carry a few hundred rounds without much weight, it can be used for hunting, defense, and is fairly common. That last bit cannot be overstated. When choosing a last resort weapon you may want to consider how hard it will be to find replacement ammo. .22, 9mm, .45, .223, and 12ga, will be prelivant in a SHTF worst case sceniaro.
Like this Varmit.....practical info instead of hysterical propaganda :)
Varmit, you're nuttier than squirrel shit or as Jarhead would put it, your cheese has slid off its' cracker. People don't need to stock up on food, water, ammo or build a bunker, put solar panels on their roof, a homemade wind generator, learn how to build a wood gassifier for wood gas or make an HHO generator. It's not as if thousands of blackbirds are falling from the sky, hundreds of thousands of fish are washing up on the shores, millions of bats are dying. If this was all happening I trust our government would give us a detailed reason for it. Like, firecrackers startling the birds causing mass trauma. Hailstones. Or that they all flew into each other when one bunch was going north and the other bunch was going south. Or that whole herds of sheep in Montana are dying because they caught pneumonia. I trust our government to talk to us like we're third graders and tell us they know what's good for us; they make our decisions. So with that being said, I am NOT worried about fuel shortage, food shortage and prices going up, taxes going up and yet my pay remains the same. Everyone line up at my door with your hand out. That's right, line up in a nice perfect straight row. LOL! So any of you people reading Varmit's posts on here, don't listen to him. I for one, do think he's hysterical. Now listen to me: If you got any extra canned goods, dried fruit, nuts, pork and beans, beanie weenies, instant mashed potatoes, dried milk, spam, sardines (preferably in mustard sauce), bottles of water or ammo, please feel free to come by and drop them off at my place. Again, Varmit is NUTS!----Robert Walker
P.S. Does anyone have any good ideas on how to keep water out of my bunker? Ain't had any problems in about 4 months now, but the rain will be back.
Varmit,
I think that if / when the time comes to head to the hills, after grabbing a .22 rifle, the next most important thing would be my pressure cooker, and a good supply of canning flats. Lots of old barns and cellars to find jars and rings but need them flats. You shoot a deer in hot weather you need to eat it fast unless you smoke it but a better way is to "can ' the meat,plus when in season you can pick lots of lambs-quarter and can it, then you got your veggies. Might be a pain in the butt to pressure cook over a wood fire but I'm sure it can be mastered.
I almost look forward to those times so I can start noodling again without John Law slapping me with a ticket for 'illegal hand fishing ". In survival mode all game laws are thrown out the window. :)
Finally, I totaly believe what you say Jarhead! ;)
Hey, anybody caught stealing the fish from my pond, that I'll need to survive, will be shot, smoked and/or canned. Build your own pond for your fish, don't even think about stealing mine or my chickens or anything else for that matter. Go buy those cases and cases of spam and sardines instead and help the economy at the same time. If I store my canning stuff in the barn that doesn't mean that it's available to you. :P
Heres a recipe for you Varmit.....Saskatoon Pemmican
1 c jerky, beef or venison
1 c dried Saskatoon berries or dried blueberries
1 c unroasted sunflower seeds or crushed nuts of any kind
2 ts honey
1/4 c peanut butter
1/2 ts cayenne [optional]
This version uses peanut butter rather than melted suet or lard as the binding agent, which is more palatable for today's health conscious diets. Grind [or pound] the dried meat to a mealy powder. Add the dried berries and seeds or nuts. Heat the honey, peanut butter and cayenne until softened. Blend. When cooled, store in a plastic bag or sausage casing in a cool dry place. It will keep for months.
Pam,
Many ,many years ago when I was a pup, Moline had an Army surplus store. They had cans of pemmican and because I had read everything I could lay my grubby little diggers on, if it pertained to Native Americans, I just had to have some of that pemmican. If the Indians could eat that pemmican, and like it, they were way tougher than I was. It was God awful tasting !!
Not sure why an Army surplus store had cans of pemmican but wonder if they fed it to the troops at one time. If so I highly suspect , what I tried to eat was left over from WW-I. Need to find out from some of these OLD military people if pemmican was in K-Rations or early C-Rations. Waldo---Sarge---Larry ????
LOL Jar....hence the peanut butter and honey :) instead of lard....sides I thought we were talkin survival rations here not Sat. nite dinner LOL!! Lots of things you can LIVE on taste bad enough you'd have to lick your butt to get the taste out of your mouth!
Hey Pam, you are talking to someone as a lad had to eat those C-Rations called Ham & Muthers, also known as Ham & Lima Beans, so I know what bad tasting survival food is !!! :)
After I posted about the Army surplus pemmican I googled it. Seems as though the army did use pemmican for the paratroopers in early 40's but didn't go over real good. Soldiers said they would rather starve to death than eat it.
Can't say about the pemmican.
The only kind thing I can say about C rations was for the small can of fruit cocktail included in some of the packs.
I opened a C Ration box in 1966 and the pack date on the box was 1951.
Waldo, In training we ate some of the old c-rats like the Ham & Lima's and those cookies that tasted like lard but in Nam the "rats " we had were mostly only a year old. I hated the Caraway cheese and fruit cake and disliked the date pudding but other than those I liked C-rations. I'm sure y'all got real creative, just like us, in making a feast out of c-rations and if you used enough C-4 you could even make the Beef & Rocks (potatoes ) soft enough to eat. I have a
MEAL, COMBAT, INDIVIDUAL
HAM & EGGS, CHOPPED
B-3 UNIT
sitting here on my "puter" desk. If you bring the P-38 I'll let you partake of a fine meal. It's vintage 11-67, but you can't smoke the Chesterfield cigarettes because they might be a tad harsh
:)
That's funny.I still have the p-38 Al sent me in my kitchen drawer."Just in case." ;D
Well Pilgrim, some call it a John Wayne opener. :)
For those who might be wondering what a p-38 is—is is not an Army lightning aircraft.
It has been described as the Army's greatest invention and as the most perfect invention ever conceived for combat operations. It was crash developed in 1942.
It is an ingenious but small less than two inch device used to open a tin can. One usually came in each box of C rations.
Many troops wore one with their dog tags, not only because it was immediately available to open a can, but also because it could be used for multifunctional purposes.
It has been used as a toothpick, fingernail cleaner, screwdriver, bottle opener, box cutter, chisel, scrapper, letter opener, paint can opener, wire stripper, et. al. Some forum folks can probably describe their own unique use.
The small axe looking protrusion would fold flat against the body of the tool.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad256/waldoegray/p38_opener_250.jpg)
Waldo,
If my memory serves me right there were 12 C-ration meals in a case but only four P-38's to a case. When the squad leader would divvy out the meals he always opened the case upside down so it made it fair when you picked your share you didn't get to pick only the good meals. We were allowed two meals a day when we were in the bush, so for example ,when we got re-supplied you would get 10 meals. By my math that should be enough for 5 days but we might not get re-supplied for 7 days or longer. I never did figure that one out !!!! Maybe that's why I only weighed 165 lbs when I left Nam , and that's not counting the 10 lbs of ring worms I had.
Back to the P-38---I will go to my grave thinking a P-38 got one of our squad leaders his 3rd Purple Heart and his ticket home so yes, they had lots of uses.
Jarhead, the pressure cooker would be nice, but not really practical, takes up to much space. But then again, pros and cons to everything i guess.
Military style MRE's are a good choice simply because they offer a varitey of foods and other utencils. The water activated heaters can have some "creative" uses when combined with a plastic bottle and small gravel 8).
Pam, I'll have to try that recipe. Thanks.
Shelter--When the SHTF and "bugging out" becomes necessary folks will generally tend to overlook a very important and obvious nessitiy (other than a dictionary :)), that is some form of shelter. While a compact little dome tent would be nice, in this situation it is not very practical. An 8 X 10 tarp and a few bungee cords are easier to pack, lighter to carry, can be set up just about anywhere, can be used for other purposes. Plus the silhouette from a tarp is easier to hide and can be place lower to the ground, making it easier to heat. Another advantage is that it takes about 1 minute to setup a simple "lean-to" type shelter if rain hits.
Hopefully, if "it" does happen it will be in either spring or summer. But Murphys Law being what it is it will be in the middle of winter when you have to hit the road. So, bedding will be as issue. A few sheets of clear, heavy plastic can work wonders for your disposition on a cold day. A heavy winter rated sleeping bag is nice, but bulkly and most are expensive. If looking for a cheaper route a "space blanket" combined with a military issue Poncho liner (the best thing the Army has ever or will ever issue) will go a long way to footing the bill.
Varmit, Right you are about the poncho liner. In hot weather it works as a mosquito net and in cold weather it's nice and warm. Seems like when they get wet they generate heat. Got one on my bed right now and only thing I don't like about it is they are so slick I lose that puppy during the night. There is an Army surplus store in Wichita on Harry St. that sells poncho liners. Yes a tarp would be nice for a shelter but I'm sure you know how to build a nice waterproof shelter with just a few poles and a bunch of cat tails or branches off a cedar tree. You build a cat tail shelter and I will call you "Muskrat Billy". :)
Sorry Jarhead, no can do...cattails make me sneeze.
You're right about the poncho liners being slick. But you can solve this by sewing it inbetween two pieces of cotton or wool material. Just be sure to sew in a zipper so the liner can be removed, makes washing easier.
Another item that has a thousand and one uses and should be included in every Bug Out bag...heavy duty zip ties. Can be used as make-shift cuffs, quick and secure turniquets, and they greatly aid the construction of a more permanent type shelter.
Pam, quick question...what the hell is a Saskatoon?
Billy, you dumb shit---that's that big hairy ape-thing that they have in Oregon--aint it ? :)
scat coon is in the white house....... im bad thats saskatoon. ::)
OK, Varmit, I aint Pam and I also wondered what a saskatoon was so looked it up. It's a berry that grows in Alaska, Canada and NW U.S.. When you go to Alaska to pick some tell Sarah ol Ron said 'Howdy"---and bring me back a cooler full of halibut filets !!
Jarhead you dummy, you're talkin 'bout the sac..saks...sakawe...Bigfoot.
And I ain't goin to alaska, its too damned cold. You'll have to settle for catfish.
varmit dont eat any berrys off of big foot :-X
Hillbilly, not only is you nasty...thats just plain wrong.
sac..saks..sakawe/ saskatoon or sasquatch dont eat it if you cant say it in public. :o
Saskatoon is a city in Saskatchewan.
::) geez u guys :P.....yes Varmit it is the name of a bush and the berries that grow on that bush AND a city in Saskatchewan LOL. It is a Cree recipe :)
Pam, this is totally unrelated but when I read "Cree" make me think "Creek". Have you ever read a book named "Creek Mary's Blood" ? I read it years ago and thought it was a good book
Jarhead, after reading through here again, I read your post about using your poncho on your bed. You said it's slick and it keeps falling off in the floor during the night. Too avoid those unsightly yellow stains on your sheets buy a plastic fitted sheet instead. This goes for Varmit too. I knew you guys were bedwetters! ---Robert
You know Robert, theres a saying "People that play with fire wet the bed". Now considering your interest in wood gasifiers and hydrogen bombs..oh, I mean hydrogen "generators" I take it you must have first hand knowledge and expirence with plastic sheets, so I'll just have to take your word for it. 8)
Jar, the name sounds familiar but if I have it's been so long ago I dont remember :P I looked it up and I've read a lot of Dee Browns books but dont remember this one. Have to see if I can find it somewhere
Varmit...why dont you start a thread about plain-livin, makin do, survival ...whatever you want to call it. I bet there is a lot of know-how out there that we all could share which will do a lot more good than the negative "oh we are all screwed" posts do.
Seriously.....bet a LOT of us would read it and participate!
Pam...I had considered doing just that but finally rejected the idea because I don't think people (as a whole) are willing to do that. I mean, they pay it alot of lip service but at the end of the day aren't willing to back up their claims. Thats one of the reasons why I started this thread. Well that and I honestly think that we are headed for a total shitstorm. I know theres quite a few folks out there that are preparing for what is coming, or that want to but don't know how and are just kinda winging it. So..I started this thread as a way to exchange ideas and information.
But on a lighter note I have started taking my oldest boy out camping to teach him about outdoor survival. Building shelter with just a pocket knife and a bit of twine, setting traps for small game, evasion techniques, observe and report, and basic bushcraft, that sort of thing. We had our first little trip last weekend and let me just say that I ain't as young as I used to be, because DAMN it was cold. We are supposed to go out this weekend. Gonna focus on shelter and camp set up.
Those berries grow in northern Minnesota --- Fred, Mom and Dad McDonald and I picked many of them and they make a mighty fine pot of jam or jelly. Yummmmmmmy !!! Or stewed with a little cream and sugar.
Varmit....Yeah I get your point on that but still think its a good idea....and thats a good thing you are doin with your son. I've known for a FEW years now that the time was comin when the ones who make it are the ones who learn how to the Old ways. I did the same with my boys when they were small and now I know at least one is doin the same with his. When they are young they see it as fun but it will stick with em and they will remember it when they need it.
Just had a slap the forehead DUH moment...when I said you oughta start a thread I shoulda said category/section or whatever.....duh Pam this is a thread LOL
Even if the shitstorm is just a situation like the Depression was there are things people can learn that will save em.
I realize that buggin out may be the only option in some situations but in just the case of no money etc. I stopped planting hybrid plants in my garden and have been lookin for and experimenting with heirloom seeds and plants and learnin how to save seeds for a few years now. I'm goin to learn how to use a bow this year too. I've been planting and learning how to dry and use herbs for simple medicine.....gonna ramp it up on that one.
Jo...My Joe is workin in minnesota..wish it was berry pickin time :)
Using herbs...just remember to hang it UPSIDE DOWN, just like tobacco. Red may be ripe but purple is waaaay better. ;)
Just what particular "herb" you talking about Varmit ?
Uhhhhhh......parsely.
Quote from: Varmit on January 17, 2011, 07:15:32 PM
Using herbs...just remember to hang it UPSIDE DOWN, just like tobacco. Red may be ripe but purple is waaaay better. ;)
check 8) LOL