Convince Me

[Lookatmeknow!!]

Severy is K thru 3rd and also have a preschool and special ed teacher.  Moline is 4-6 with a kindergarten and preschool and special ed teacher.  There is only on class that has two teachers and that is the 6th grade.  So they have cut the number of teachers down.  Not really in half, but teacher size is down.

[pepelect]

Pep, what part of my post was not the 'truth'? The part that you disagree with? I labeled the part that I said was my own opinion as being my own opinion. The high school building is not cost effective per square foot only because it is bigger? Huh?

The state audit recommended that the inefficients small schools in Kansas be consolidated.  It did not say we are next on the chopping block.  I think a 5to7 straw poll is a consensus.  It is not unanimous but would still keep the state from thinking that we are going to continue on the same wasteful spending spree that we have been on for twenty years.  Yes the bigger the square foot the larger the amount of area to teach.  You can't teach physical education in a broom closet to very many students at a time.  The grade schools are not equipped to teach high school classes.  To suggest that they are equal to the high school building is foolish.  It is apples to oranges. 

If it was as simple as you make it out don't you think that it would have already been tried?  It costsmore money to operate the three campus system than what funds we have to do so.  We are trying to change the way we spend what little money we have to better educate our children. 

How is that making me a villian in this situation?  I will agree with every logical point you bring forward. 

[sixdogsmom]

Pep, just a couple of comments--- the first is, the last time I looked, Moline has a very nice gymnasium, and I suspect that Severy does too. Second, the concensus  or the statement that the board could not reach a consensus came from a schoolboard member, not an assumptiion by myself or anyone else other than the board. Third, If the highschool is not efficient, then maybe it has too few students for its' size; a room designed for 30-40 students should not be supported nor expect to be supported by 10-15 students. Perhaps it would be best for the highschool to be moved to another location where the building size more closely matches the student body size. After all this student body has been shrinking for quite awhile, and will probably continue do so.

If you consider yourself a villian, it's okay by me, I have never called you that. And as far as logic is concerned, I am still awaiting the logic used to build a building, possibly dessimate two communities, lay off many school employees, and still expect them to pay an outrageous amount of taxes. All this for a shrinking student body throughout the district. That my friend, is not logical IMHO.

[pepelect]

Moline's has a multipurpose room.  It is too small to be used as a basketball gym.  It is too small to be used as a  volleyball gym.  It is not even utilized as a stage for music and plays.  It doesn't have enough seating for the events mentioned.  Severy's gym is large enough but is not insulated.  So you have $4000 gas bills just to  keep it luke warm.  It only has one furnace that works and the water lines are a joke.   I never said the high school was not efficient.  It has higher utilities per square foot.  That is not all you have to look at.  Every bathroom is ADA compliant.   The facility is large enough to handle more than one event at a time.  The grade schools are very hard to cool.  The gas boilers in both elementary schools are old and need replaced.  The high school doesn't have asbestos issues.  There is no lead paint issues. 

You can't even get a wheel chair in to the front door at Moline.

It is not the job of the school system to employ people.   It the job of the school system to educate.

The logic is that with less students you need less school.  Why is keeping two elementary buildings economically viable if we only need one no matter where they are located?  What does the location of the building have to do with the quality of the education.  It is more logical to have one efficient campus of pre-k to 12th at one location.   A new building designed for the education of today is more logical than two buildings designed for fifty years ago.  It costs less to build a school building with better windows, doors, tornado protection, security than to keep pouring money into a aged structure for the next 15 years.   It is more logical to have less school employees that are not needed and pay teachers what they deserve.    It is logical to have one central campus to eliminate redundant busing.

How many standards of excellence awards will we achieve if we are actually spending money on education not maintenance and upkeep?


2009 Standards of Excellence Schools


D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Reading 7
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Reading 8
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Reading Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Math 6
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Math 7
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Math Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Science 7
D0282 2442 West Elk Howard West Elk Jr‐Sr High Science Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Reading 3
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Reading 5
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Math 3
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Math 4
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Math 5
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Math Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2444 West Elk Moline Elem Science Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Reading 5
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Reading Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Math 4
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Math 5
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Math Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Science Bldg.‐Wide
D0282 2448 West Elk Severy Elem Writing Bldg.‐Wide

[sixdogsmom]

So, 5.5 mill will buy us a building that never needs maintainence, requires no energy, and will make Einsteins of all of the zero students left when they have been sent to another district? You know in your heart of hearts it is coming. Does it really make sense to spend all that money on a building that we do not really need. Why didn't you build a new building when you opened the grocery? I know that the renovations you did make had to be very expensive, but in the end it was considered to be better than building from scratch wasn't it? I would like to know why it is that both elementary schools are needing all these things and no budgeting had been done for it. Only foolish people would assume that a furnace, pipes etc would never need maintainence. There isn't enough seating for events at Moline? Hello? You ever been to a Moline event, must've been late to not find a seat. We usually do have a good turnout of parents and members of the community. And that's great! We want to keep that sense of community!

[srkruzich]

and will make Einsteins of all of the zero students left when they have been sent to another district? You know in your heart of hearts it is coming. Does it really make sense to spend all that money on a building that we do not really need. Why didn't you build a new building when you opened the grocery? I know that

i was wondering about that too, most of elk is aging population, not a young population having children.   One other thing i was wondering about too is if you consolidate all the schools in howard, how long would a kid that lives at the farthest corner of the county have to ride a bus to and from school everyday.

if the schoolkids are dwindling, how about a smaller campus designed so that it can be added onto later on IF there is a increase in kids?  I believe like you do sixdogs that when schools shut down so goes the town.  Maybe there will be residents there, but itwon't thrive.  Seen far too many towns collapse when the school disappeared.  Its a fact that people move to a town with a local school around.  That is one of the biggest selling points in the real estate market when marketing a home.  People want to know how far the school is from their potential new home.  Its ranked right up there with job distance.

[pepelect]

New buildings provide better lighting from natural light requiring less electrical lighting.  The electrical lighting that is provided is very high efficient and designed for a better learning environment.  The windows are insulated low e keeping out summer heat and letting light fill the rooms.  The walls are insulated to a high r value.  The hvac systems have electronic control systems that turn heat/cool on and off at different times of the day.  It is a waste of money to heat/cool when there is no one in the building.  The wall systems actually let the building breathe letting moisture out of the building instead of rotting the structure.  Class rooms are designed to allow technology to be seamlessly used to make the student absorb the information in different ways.  Every child learns differently so the classroom has to have the ability to meet that need.  Double doors are a very good way of keeping the cooled/heated environment of the inside away from the outside atmosphere.  We can communicate through out a new structure via intercom or integrated computer network.  Safety from harsh weather is a very big deal.  A hardened structure is the best bet against tornado in Kansas.  

Every dollar that we spend to make the building more efficient saves that much or more in future energy needs.  If you cut the energy consumption of the building by only 10 percent in ten years you have paid for the installation.  In ten years the money you would have spent on the gas bill or electricity bill could be used to pay a teacher to actually teach.  

I have totally rebuilt the entire structure from what I purchased 14 year ago.  I tore down three perfectly good 50+ year old structures and integrated the lot into a larger usable building.  

If I could do it all over again I would have built a huge building 14 years ago.  It would have made more sense to build a new stand alone building when we decided to build on  the grocery store.  If I would have owned property next to a highway or in a larger lot I would have done just that.  I would have spent less money and it would have been done allot faster than what we are doing.  

I have been to every event for the last 8 years at Moline and there isn't enough seating for events that is why for the last 3 years all the programs have been held at the high school auditorium or gym.  

[Joanna]

There are a lot of people in this area working long hours to make it a better place to live, to work and to raise families.  The same questions have been asked dozens of times and have been patiently and ably answered again and again.  Refusing to admit there is a problem is not going to make it go away.

A defeatist attitude is so frustrating for people who are working to make the population and economy improve.  Vague comments that the school population will likely decrease till it's gone, or that the state will likely force a consolidation in the future are not realistic and not helpful to either side of the issue. It is definitely a negative attitude for a home town or district.  Is there no hope then, for anyone in small rural towns?  Why would a person live in a place that they so obviously believe has no future? I certainly didn't move here to die; I moved here to enjoy life even more.

I believe Elk County is getting better by leaps and bounds.  I believe that a new facility for the grade school will be cheaper in the long run; and I believe it will definitely improve the education of our students, partly by using available money for actual teaching instead of plumbing, roofing or other structural maintenance issues.  We all know that every building need maintenance, but it is also common sense that a new building will need a fraction of the maintenance of two 40something year old buildings.  It would have been great if the school board over the last 40 years had put back money for new boilers, but it didn't happen... maybe for the same reason so many people don't put back more money for retirement ~ the extra cash just wasn't there. At any rate, we can't change the past, just work to make the future better.

My children are grown, but I see how the education of all the area children is important to my life.  With one campus, it is likely we won't have as many school employees, however if the ones we have are better paid it is a good tradeoff in my opinion; and to have fewer staff because we need less and not because we can't afford them is a good thing. I know my taxes will go up, both for my home and my farm, but they won't be outrageous; they will be my fair share and part of the cost of owning property in USD#282, Kansas, USA. I'm committed to my home.  I will continue to work to make my community improve and grow as best I can.  I feel confident in my decision to vote yes.

[Teresa]

Well said Joanna..and I agree 100%....

[Jane]

I know I will be in trouble for this. Why not leave the high school the way it is and use the Longton School as the grade School?
I sure that has been looked into.
Jane