Life in the Oink Sector

[redcliffsw]

The money and rules are coming from the Fed's.
Billy, you had it right the first time - it's indoctrinators.

There's been news on this forum regarding the possibility
of building a new public school in West Elk.   Don't know
why would anyone would want to continue to support
a public school system?  It would be easy to vote "no"
on that.

[Diane Amberg]

I have to agree with Cat on this one. If you've never been around a broad spectrum of " special '' kids you can't imagine the extreme problems some of them have. It isn't always lack of intelligence. The severe ones with extreme physical outbursts MUST be excluded from the general student population for the safety of all. Years ago ( here) the parents demanded that their special children be "taught." So special rooms or wings were built on schools to handle the fetal alcohol and drug kids and the ones that just were who they were. I have a good friend who worked with those kids for many years. She was very dedicated to them and you just can't understand unless you see it for yourself. She transferred to a regular school this year and has commented that she can finally wear real clothes to school , not blue jeans and tee shirts, with no fear of anyone trying to rip them off her. She can finally wear jewelry to school. The kids don't tear their own clothes off during out of control tantrums.
I'm not sure I agree with the actual time out room I saw, but I do understand the concept. Keep in mind, if you have to hire enough extra people to have a person in the room during the time out it adds extra expense, because that person isn't available to the other students during that time. Plus the whole idea is to limit "input" that's why the walls are plain.These kids can go on emotional overload very quickly. They don't do well in the usual busy classroom with lots of colorful posters on the walls and all the stuff you see as "normal." What would you have us do with these kids? Should they be institutionalized at an early age and forgotten? Should each one be in a separate room with a teacher and an aide? Should schools demand that the kids be home schooled?  A few of you just don't get it, and don't want to. You are off on your own agendas that just don't work when the rubber hits the road. When a teacher is trying to keep an out of control kid from chewing off his own tongue during a melt down, "indoctrination" is the last thing on the teacher's mind.

[Catwoman]

I would pay money to watch some have to go to school, take the actual education courses and have to actually learn about what it is that they claim to be experts on...Ignorance is bliss...To everyone except those who have to listen to it.

[flo]

The education that is taught to the children now is a whole different thing than what we were taught.  Yes, there is still the main three R's - but it is much more complicated now.  Starting in Kindergarten or soon after they learn the basics of computors and science is such much more and this "new" math is above my head.  I can come up with the same answer, but how I arrive at this answer is not the way it is done now.  Most of my grandchildren were studying in elementary what I had in high school.  Anyone watch "Are you Smarter than a Fifth Grader"?  Guess what, I have found I'm not and I doubt seriously anyone else my age is.  May be smarter at life, but not when it comes to what they are learning at a much younger age.  Geometry? that was an upper grade subject in highschool course.  AND for a teacher to be able to teach their students on this level of learning, they must also keep going back to school. I often wonder if a lot of the behavior problems of some children aren't contributed from having so much thrown at them at such a young age and the push to be a high achiever by some parents and other parents that take no interest what so ever in what their child is doing as long as they stay out of their way.  Was Dr. Spock a good teacher at how to discipline your child? When I was raising my girls, I thought his book was just great, for applying "to their butt's".  NO, I did not beat my children, but they knew what a spanking was and they aren't "warped" from it.   

[kshillbillys]

Back to the Postal Service part of this discussion..I'm glad I went to work and had all day to calm down about this before I wrote something this morning...Billy--The USPS operates on income from the sale of postage, NOT on the backs of taxpayers....

Since its reorganization in to an independent organization, the USPS has become self-sufficient and has not received taxpayer-dollars since the early 1980s. The decline of mail volume due to increased usage of e-mail has forced the postal service to look to other sources of revenue while cutting costs to maintain this financial balance.


Prefunding retirement and declining mail volume are the reason that the USPS is in the mess it's in. We aren't up there begging for a handout; we are asking that we be allowed to stop prefunding retirement since no one else has to.

[Varmit]

Diane, there are laws in place covering "time out" rooms.  The room that was dipicted in that youtube piece was in clear violation of the law.  As for special ed kids go, no, they should not be included in regualr classrooms.  Yes, they can be a handful, but that is part of a teachers job.  Locking these children in a cell and basically forgetting about them is not helping the child. 

[Diane Amberg]

Varmit why do you think kids who go to decompression rooms are "forgotten about" by the teachers? These kids are not your usual special ed kids, who often can be mainstreamed into regular classes for part of the day. The really hard core cases are clearly emotionally and mentally disturbed.  Some are autistic of one form or another, some are other things. Some have a whole bucket of physical problems that go along with it.  Some, as they mature, begin expressing sexually deviant behaviors. They don't easily understand "rules" and right from wrong. Some of the rooms are equipped with flush mounted cameras or shatter proof two way mirrors. I have another friend who is an aide for some middle school age autistic kids. They come see me at the fire house every year. They aren't violent or we couldn't do it. I have no problem working with them. But some groups even I won't work with. They are just too much and corporal punishment is used with them, sort of a tough love thing. I don't have the training to work with them and I have the greatest respect for those who do. You can't possibly know anything about it unless you have a family member who fits the category.

[Varmit]

Diane, didn't you see the part of that video that explained that there was a sheet covering the only window into that room? 

[Diane Amberg]

The sheet doesn't bother me, it could be lifted to check on the child, who was probably screaming his head off. I don't understand the x on the floor bit, but I wasn't there. I can't speak about this case of course, but usually in ODD cases, the parents meet with the school on a regular basis and the parents sign an agreement as to what kind of behavior modification method can be used and in what case. The school may have been totally wrong, but, like Cat, I'd have to know a lot more. Nobody can just generalize with something like that.

[Varmit]

Whose generalizing?  That child was put in a room, in his underwear, unobserved and told to stand on an "X" on the floor.  The law states that a child in a "time out" room has to be observed constantly, not just checked on from time to time.  His mother said that she was in contact with the school on a daily basis and did not agree with this type of treatment for her child.