A Fast Read on Drug Cartels and the Border

[Varmit]

Diane, these scum are nothing to fear.  Yes, they do bad things, yes, they are evil, and yes they should be dealt with. The thing about fear, is what it leads to.  As a child I used to be afraid of the dark and the monsters that lurk there, but gradually that began to change.  First, I began to grow tired of being afraid of the monsters.  Then, I got mad at the monsters for making me afraid. Next, I began to loath the monsters that made me afraid.  After that, I began to hate the monsters.  Finally, I began to hunt the monsters, to stalk them.  I learned that it wasn't the dark that was against me, so I used it to hunt the monsters.  Soon, I chased to monsters away. 

People need to quit being afraid of the "monsters" and deal with them.

[pam]

  You have a point Varmit but so does Diane. Whoever stands up to them has to be willing to accept the consequences which COULD and probably WOULD include somebody they love being killed or worse in cold-blood as a warning or retaliation. That's just a fact...and it takes a special kind of person to face such a fear and do it anyway.
   Quite frankly....the reason such groups have such a foothold is precisely because there aren't very many of those kind of people at all anymore. More people have the guts to die themselves than have the guts to take the chance of somthing happening to their loved ones if they stand up.
  We can ALL talk about it...very few of us can DO it.

[Diane Amberg]

Frank and all ....honest, I'm NOT for general gun control, I just wish someone could wave a magic wand and make the problem of the innocents go away. I know that's not realistic. I've been riding the ambulance for so many years and have picked up so many shootings. Some were accidental, some were hot blooded anger, many were just plain stupid. Many had drugs or alcohol connections. If they, the hard core bad guys, would just shoot each other, maybe I wouldn't mind so much.  But so often they miss! There are areas of most big cities where I wish the police could sweep through and clean out the guns, but it wouldn't last and the existing laws don't support it. The jump squads that scoop up guns on the street do help some, but not enough. I sure don't know the answer. A lot of people have reasonably good idea, but the implementation always seems to hit road blocks. I've done ambulance stand by on hostage situations, and believe me that does things to your blood pressure! You never know how it will turn out.  We've had crews shot at....not remotely the same as monsters under the bed. So far I've only carried pepper spray and have threatened, but never had to use it. Back in the 70's when Wilmington was having riots, I considered a carry permit, but things settled down before I actually needed  it. In the close quarters of an ambulance, I didn't want to have to worry about someone trying to take the gun it away from me. That would take time from treating the patient.  Right now I have the greatest respect for our Boarder Patrol, and I'm so glad those two guys are out of prison now. They were treated very poorly. I hope Pres. O will pardon them.

[Varmit]

Just in case you missed it, or I mistook your post....the monsters under the bed thing, was a metaphor, diane.  You say that you are not adbocating gun control, but your posts sound differently. 

Yes, guns can be dangerous if misused, yes they can kill people, limiting their numbers or types won't solve anything.  Just as limiting the type of cars drunk drivers use to kill people won't solve anything.

[Diane Amberg]

I really did understand your metaphor. I'm not for gun control because I know it wouldn't work, but I don't understand why some people equate person freedom with the right to own weapons that have such a huge capacity for overkill...machine guns and similar. I don't mean true collectors, they are usually well known in gun clubs and firearms circles.  We own guns, I used to shoot at the range,( in fact our police chief taught me to shoot) but the "people killing" is getting worse and worse and it seems there is a whole segment that knows no other way to decide disputes. I just don't understand the mental connection with freedom and guns. The writers of the 2nd amendment might have made it a bit more restrictive if they had known what kind of "arms" would be invented years later. The thinking is just so different now. Wouldn't you be upset if one of your kids took a 45 to school for "show and tell?" W-O-O! And yes, people do over react. I see  it often.

[pam]

I just don't understand the mental connection with freedom and guns.

The connection for me is having the ability to protect myself and mine instead of waiting for somebody else to come do it for me. I live far enough out that people really DO have trouble finding us, but there is an awful lot of crime for being in a basically rural county. By the time the "authorities" get here it's gonna be WAY too late for em to do anything but stick me in a bag... for real.

it's independance from outside help in a time of need.

[Diane Amberg]

Pam, I understand that. I really do. But how would you know if someone planned to do you harm? Black hats?   I feel the same way about seat belt laws. There are people who make a connection between their freedom and their"right" to not wear a seat belt.

[pam]

Lol no I don't think the black hat thing will work I'm just sayin I want to have the ability to do somthing if need be. Even havin to GET to it if somthin happens I'll still have a better chance than waitin for somebody else to come save me, least I can take em with me.

I also don't wear a seat-belt....I can't stand to be confined......ask anybody who has ever tried to lol

[srkruzich]

I just don't understand the mental connection with freedom and guns. The writers of the 2nd amendment might have made it a bit more restrictive if they had known what kind of "arms" would be invented years later. The thinking is just so different now. Wouldn't you be upset if one of your kids took a 45 to school for "show and tell?" W-O-O! And yes, people do over react. I see  it often.

The writers of the 2nd amendment were men like franklin who was a inventor.  They did realize that newer and bigger and more powerful weapons would be developed over the years. 
They also knew that the government would have such weapons and wanted to make sure that the PEOPLE had a means to remove said government if needed.  Freedom is secured by guns and the right to own and use them.  Without them the government could not be controlled. 

The problems your facing with the shootings would be greatly reduced if they stopped this insane attempt to ban guns or control them so much you can't use them to defend yourself.   Take Kennesaw Georgia for example.  about 20 years ago they enacted a law that every resident of Kennessaw must own a gun.  Overnight the crime dropped to almost nil.  All violent crimes ceased to exist.  The criminals didn't know who was armed because everyone was required to own a gun. So they left and went elsewhere where they wouldn't get shot.   

[Warph]

I'm quite familiar with Kennesaw as I lived in Athens, GA right after I retired from State.  Kennesaw is a beautiful city just north of Atlanta and is known as "Gun Town USA."  They also have a great Southern Museum of Civil War and Locomotive History.  In March 1982 the small town of Kennesaw unanimously passed an ordinance requiring each head of household to own and maintain a gun.  Also written into the law is a pauper and religious exemption clause where if you can't afford a gun or don't believe in it you don't have to comply with the law.  Basically it's a law that has never been enforced and empowers people to own a weapon for self defense. 

Then Kennesaw's law was amended in 1983 to exclude convicted felons, those who conscientiously object to firearm ownership, and those with a mental or physical disability that would make firearm ownership dangerous.  The crime rate fell after this law was passed, and even though the population grew five fold, the crime rate is still lower than the pre-1982 rate.  This town has also remained murder free during the past twenty-six years. 

The law reduced crime in the city and as a result another city in Morton Grove, Illinois decides to upstart Kennesaw, Ga.  They designed a law banning guns in their city and as you might have guessed, crime went way up in Morton Grove. 

Taking guns off the streets does not reduce crime.  Everywhere concealed carry laws (laws that allow ordinary citizens to carry weapons) have been enacted the crime rate plummeted.  Guns in the hands of reasonable people lower crime.  Even if the police force is perfect, officers only arrive after the crime has been committed.  Having a weapon can deter the criminal and save our lives and the lives of our loved ones.