School Changes

[Tobina+1]

Yes, I agree, well said, Gina!

OK, here's an idea... let's do RESEARCH!  KSHSAA website shows there are 64 high schools in Kansas that are classified as 2A schools.  (http://www.kshsaa.org/class.html).  I'm betting that every one of those other 63 schools are facing the same budget crisis, decline in enrollment, and teacher issues as we are.  So, let's do some research to see what these other 63 schools are doing to fight these trends and if they've come up with some creative ideas that we can borrow...

These are the things I'd like to know from each school...
Size of county (sq miles)
Size of school district (sq miles)
How many towns in your school district. (Distance between towns)
How many school districts in your county. (Size of other districts in county)
How many buildings does your school have (K-12).
How many miles (one-way) are your bus routes. (Average time spent on bus)
How many teachers/staff.
Has your enrollment increased or decreased over the last 3 years; by how much.
What cost-cutting measures have you done over the last year, or will do next year.

[Tobina+1]

OK, found a very useful and interesting website...
http://www.ksde.org/Default.aspx?tabid=223
Click on any county and find out ALL you want about the schools.  I only had time to research 1 other school over my lunch break... here's the comparison to EK...

Size of County (sq miles)     EK=650,  RA=1069
Size of School District (sq miles)     EK=541,  RA= 740
Population of county (2000)     EK=3261,   RA=2966
Towns in District (miles between)  WE= 3, 7 miles, 12 miles   RCHS= 2, 21 miles
Districts in County     EK = 2, RA = 1 (although there is a 1A school that serves 1 small town in RA, but school is in CN county)
How many buildings     WE=  4 registered w/ state, in 3 towns    RCHS= 2 registered w/ state, all in same town
How many children are bused     WE= 357.5 students (105 live less than 2.5 miles from school),  RCHS= 140 students
(I couldn't find mileage; I'll have to call the district offices)
How many teachers/staff     WE= 145.4   RCHS= 57.4
     Certified     WE= 57   RCHS= 34.5
        Of those certified staff, how many in Central office   WE= 5   RCHS= 0.5
     Non-Certified     WE=88.4   RCHS= 22.9
Enrollment numbers over 3 years  WE=  360 - 350 - 345 (2006, 2007, 2008)    RCHS= 328 - 312 - 323 (2006, 2007, 2008)

I did not yet call these offices to find out what cost-cutting measures they have done.  What I find interesting is a few things...
-Size of county and district, with only about 20 students difference (WE has about 20 more, and RA is larger county.)
-Number of miles between the towns that the district serves.  Something to keep in mind as you think about how much your own kids in EK have to ride the bus.
- How many students are bused in each of the districts, and why WE is busing so many that live so close to school?
- Number of staff/teachers difference between the school districts is HUGE!  WE has over double the amount of staff, for only 20 more kids!

I did not analyze positions of the staff compared between the schools.  I do know that RCHS Superintendent is also the Grade school principal.
No, this is not to point fingers at one school or another.  This is just simply a RESEARCH project to compare schools and maybe see if it brings to light other cost-saving options.  I really want to know what the schools have planned to cut costs; maybe tomorrow...

[Wilma]

I think you have found quite a lot.  I didn't realize that so many kids were being bussed.  I say realized because I do know that a bus goes through this part of town, supposedly to pick up kids or drop them off.  Do the buses do this in Severy and Moline, too?  Whatever happened to the kids having to get themselves to school?  Don't answer that.  I know that one, too.  Part of the times.  Besides this only affects my pocketbook, not my lifestyle.

[sixdogsmom]

Question: When West Elk Jr/Sr Highschool was first built, how many students were there? Now this is just for that school, not the grade schools at Moline and Severy.

[MarkHall]

Ok... nobody quote me on this... but I think the high-water mark for enrollment at WEHS was in the early 90's and somewhere around 450, maybe even close to 500 K-12. Someone with some old yearbooks could probably figure it out if the data isn't on the KSDE site somewhere. Weren't we a 3A school for a while in the 90's?

The busing issue has come up before, and if memory serves me correct, the busing is reimbursed by the state, so you don't really save any money by reducing the number of busses or routes that you run. Again, please don't hold me to that.

[pepelect]

But we do have to buy and maintain the buses.   Wouldn't that money be better spent on something other than diesel?   Just because the state picks up the tab doesn't mean it is a practice that we need to continue.  If it is wrong, inefficient, redundant, or just to appease a noisy constituency is not a justifiable reason to continue.  I want to know if we could down size the bus fleet to smaller more efficient bus that would be 90%full instead of driving around in 50%capacity larger buses?  How would it affect the education of the student if you have to walk a block and a half to the bus stop instead of your front lawn?  Maybe we  could make up for the fact that we only have P.E. every other day.   I have not heard of a single car student accident in the past even during shift changes.....  Unless that student is behind the wheel. 

If 105 students are with in the 2.5 mile circle of the school I think that 210 shoes might get a workout.  It would be good for the health of the student, good for the environment, and good for the bottom line.   


It only took the kdot 29 years to put a school zone light on the highway for the protection and safety of our high school children.  I am willing to bet the city would paint a crosswalk in at least half that time.

[Lookatmeknow!!]

I think, but not sure, that kids that are younger than K or K and under have to be picked up at there house?  Not sure, or is this just a safety thing that they have in place?  I know that I have preschoolers dropped off at the daycare and they are in the biggest oldest bus that the school has.  And there is no way enough of them to fill up the bus.  But not just busing is the issue, its also finding drivers that we have a problem with, or at least we have in the past.  The daycare is maybe a couple of blocks from the high school, and there are three stops right around here everyday.  I would be willing to take my kids to the high school, or let them walk, now that my middle one is half way through kindergarten.  But I do have to say that the kids do drive like mad around and up and down Elk street.  I have called the sheriff many times regarding this issue.  There is a sign that says school zone, or something to that effect on Elk street, but not sure why nothing is done.  So that is an issue to me as a parent.

[Wilma]

And that should be an issue for the parents of the kids that are driving to school.  If the parents don't take a stand, what good does complaining about it do?  Perhaps some tickets should be written, costly tickets.

[Tobina+1]

On the busing issue; here's another reason I thought of why WE has to bus so many kids... Yes, kids may live 2.5 miles from SOME school, but maybe not the one they have to go to.  i.e.  Howard K-5 kids may live 2.5 miles from the high school, but they have to still be bused to either Moline or Severy.

The other thing that I'm surprised hasn't brought more discussion is the difference in the number of staff... over twice as many for only 20 more kids.  Yes, I realize that having 3 buildings means 3 sets of janitors, 3 sets of cooks, etc, but our comparison school has 2 separate buildings, too.  No, I'm not suggesting going in and slashing jobs, BUT analyzing those jobs and determining what is really needed would be a good start.  (Also, keep in mind that these staff numbers were full-time equivalents, not just people.)
On that note; here are some differences...
Assistant Principals:  WE=1.0   RCHS= 0.1
All other teachers (does not include special ed, vocational, pre-K, or K):  WE= 24.6   RCHS= 27    (Now does that seem odd?)
I think where the biggest difference is (and maybe someone can explain this to me?)... under Non-Certified Personnel, Special Education Paraprofessionals...  WE= 53   RCHS= 6.7


Wilma; I know it only affects your pocketbook, but if you're asked to pay more taxes to support this continued types of inefficiencies, will you really be willing to do it?  That's why EVERYONE in these communities are affected and need to know the facts.  As a wise man once said... "Someone paid taxes for me to get an education, so now it's my turn to pay taxes to give some other kids an education."  (Thanks, DD!)

[sixdogsmom]

Thanks Mark for your response. Now this is where I am going with this; if 450 children were attending school at the current building at West Elk, why couldn't the building be revamped to accomodate 350 children? Even if an additional gym needed to be built, that and a few portables should serve for the shrinking student body. A classroom designed for 30 students should not need to be heated/ cooled for 10 students. Why not teach more students per square foot than we are currently doing? We would have a central campus that would reduce busing, and I for one would like to see a very close look at student drivers. Is there really a need, or is this just a right of passage?