West Elk district holding mail election for $4 million bond

[Ross]

Just to show you the incomprehensible cornfusion and lack of comprehension and rudeness out of Delaware and why it is a figment of my imagination, please read the following concerning the discussion of Common Core.

Lets see..no Gov't schooling= lower classes who stay ignorant, can't find work in today's high tech world, so we the taxpayers, have to pay for them with food stamps,.welfare and all the free stuff.Which is better? Either way the public pays. HA!

Speaking of staying ignorant, your government schooling is a very good example. 

It was the Republicans who created the scheme for universal free education after the Civil War.  The tyrants, along with mob rule voting, have been in charge of education in the USA since then.  They're teaching what they want their citizens and immigrants to learn.  After the Civil War, the Southern States were required to create a State Board of Education for the particular Southern State to be re-admitted to the Union.  That was the beginning of State Boards and the concept spread into the northern states soon thereafter.  Ross has mentioned that the Kansas BOE was founded in 1873 so now you should know that the republicans/socialists got their way in education over the entire USA shortly after the Civil War which the north defeated the America as established by our founding fathers.

The Republicans have been stealing the liberty of Americans since 1861 and as the Democrats have more fully accepted re-construction, neither party defends liberty anymore.  Both parties are pro-government and worship the Fed's power just like you Diane.

AH yes....room temperature IQ speaks again.  Do you collect points for everyone you try to insult? Good grief, you have slammed everyone.Repubs, Demos, Moderates, Independents,educators...Who died and left the office of professional griper to you? HA! .... And you don't even live and vote in ELK COUNTY? WHOOOOO!  Why in the world would anyone who is concerned about Elk County politics listen to you? That bond issue won't affect you one way or another! At least I support Elk County projects when I can.
  I'm very pro education but not at all costs. I'm also a very frugal person who wants good value for every penny I spend.Fluff and icing in education means nothing to me. Things that will help kids get ready for the adult world they will live in? Yes! That includes art and music, drama and sports too. If just a job is what is wanted, go to an industrial training school.

Who's IQ is room temperature?
I hope you are looking in a mirror!

It does not take a lot of comprehension to read the title/subject of this thread.

And I quote, "Re: Common Core Education And More About Federal Government Control"

That has nothing to do with the present ballot in Elk County!

Common Core is a national affliction?

I do believe Diane that you owe redcliffsw an extreme apology.

How shameful!

But, I doubt he would stoop so low as to accept it.

[readyaimduck]

 How much per $100.00 will my taxes be raised? per Wilma....forgot how to quote, sorry.

Wilma:  assuming you live in a Residential Classification, take your ASSESSED value and multiply that times your mill levy.  That is your tax dollars you pay to the county.  The school gets x amount of those mils based on their budget.
Example:  my house is assessed at $3278.  It is assessed (by the appraised value x 11.5%) then take that times the mill levy for your county.  That is tax dollars you pay.  Appraised value may not change, however the increased mil levy will boost it up a notch in yur pocket!
The mil levy set by the county is based off of all the entities (townships, school, county budget etc).  Your portion of taxes you pay is divvied up within that total county budget percentage. 

Compare your last year taxes/assessed and mil levy to this years  (Mil levy is set around October for the year 2014)   1$ on 1,000 assessed value.  Assessed value stays the same...Mill levy goes up?  take $100 times the schools levy and you have your dollars out of your wallet.  (They give the breakdown on the school in your tax bill)

If this is not clear, then I need to quit typing....hope this helps.

ready .......for math. class

[readyaimduck]

addendum:  I pay $82.05 plus $19.56 to my school district.  I have no kids there....$20 is 5 gal gas for the lawnmower.
On $100 appraised or even assessed...not much if any.
you can take this and work with it, or spin it anyway you want.

ready....to wobbly pop one more
edit as I read the wrong line

[Wilma]

I finally got an answer to my question as to just how much the school bond would raise my taxes.  What I am going to say is not about the assessed value but about the taxes you are billed for in dollars and cents.  On a total TAX BILL of $1,000.00 the tax increase would be $20.00 a year.  Yes, twenty dollars a year.  That is less than a trip to Wichita, a new book from my book club, about half a dozen new plants for my garden or a new rose bush.  Gee, it is hard to decide what to give up.  If only I smoked or imbibed, it would be a couple of packs of cigarettes or several six packs.  I am just guessing about the smokes and beer.

I really appreciate the forum members that post in a concise way that can be read and understood.  This is the way that problems get solved.

I will vote "yes" on the proposed school bond.  Twenty dollars a year is not too much to pay for upgrading our school system.  At twenty dollars a year it would take five years to pay for a new pair of shoes for me.  Incidentally,  the 2% increase is just about the same as the cost of living increase.  One month's increase in my social security will take care one year's increase in my taxes.

[David Evans]

Hey Ross here it is,

I have been attending school board meetings for the past few years.  Yeah, I lost a school board election, lost the chance to be appointed when the Moline board member quit, but I keep going. 

Starting with a school board meeting where we met with the Assembly of God church and took a tour of their new community center.  When the board took the tour there was a feeling that the AOG community building would be able to be used to supplement the lack of space that West Elk couldn't provide.  However, within  couple of meetings it was decided that West Elk needed to add on buildings to give the students space to grow.  No matter what the AOG said, the feeling at the following meetings was that we needed to add on to the existing building to best serve the students.  At one meeting it was stated that we couldn't ask the students to walk through mud to get to the community center.  Then, an architect was hired to develop a plan to figure out how to reconfigure the school to be able to accommodate the students now enrolled or to figure out an addition that would handle the classload.  One of the first meetings it was decided to add another portable to ease the crowding in the classes.  The architect said he could find a used portable for a mere $5000.  It was decided at this meeting to put the new portable where the school had just located a brand new playground for the children.  However, at the next meeting the architect informed the board he couldn't locate a portable building so it was decided to have him draw up plans for a new addition to the school.  I won't bore you with details, but after several meetings it was decided to add on classrooms to the school  and also add a new elementary gym.  Forget about the new building just to the north of the school.  When the time came to come up with the amount of money to build these new additions a board member made a motion to spend $1,000,000.00 to just add classrooms.  It died for the lack of a second.  Then, the board discussed various amounts of money they thought the public would approve.  The amounts ranged from just over $6,000,000 to only $3,000,000.  Finally the amount decided upon was $4,000,000.00.  Surely the public would approve this miserly amount.  However, when a contractor was brought in a few months ago, he stated that he could not give the board an estimate on cost because the plans weren't complete enough for him to accurately give a bid. 

To those of you that do not go to board meetings discussion was held last fall on repairing the roof and replacing the 15+ year old air conditioners.  A board member moved last fall to get estimates on repair and replacement.  It passed.  However, when the bids came in, a motion was made to get the roof fixed and air conditioners replaced during the summer of 2014.  It died for the lack of a second.  The president stated that when we got a contractor to build the new additions that they would give us a break on the new roof and air conditioners.  Yeah, I believe that.  Now, the earliest that we will see any improvements to the school will be in the summer of 2015.  When class is in session I don't believe that we will see workers on the roof or air conditioners being replaced.  There is approximately $1,000,000.00 in the capital improvement fund that would cover the cost of repair and replacement.
The editorial in the Prairie Star was correct that the growth in student population was from students already in district or coming from neighboring districts.  With taxes already about the highest in the state we have virtually no chance of attracting new businesses or homeowners to our area.  Local taxes have gone up 184% from 2005 to 2012.  Main reason.  School.

Let's think outside the box for a minute.  We have 37 teachers(2012 data from KDSE).  That's not too bad.  However we employee 102 other employees.  Bus drivers, cooks, paras, staff.  Some of these paras and teachers are in the special ed cooperative with Sedan and Longton.  However,  Independence in Montgomery County, employees 103 other employees.  Oh, but they have 1901 students.  Again, this is 2012 data from KDSE.  West Elk during this same time period had 307 students.  Hmmmmmmm.

West Elk also has two years of preschool.  The state doesn't count these as students.  They also don't require that we have preschool.  At a board meeting two years ago it was reported that the kindergarten class was huge.(21 students)  It was voted on and passed that the class be divided in two and two teachers hired(already were) and four paras(2 in each class).  The class, if memory serves me correctly was divided into 9 in one class and 12 in the other.  9 kids, 3 adults.  What would happen if we reduced the numbers of paras by half?  At least 50 less adults in the classrooms.  Possibly more room for the children?

Ross may be a salty old sea dog but he is not a liar.  Take it from one who is there. 

If you don't believe what I have written, why don't you come to the board meetings and see what goes on with your own eyes.  Very few of you do or have.

Ross.  Anytime you need a foxhole, I'll be glad to share mine.

 

[Ross]

A conversation between Diane of Delaware and myself of Elk County Kansas. I moved this conversation from the thread known as "Re: Elk Konnected Hand out at County" just so know one would miss it.
Please take note of Mrs. Delaware informing someone that basically has no right to post.

Ross, by the way, you keep talking about the % of voters that turned down the last referendum...out of how many registered voters? A big % of a very small number of "potential" voters doesn't mean much, except that many people don't care what the results are.

AH yes....room temperature IQ speaks again.

It makes no difference how many voters, vote? What maters are what percentage votes for or against the Bond Issue! Sorry to have to inform you of what really matters.

But alas, I feel you are sending an altogether different message!
The School Board and the Superintendent and the Site Committee have all said they would get out to the public? Aren't you indicating they will try to get people registered to vote, that haven't registered? Register more people that may vote "NO"! That is if they can find any that are not registered!

Perhaps now you can comprehend why, I am trying to encourage people to discuss this situation and not necessarily take my word for anything.

Well lets just review what you said to redcliffsw shall we? "you don't even live and vote in ELK COUNTY" and "That bond issue won't affect you one way or another". Diane please stand in front of your mirror and repeat these statements, please! Thank you!
See here is the actual post:
[ quote author=Diane Amberg link=topic=15765.msg219752#msg219752 date=1401122520 ]

And you don't even live and vote in ELK COUNTY? WHOOOOO!  Why in the world would anyone who is concerned about Elk County politics listen to you? That bond issue won't affect you one way or another! At least I support Elk County projects when I can.

Now realize this, this is not an Elk County project!
And consider this is a voter responsibility!
West Elk USD-282 registered voters!
When did you register, Diane?

I will repeat, what in your background allows you to decide what a Taj Mahal school is?

Apparently, you do not comprehend the meaning of "figure of speech" as it relates to the use of the words "Taj Mahal"! Basic English, basic "Figure of Speech."
Like your remark to redcliff:

AH yes....room temperature IQ speaks again.

Or how rooms are used? Room needs are much different now from when West Elk was built. There need to be classes for computer training, computers in rooms, even in elementary school and they take up space. Kids often change classes for reading and math.Since the exchange usually is equal, they have to have some place to sit when they do.(I don't know if your kids change or not.) When kids are doing group learning or projects, they need space to work.They don't all sit glued to their desks all day like you probably remember. Some schools do immersion classes in another language, even in elementary.Ya have to have space to do it! Personal and small group tutoring has to go somewhere also.
If you spend and have spent so much time in your son's school, surely you know that. Plus, you are stuck with the state's building regulations. Some where there must be some middle ground. I hope cooler heads will find it.

The Board Hired a retired Professor out of Missouri to help them organize themselves and to do community studies, the follow through --- nothing! What would have a much wiser use of that money would have been a much more productive use of taxpayer money would have been an efficiency expert, in my opinion. After all wouldn't you want an efficiently ran school for your child and your property tax.

Of course Diane classrooms and children take up room, that's a no brainer. But when you have a building designed to handle 600 students and only have 300 enrolled you don't  need more room. The School Superintendent has said 600 several times at open School Board Meetings, contrary to the rumor going around that it was designed for 340 students. (LOL)

Anyway Diane here is a list just for you!

•   I live here!
•   I vote here!
•   I have attended West Elk School District Board Meetings and have observed the attitudes around the table. Not to good! There are no real conversations, President unless you consider the whining of the Board President saying his chldren won't have a new gymnasium to play in.
•   This School Board has no idea, in my opinion, what their actual job is!
•   This School Board told the state that they saved $150,000.00 shutting down two grade school ! (which points out that the board cannot be trusted to answer to the voters and cannot be trusted to do what the voters want!)

•   This School Board then spent $500,000.00 to replace the classrooms that were disposed of with eight classrooms in four portable buildings.
•   The West Elk School has been operating just fine for the last 5 years and there has been no population explosion in the District.
•   The School Board has consistently ignored suggestions from experts in construction, and maintenance and surveys they commissioned and paid for with taxpayer dollars.
•   If they get the money for the Bond Issue passed they have said they will dispose of the eight classroom in 4 portable buildings thus reducing the classroom capacity by the same amount that they now have. That's $500,000.00 wasted!
•   What they really need is an efficiency expert to perform an unbiased study and I am certain the School would be just fine.
•   The only addition will be a second gymnasium which is not necessary for educating the children, but for fulfilling someone's ego, nothing more!
•   One of the architects that study the building and drew up floor plans (an expert) said at a School Board meeting, the school had luxurious classrooms and that 2 class rooms could be made into 3 classrooms!
•   The School Board has even discussed moveable walls for dividing classrooms!
•   This School Board shut down, two grade schools after the voters and taxpayer said "NO"! And they planned the election now, knowing it will fail, with the idea to return in November.
•   A new gymnasium is not a need for classroom education!

Thank You Diane, in the Words of your Konnection, for engaging me. (LOL)

Oh by the way Diane in all your infinite wisdom you have failed to tell us how many School Board Members are associated with Elk Konnected.  Or is it you just don't know?

[Ross]

Hey Ross here it is,

I have been attending school board meetings for the past few years.  Yeah, I lost a school board election, lost the chance to be appointed when the Moline board member quit, but I keep going. 

I was there, and before you said, you wanted the job, nobody else wanted it.

I found it strange the way the meeting went, all of a sudden out of no where some lady wants the position, just bam! Out of no where? So when you petitioned the School Board you were not expecting competition and you knew the board members knew you from all your visits to the Board Meetings and therefore did not prepare a fancy speech. Each and everyone of the Board members were aware of your diligence and interest.

Then this lady who appeared out of nowhere, who never came to the Board meetings to my knowledge had a fancy speech all wrote up.

There was not even a whisper of a conversation after the both of you had presented yourselves.

I believe, it was the President of the Board that immediately said, I nominate "whatever her name" is for the position. And there was no discussion amongst the Board Members about either candidate, there was an immediate second, followed by a vote.

To me, it appeared already a done deal, before the meeting even started.

Starting with a school board meeting where we met with the Assembly of God church and took a tour of their new community center.  When the board took the tour there was a feeling that the AOG community building would be able to be used to supplement the lack of space that West Elk couldn't provide.  However, within  couple of meetings it was decided that West Elk needed to add on buildings to give the students space to grow.  No matter what the AOG said, the feeling at the following meetings was that we needed to add on to the existing building to best serve the students.  At one meeting it was stated that we couldn't ask the students to walk through mud to get to the community center.  Then, an architect was hired to develop a plan to figure out how to reconfigure the school to be able to accommodate the students now enrolled or to figure out an addition that would handle the classload.  One of the first meetings it was decided to add another portable to ease the crowding in the classes.  The architect said he could find a used portable for a mere $5000.  It was decided at this meeting to put the new portable where the school had just located a brand new playground for the children.  However, at the next meeting the architect informed the board he couldn't locate a portable building so it was decided to have him draw up plans for a new addition to the school.  I won't bore you with details, but after several meetings it was decided to add on classrooms to the school  and also add a new elementary gym.  Forget about the new building just to the north of the school.  When the time came to come up with the amount of money to build these new additions a board member made a motion to spend $1,000,000.00 to just add classrooms.  It died for the lack of a second.  Then, the board discussed various amounts of money they thought the public would approve.  The amounts ranged from just over $6,000,000 to only $3,000,000.  Finally the amount decided upon was $4,000,000.00.  Surely the public would approve this miserly amount.  However, when a contractor was brought in a few months ago, he stated that he could not give the board an estimate on cost because the plans weren't complete enough for him to accurately give a bid. 

To those of you that do not go to board meetings discussion was held last fall on repairing the roof and replacing the 15+ year old air conditioners.  A board member moved last fall to get estimates on repair and replacement.  It passed.  However, when the bids came in, a motion was made to get the roof fixed and air conditioners replaced during the summer of 2014.  It died for the lack of a second.  The president stated that when we got a contractor to build the new additions that they would give us a break on the new roof and air conditioners.  Yeah, I believe that.  Now, the earliest that we will see any improvements to the school will be in the summer of 2015.  When class is in session I don't believe that we will see workers on the roof or air conditioners being replaced.  There is approximately $1,000,000.00 in the capital improvement fund that would cover the cost of repair and replacement.
The editorial in the Prairie Star was correct that the growth in student population was from students already in district or coming from neighboring districts.  With taxes already about the highest in the state we have virtually no chance of attracting new businesses or homeowners to our area.  Local taxes have gone up 184% from 2005 to 2012.  Main reason.  School.

Let's think outside the box for a minute.  We have 37 teachers(2012 data from KDSE).  That's not too bad.  However we employee 102 other employees.  Bus drivers, cooks, paras, staff.  Some of these paras and teachers are in the special ed cooperative with Sedan and Longton.  However,  Independence in Montgomery County, employees 103 other employees.  Oh, but they have 1901 students.  Again, this is 2012 data from KDSE.  West Elk during this same time period had 307 students.  Hmmmmmmm.

West Elk also has two years of preschool.  The state doesn't count these as students.  They also don't require that we have preschool.  At a board meeting two years ago it was reported that the kindergarten class was huge.(21 students)  It was voted on and passed that the class be divided in two and two teachers hired(already were) and four paras(2 in each class).  The class, if memory serves me correctly was divided into 9 in one class and 12 in the other.  9 kids, 3 adults.  What would happen if we reduced the numbers of paras by half?  At least 50 less adults in the classrooms.  Possibly more room for the children?

Ross may be a salty old sea dog but he is not a liar.  Take it from one who is there. 

If you don't believe what I have written, why don't you come to the board meetings and see what goes on with your own eyes.  Very few of you do or have.

Ross.  Anytime you need a foxhole, I'll be glad to share mine.

I agree with what you have posted here and people should come down and see the fiasco that takes place. The picnic and the whispering and the total disregard for the public.

But alas, I believe, I have shamed them into finally setting up their table, so they face the audience. I can hardly wait for the next meeting, so I can get pictures for the people here on the forum. Perhaps there may be a little dignity and decorum.

Next thing is, to get them, to put to work, some of that expensive technology to work and video and broadcast the meetings live over the West Elk School System to in order to keep the public informed. We have the technology, so let's bring this School Board into the 21st Century. What do you think? Would you willing accept phony excuses for not live casting the meetings? The School Board has made it clear that we old folks don't appreciate the importance of technology. Let's now see, if they appreciate the importance of technology, shall we? Let's see if they really want the public informed?

Do they really want informed voters?

Let's see if they really do. Let's see them get these meetings up on the internet, now?

[Diane Amberg]

Who gave you permission to move my posts anywhere?    Kinda forward aren't cha?
Gee, I guess if you try to smear my name I can't run for your school board long distance after all, now can I ? According to you, they are so bad I could actually be an improvement just by being a member by internet. .
Why don't you and Red put on your cast iron skivies and learn to take what you throw. You certainly don't understand allegory or political sarcasm.
It's Red, not you who keeps stirring the pot but can't vote. Reread what i said ...and leave my posts alone.DO NOT move them!  Lay off! You have been told before!
By the way, I found Mr.Evans' post very informative. He at least listed the classrooms and programs that are usually not noticed or listed, but do use space.
Your kids are in school NOW not in the 1950's and that's what the parents want for their kids, a modern education.   Perhaps the state school building standards should be changed so it's not an all or nothing situation.  Some true negotionation should help. If others can do it ,so can you. Doesn't your son go to Elk Valley?

[Ross]

Who gave you permission to move my posts anywhere?    Kinda forward aren't cha?

You post – is public – quoting is available – I used quoting- simple.

You have no control, tch-tch!

Reread what i said ...and leave my posts alone.DO NOT move them!  Lay off! You have been told before!

Your original post is exactly where you put it!
Let me ask you, when did you become Czar of the internet?
Who are you to tell me, what I can or can not quote and post?
Aren't you angrier at yourself, than me, because you are ashamed of your own post.
When I post to someone's remarks, I quote them, just in case someone decides to delete the post I am responding to.

AH yes....room temperature IQ speaks again.  Who died and left the office of professional griper to you? HA! .... And you don't even live and vote in ELK COUNTY? WHOOOOO! 

You are great at being a bully in my opinion and a failure paying attention to what you post and how it applies to you.  Just where in Elk County do you live?

Why in the world would anyone who is concerned about Elk County politics listen to you? That bond issue won't affect you one way or another! At least I support Elk County projects when I can..

Again please, listen to yourself.

Doesn't your son go to Elk Valley?

What does my son have to do with the West Elk USD-282 Bond Election Issue?
Why is it that you wish to use children and students as a weapon to prove something?
Have you no couth?
 

[Ross]

I simply want to ensure that everyone gets to see my conversation with Diane and the game she is playing.

Please explain how holding a vote now, which you say you know for sure will fail,

You don't attend West Elk School Board Meetings do you?

You also do read very well either do you or is it you just like twisting words?

I never said, I am sure it will fail. Those are your words!

The School Board feels it will fail, they expressed that at is at several meetings. Of course stuff like that does not make the Minutes, just like the President of the Board whining that his kids would grow up and graduate without the privilege of playing in a brand new gymnasium.

Why not just wait until November?

I thought you were the political expert?
It is the School Board's plan not mine, they said it not me!
My assumption ----  would be to wear the voters down.

Or are you suggesting the board is throwing money to the ballot printer, and the postal service? HMMM.

I have suggested nothing of the kind.
But you just did, Diane.
Aren't you ashamed of yourself?

Away,ya bore me.

Don't you mean all your college degrees can not keep of with this unedumacted redneck,  due to a comprehension problem you tend to show frequently.

My sincerest apologies! It is always a pleasure to communicate with you.