Any suggestions on making combustible cartidges?

[dpote]

Hi all. I just got back from a match.
I used paper cartridges for the first time in both the 1858 Remington and the Ruger Old Army.
Quick loading, but I didn't remember to clear the chambers of residue.
I had a few that didn't go off.
Remember to clear out the chambers when using paper cartridges.

Dave

EDIT -- I forgot to post blowing in the chambers is enough to get the loose paper bits out of the cylinder.

[Dick Dastardly]

Ho Dave,

What works best for clearing out those chambers?  I'd have to assume that high pressure compressed air would do the trick, but that's not readily available.  So, how do you clear 'em?

DD-DLoS

[gotzguns]

are you cartridges combustable? been shooting combustable carts. made from silk-span for over 8 years and never had to clear cyclinders. have got over 24 shots with out clearing. are you carts. tapered ? also what brand caps do you use? interested to find out, gotzguns

[dpote]

The cartridges are tapered, and the paper is combustable.
I roll cigarette papers around a .30-30 case and twist the end. Pour in powder, ball and twist closed. Super easy to make.
Caps are Remington #11 and CCI #11 Magnum.
I didn't have any problems until the last stage. I'll probably continue to use them, as I was happy with their overall performance.
Now, I just gotta get chicken feathers coming out my barrels like the other thread in this forum. I think my friends will get a laugh out of the feather light loads.

Dave

[Chance]

If you soak the paper in a solution of potassium nitrate you will find there is no residue. I used to lay the papers on a sheet of glass and put the solution on with a small paint brush. When dry they can be CAREFULLY peeled off the glass.

[hellgate]

I used to "nitrate" my cig papers with the KNO3 by dipping them into a saturated solution up to but not including the glued edge of the cig paper. After drying I'd use the gummed edge to lick and roll onto the bullet or ball before filling it with powder & twisting the end shut.

For shooting I'd carry a pair of tweezers and a nipple pick.

[dpote]

Oh, I didn't know I had to add potassium nitrate. It was my understanding cigarette papers are already nitrated, which makes a cigarette burn uniformly.
Thanks for the tips here. I love this board, there is a ton of knowledge here.
I'll add the tweezers and pick to the possibles bag.

Dave

[Cuts Crooked]

..and iffin yer not super into authenticity, a small can of compressed air from WallyWorld would be handy fer blowin out the chambers.

[Dick Dastardly]

I've used that Wally World compressed air, Cuts.  I peal off the original label and put my own on.  Label says "Dick Dastardly Hot Air". .   Works great to clean the CCD on my digital cameras too.

DD-DLoS

[Yankee John]

Good information here,  but I have a question.

I have a couple hundred paper cartridges pre-made, using Zig-Zag brand papers.   When I shoot them,  I do have to blow out the cylinders every once in a while to clear out the tiny pieces of unburnt paper.

Here is my question:  Before I learned the best way of making thes paper carts. with cig papers,  I bought a "kit" off eBay that included a zip-loc baggie of potassium nitrate.  Can I mix this potassium nitrate with water,  put it into a small spray bottle,  and gently mist this solution onto the couple hundred paper carts that I have already made? (without harming the Pyrodex P that is inside the paper cartridges?).

It would be great if this would completely eliminate the need to blow out the cylinders periodically.

Let me know your thoughts!
John

[hellgate]

I doubt you could mist the paper adequately to get it to burn without wetting the powder and either creating a mess of wet paper or caking the powder which would affect ignition. I'm assuming they don't unravel when damp. I'd just get the tweezers handy and always do a visual check before ramming in a new cartridge. There is usually no chance of a cook off in a revolver chamber like there can be at the bottom of a long barreled (rifle) muzzle loader but with a paper cartridge there could be an ember in the chamber.

[Troublesome River]

I've used zig-zag papers to make cartridges for my navys and the only problem I've had aside from an occasional slow-fire (quickly solved by poking a hole in the cartridgr after loading with a safety pin) was getting a little twist of paper sticking out the nipple hole after firing. I think this may be partly from a weak mainspring which I'm changing over the winter. Also plan to use CCI Magnum caps to help ignition-T.R

[Noz]

Some where I have read a series of instructions on making a flat bottom cartridge that has only a single layer of nitrated paper between the powder and cap. It's done on a dowel form. The main body of the paper cartridge is formed around the dowel and then a seperate paper "cup is glued over the end. After drying the author then filled the cup and twisted the top closed over the ball. When it was rammed, the excess paper was cut off as the lead ring is cut. Some day I'm going to try it but its a ways down on the list.

[dpote]

The flat bottomed cartridges do look slick. A bit more work than I have time for, though. The bottom shouldn't be a player, because the flash holes in the cylinder are at an angle, hitting the charge where the paper is thin, and not the twisted end.
If I had the time, I would make the flat bottomed ones, just for style points.
Instructions and pics are found here http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=326.0

Dave

[Capt.Black Jack Hawks]

Howdy Guys, I guess this is the place I need to be to ask some questions. I jus recently got a .54cal Sharps for a B-day/X-Mas present and it's a breech loader using paper cartridges. Now I have some expierence with black powder (cap n ball revolvers and a couple of sidelocks) but I have never tried paper cartridge, and would greatly appreciate any help I can get. The Sharps was a used one and did not come with any accessories or manual.

[dpote]

Hi Captain. The cartridges we're discussing here are not the same as for a Sharps.
Dixie gun works has a kit for making the cartridges you need. KA0700 is the part number.
Maybe this question asked at the Buffalo rifle forum http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/board,77.0.html could help you more.

Update-I just found this http://www.jesseshunting.com/articles/guns/category16/35.html have you seen it?.

Dave

[gotzguns]

make my combustable sharps cartridges with medium silkspan soaked in salt peter. have flat bottom so the block doesn't cut of cart. you can load and un load with out spilling powder all over. use waterglass to glue cart. together and to glue bullet to cart. sometimes dip bullet in to lube to help keep fowling down a little bit. have been making my sharps carts. this way for my 1863 rifle and carbine for over 15 years. never had a misfire. use about 1 table spoon of saltpeter to 1 1/2 cup of warm water. soak silkspan and let dry in bath room. then cut to shape and roll on brass mandrel. load aprox. 60 grains 3 f and shoot. gotzguns

[dpote]

Excellent post, gotzguns. Is there any way you could do up some pictures? I for one, would like to see the whole salt peter dance.

Dave

[Capt.Black Jack Hawks]

  thanks for the help, what size brass mandrel do you use and any suggestions on where to find the salt peter?

[dpote]

More links. Hope these help.

http://www.berdansharpshooters.com/care.html

http://www.researchpress.co.uk/firearms/britain/enfield/enfieldcartridge07.htm

http://www.berdansharpshooters.com/usssbb/viewtopic.php?p=654&sid=0f308a0f29f29f5b83362cced2f67a55