Lee Turret Press & Black Powder Loading

Two-Bits · March 02, 2006, 09:23:33 PM

I've been loading black powder cartridges (.45 & .38-40) in my Lee turret press and want to speed things up a bit. What I do now is take a sized and primed piece of brass and move it to the charging stage. I work the handle to bell the mouth and then charge it using one of the Lee dippers. I then go through the bullet seating and crimping stages.

What I'd like to do is eliminate using the dippers and just use the Lee Auto Disk Powder Measure and a Double-Disk Kit for dropping the powder charge. I know the static myth so I'm not worried about that.

Just want to know if anyone has loaded BP with the Lee Turret Press and if there are any tips that you could pass on. Or, is it just a straight forward process like when you would load that other kind of powder.

TIA

Steel Horse Bailey · March 03, 2006, 06:54:39 AM

I cain't say whether you should do or not to do (with apologies to Wm. Shakespeare) but I'll bet that has been done safely before. I'm a Dillon Man myself, but a plastic hopper is a plastic hopper, no matter who makes it. And Dillon will tell you, and I'd bet Lee too, NOT to do it.

With all the warnings 'bout static formed by plastic hoppers 'n such, it kinda makes ya wonder why most powders (including some Black) come in plastic containers!

Well, the correct answer (as told to me by a factory rep) is that the container plastic is a special formulation of no-static plastic. Well, duh! What are the plastic powder measure hoppers made from? Special static PRODUCING plastic? I think not.

I can't tell ya to or not; use yer own judgement. And make sure you will is up to date.

(A bad attempt at humor, I know - sorry.)

Dick Dastardly · March 03, 2006, 08:12:43 AM

Howdy Two Bits,

Safety is always the first concern when handling and explosive, and black powder is an explosive. That said, I load all my main match rifle and pistol brass on a LEE Pro 100 progressive press. It's fast, consistant and I consider it safe.

Since you are using LEE thru the die expander dies, dipping the powder is slower but you may like the peace of mind. For myself, using the auto disk without modification, except adding the second disk stack adapter, was the way I chose to go. I do feel that I'm safe doing this.

One thing I've done is to make sure there is no heat source any place near my press. Also, take care with priming because on the LEE Pro 1000, the primers are installed right under the powder charging station. LEE has specific recomendations for primers and I follow them.

DD-DLoS

Lars · March 03, 2006, 09:45:43 AM

Some time back Hodgdon publically stated that their BPs, 777 and Pyrodex, are safe to use in ALL powder dispensers. They based their statement on extensive testing.

It is hard for most of us to amagine anyone doing all the testing needed to publically state that for traditional BPs as a group, or even for specific brands.

That leaves you with either your own judgement and risk taking, or with buying one of the special BP powder dispensers, such as Lyman makes, or using one of the Hodgdon BPs.

Lars

Montana Slim · March 03, 2006, 07:40:56 PM

Quote from: Two-Bits on March 02, 2006, 09:23:33 PM

What I'd like to do is eliminate using the dippers and just use the Lee Auto Disk Powder Measure and a Double-Disk Kit for dropping the powder charge. I know the static myth so I'm not worried about that.

Just want to know if anyone has loaded BP with the Lee Turret Press and if there are any tips that you could pass on. Or, is it just a streight forward process like when you would load that other kind of powder.

TIA

Two-Bits,

I've been loadin' with the described setup in 44-40 for about 10 years with no problems or special procedure. Just be sure not to confuse your black powder with any smokeless you may have on-hand. Wouldn't want a case-full of that new-fad stuff in there!

Best to ya,
Slim

Two-Bits · March 05, 2006, 01:36:20 PM

Thanks for your replys everyone.

Yesterday I loaded a couple hundred rounds of .45 with BP using my Lee Turret Press and Auto Disk Powder Measure with Double Disk setup. It went a lot faster then using the dipper.

The one thing that I noticed though, was that the dipper that I used to use for dipping (2.2 cc) did not equal the volume of the Double-Disk cavities that I used (1.02 Top Disk, 1.18 Bottom Disk).

For the Double-Disk setup, after some trial and error, I ended up using the .95 on top and the 1.02 on the bottom which is supposed to total out to 1.97 cc. I know I'm getting compression because I can hear the powder getting compressed when the bullet gets close to the crimp groove when I'm seating it.

When I used the dipper, I know I was getting a little bit more compression because I could hear the powder getting compressed further away from the crimp groove as compared to the volume dropped by the disk setup.

Also, I figure that the BP is getting a little compressed in the powder measure before it is dropped into the cavity because of the rotation and vibration that the turret causes as it turns.

These may be the reasons why my total cavity volume needed to be less then the dipper volume.

Anyway, altogether, it was a good experience. Today, if I get some time, I'm going to load some cartridges for my .38-40.

Dick Dastardly · March 06, 2006, 08:07:17 AM

Your press gets viberated some and shakes the powder down a bit more. I actually tried using induced viberation and found that it added a quite a bit more powder and was more consistant. I quit doing that though, cuz I couldn't hear my radio.

DD-DLoS

Goatlips · March 06, 2006, 10:04:06 PM

Hay Dick, what kind of induced vibration did you use? That fish tank air pump I remember from somewhere? I used to use an engraver to buzz down BP in a loading block, but have been wanting to try some kind of vibration on my SDB, without turning the powder measure supply into a charcoal briquette. Thanks Pard

Goatlips

Howdy Doody · March 06, 2006, 11:05:20 PM

Quote from: Goatlips on March 06, 2006, 10:04:06 PM
Hay Dick, what kind of induced vibration did you use? That fish tank air pump I remember from somewhere? I used to use an engraver to buzz down BP in a loading block, but have been wanting to try some kind of vibration on my SDB, without turning the powder measure supply into a charcoal briquette. Thanks Pard

Goatlips

I think it was Doc Shapiro with fish tank vibrator. He shoots smokeless though, but I think he posted a while back about that. I think I remember seeing it on his Dillon.
Me? I use a hand crank Lyman and just knock it once in a while. I use a Dillon 650. I could never get my Dillon measure to work right with BP or subs and just use two hands to load and it goes fast enough for me. Maybe I should try a fish tank pump and give the Dillon measure a second chance...........hmmmmm.

Dick Dastardly · March 07, 2006, 07:43:48 AM

Howdy Pards,

I had hooked up a sweedish massage electric viberator to a foot switch. It was strapped to the press. When I ran the thing it was way too noisy. The press seemed to like it though.

DD-DLoS

Lars · March 07, 2006, 04:18:05 PM

You can allways just give your powder measure a nice firm "pat" just before dropping each charge.
I allways found that well patted powder measures performed best.

Lars (that thinks good powder measures deserve personal attention)

Camille Eonich · March 08, 2006, 08:10:30 AM

Quote from: Dick Dastardly on March 07, 2006, 07:43:48 AM
Howdy Pards,

I had hooked up a sweedish massage electric viberator to a foot switch. It was strapped to the press. When I ran the thing it was way too noisy. The press seemed to like it though.

DD-DLoS

I guess it did like it. Everytime you reload with it the press gets a Swedish massage. I would say that press has it made.

There are several people around here that attach the fish tank aereator to the powder hopper while they are reloading to prevent bridging of the powder. They all use smokeless but I don't see why it wouldn't work with BP too.

REELFOOT REGULATOR · March 08, 2006, 01:37:44 PM

Would you all consider the lee perfect powder measure safe to drop real black powder?

Dick Dastardly · March 08, 2006, 05:52:46 PM

Ho Realfoot,
I do use that powder measure and haven't had a bit of trouble with it. I use it when I'm using the single stage press. Works great with BP.

Ho Lars,
That pat on the back has always produced the best results if given frequently enough, hard enough and low enough. Since corporal punishment isn't PC anymore, I have to assume you're talkin' about your powder measure. . .

Howdy Camille,
When I was lookin' for somethin' to viberate my powder measure the Sweedish shaker was all I cud lay my hands on. I hope I didn't thrill my BP too much. I also tried an old electric toothbrush, but it didn't do much.

The thing is, I've found that all black powder is made up of similar sized pieces of indeterminate shape. Vibration allows the pieces (grains) to find a position of comfort. Up to a point, viberation seems to compact black powder without compressing it. I'm not sure how much more powder a pard can pack into a cartridge this way, but it seems to add about 10% for me.

DD-DLoS

Lars · March 08, 2006, 09:28:12 PM

Quote from: Dick Dastardly on March 08, 2006, 05:52:46 PM

Ho Lars,
That pat on the back has always produced the best results if given frequently enough, hard enough and low enough. Since corporal punishment isn't PC anymore, I have to assume you're talkin' about your powder measure. . .

DD-DLoS

Reread my post just to make sure I got the English right. Yep --- I did and you did understand correctly. FYI, the precise point to pat on a powder measure can be very specific to model. Too hard is bad in any case.

Lars