Colt SAA Investment-What is the best barrel length for collectors?

[Doc Sunrise]

I got your question the first time, I think!  The problem is if people could predict what collectors or investors would find worth while in the future based on some predictions, those people would corner the market place.  There is no way of knowing today how collectors will answer the two most important questions in collecting in the future's prevailing conditions, rarity and desirability.  You may have an absolute rarity, but if nobody cares, its value will be low.  Or you may have a very desirable and sought after gun, but because the market is saturated with similar ones, the value will be low.

You need to just pick your favorite set up, and go with it.  The more Colt original the better, and if it is engraved, even better yet.  But, remember that your gun's quality is vitally important, and Doug Turnbull will give you quality with no questions asked.  As to your ultimate question of barrel length, you need to make a choice based on this, 4 3/4" barreled guns feel heavy but look great as potential gunfighter guns, 5 1/2" barreled guns feel the most balanced, and 7 1/2" barreled guns give the most blueing to look at and the best canvas area for engraving.  You just need to pick based on what you want, and you will enjoy it!  It is better for you to have a slightly more common gun to collectors but highly desirable to you, than hoping for a rare one that you really can't stand.

For myself, I just became a SASS member, and I hope to take advantage of the Colt SASS SAA's that you can get in pairs from Colt with your SASS number as the serial number for one, and with your SASS number in reverse for the other. 

Good Luck!
Doc Sunrise   

[Chance]

Maybe these guns will increase in value when someone starts a Turnbull Collectors Association. I won't hold my breath! 

[Virginia Gentleman]

Yeah, perhaps, but already they command more than a standard Colt as evidenced in the secondary market and have not lost value.  I am glad I was able to speak to others more knowledgeable on the subject since making my first post and thank God I live in a country where ownership won't get me thrown in jail in most places.

[wolverine]

You people amaze me.  You want something that looks like a Colt, feels like a Colt, shoots like a Colt, but yet is not a Colt.  You badmouth Colt as if you spoke from experience, but have you ever owned a Colt, felt a Colt, handled a Colt, shot a Colt?  Or do you just believe the drivel from others who have not owned a Colt either?  Your post asks about a "Colt SAA Investment," but you don't want to buy a Colt, you want something that is an investment but is not a Colt.  Only Colt is an investment, everything else is a copy.  I am not flaming you; I just don't understand.  If you want a Colt, then buy a Colt.  If you want an investment, then buy a Colt.  If you cannot afford a colt, then save your allowance until you can afford a Colt.  If you cannot afford a new Colt then buy a used Colt.  Those other pieces of crap will depreciate in value and a Colt will appreciate in value.  Talk to a gunsmith and educate yourself about how soft the steel is on a "clone."  Why do you think most custom shops will not work on "clones?"  Granted, a USFA is a quality firearm, but it is not a Colt.  I recently bought a new 3rd generation genuine Colt SAA .44-40 and a USFA .45.  The Colt is better.  The Colt action is smoother.  The Colt barrel and cylinder throats slug to correct specifications whereas the USFA does not.  The Colt trigger pull is a nice crisp 3.5 pounds whereas the USFA is about 6 pounds.  The Colt shoots to point of aim.  The Colt cylinder gap is .0025, better than the USFA.  When you thumb the hammer the Colt action feels smooth; the USFA feels rough.  On both guns the timing is dead on and the bolt does not rise early.  Why would you want a "clone" when you can have the real thing?  Sorry, I just don't understand all this dialog and angst about what to buy that is "almost" a Colt, has good investment value like a Colt, is better than a Colt, but yet is not a Colt.  Just buy a Colt and you will be happy.

[Chance]

I think that just about sums it up. Sam himself couldn't have put it better!

[Big Hext]

Funny how an old post gets dredged up... and re-reading it reminds me of how fluid time can be.
Colt still chugging along.
1st Gen Colts are higher than ever.  2nd Gens are waffling.  3rd Gens are down a bit and new Colts are really great guns.
Turnbull is making a nice pre-1920 new Colt, for about twice the cost of a new Colt.
Life is about making and living with choices.
Adios,

[minerotago]

I have read this here topic with interest. Now a while ago a bloke offered me an old Colt .41. It was made in 1901 and has a lot of original finish. maybe 80%. Its two faults are that the barrel is pitted in places and the half cock notch are gone. Other than that it is really a nice gun except for one thing. It is a 4 3/4 barrel length and I reckon that it wouild look far nicer if that barrel was just a bit longer. Somehow I do not like the look of the barrel and the ejector ending flush, it just looks a bit nicer with the barrel poking out a bit further. The price was $1185US.

[sharps50/70]

Minerotago,

Wow, buy that Colt ASAP.  The half cock notch can be fixed very easily by a good gunsmith and the barrel length really doesn't matter for shooting or investment.  You just can't beat that price.

Rich

[minerotago]

I got it off him. He is a real old bloke and used to collect guns back many years ago. I also want to negotiate with him to buy some ammo he has but he has too high a price on it. He has some original large calibre rimfires including Spencer and I am really keen on it for starters. Also a lot of .44 Henry but I have a lot of that myself. Its amazing what turns up out here!

[Yellowhouse Sam]

Well, I'm notorious for avoiding threads like this until the last hurrah but think I'll put my two bits in.  Forty-Rod way back when in this thread said it best in getting a 1st gen with provenance.  He didn't mean it had to belong to Frank Hamer or Heck Thomas although that would be nice. What he meant, and I take liberty here, was a sound factory letter whereupon indicates the gun is where is!  An old sage said it best to save up and buy one really good gun rather than a half dozen so-so's and I have to agree.  I've been down this road.

Fifteen years ago I saw a fellow walking the Market Hall Gunshow in Dallas with at least 6 SAA's, mostly 7.5 barrels, stuck in his voluminous belt.  When asked, no he wasn't selling but buying and he still had rolls of $100 bills that would choke a brontosaurus.  Fellas, he knew what he was doing.  I examined some of them by his good grace and patience and the $1500 guns he was buying are easily are worth 5K now----or more.  What have 2nd's done?--maybe doubled for the most part.  Unless you have a Sheriffs model 2nd or some other scarce feature, the 2nds and 3rd's  won't come close to a nice 1st.  As far as 2nd's I've got a first year 38 Spl that is no where near the overall quality of the current product and also have a pair of Peacemaker Centennials .44-40 that I do think will be winners one day due to their uniqueness and relative scarcity.

I have several late edition 3rds that while nicely put together are "also ran".  If you want appreciation, then seek out custom 3rd's with Ivory (no longer available from Colt), beveled cylinders, nickel, BP frame, engraved, and special barrel length.  However, when you get through paying out the nose for it, you could probably buy you a nice first that will out appreciate that 3rd provided you do your homework.  Probably can't get one from the 1870/80's for that price but gawdalmiighty look how they have apprecriated in value just in the last 10 years and it seems there's no endin sight.  Bottom line is that collectors want Colts with an Old West connection----right now and 20 years from now they could care less about a Colt that was born in 2008!

Now if Colt is really going under prices will increase for sure.  If that is the case, then I'd prevail upon Colt to make me consec #'s of Ivory Gripped (if they'd do ivory) Sheriff's models in .45 Colt with BP frame.  Engraved and nickel.  To me that would be about as scarce as you could get with 3rds. A similar pair, in 41 Lc & any barrel length and if they would do it, would be very rare indeed.

[sixgunshorty]

Colt is alive and well and the BS rumors about their demise are just that ..Pure BS!!
I am a direct Colt distributor and order custom Colt SAA's regularly and I  speak to the Director of the Colt Custom Shop every week ...I don't know who starts these ridiculous rumors that Colt is going out of business(maybe USFA? ) but they are absurd and untrue.
Colt is currently making the absolute finest SAA's that they ever have.Period.End of story.
Join the Colt Collectors Association if you want to stay up to date on Colt!

[RRio]

Colt is alive and well and the BS rumors about their demise are just that ..Pure BS!!
I am a direct Colt distributor and order custom Colt SAA's regularly and I  speak to the Director of the Colt Custom Shop every week ...I don't know who starts these ridiculous rumors that Colt is going out of business(maybe USFA? ) but they are absurd and untrue.

It may have started from this, dated Jan 3, 2008:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/83747/output/print

[oldCop]

Actually, that article appeared in Newsweek April 17, 2000. Here we are 9 years later, and great Colts are still being made. The sky isn't falling after all.

[Skeeter Lewis]

Wolverine, you reckon the steel in clones is soft. Can you elaborate on that? And do other pards agree? Skeet

[Marshal Deadwood]

The screws in italians guns seem to be very soft. Frames,,barrels,,I dunno,,Ive asked the same questions a dozen times there trying to get someone with the knowledge to speak the words ,,but ,,no luck.

Ill try one mo' time I guess..

Is Uberti frame steel,,and barrel steel,,,as good of quality as the steel in modern Colts ?

MD

[RRio]

The screws in italians guns seem to be very soft. Frames,,barrels,,I dunno,,Ive asked the same questions a dozen times there trying to get someone with the knowledge to speak the words ,,but ,,no luck.

Ill try one mo' time I guess..

Is Uberti frame steel,,and barrel steel,,,as good of quality as the steel in modern Colts ?

MD

I have been doing action jobs on Colts and Colt replicas since 1979, and I have done them all, Colt, USFA, Uberti, Pietta, ASM, Jaegar, Hawes, and even the original Great Westerns. I'm gonna tell ya truthful, for the money you pay for one of the Italian guns, they are well worth it.

The sport of CAS has improved the guns, alone. I have seen the quality improve vastly, in all the Italian guns in the past ten years. For the authentic side, (I do not consider the Rugers authentic) I would not have a problem buying any of the italian guns.

[Doc Sunrise]

Rawhide Rio makes about the only comment in this whole string that has any worth, one way or the other, for each individual and their needs, they all are worth it.

To Virginia Gentleman's original question, just be thankful for those SAAs that are shooters.  If only "Collectors" were bought and not shot, the better conditioned guns would not go up in value as experienced by Commemoratives.

To say no other SAA can be an investment except Colt is farther out there than I am willing to go.  Not all investments are based monetarily.

[Marshal Deadwood]

Yea,,,folks collect for different reasons. No doubt Colts are the 'money' gun for collectors. But, to say USFA's are not top shelf is ,,just incorrect. They are as good as Colts,,and better from the factory even. Will they be the collector item the Colts are ? I doubt it,,but they outta be. They just do not that the 'wild west' arura to them,,but they sure have the quality. I have a couple Cattlemans that seem to be top knotch SAA's too. Have had them 'worked' and I just dont see how a SAA could get much better..except for the cosmetics a wee bit.

Oh well,,,,any gun guy is better for us all than no gun guiy,,so God bless you all for carrying the cross in these times.

Marshal Deadwood

[Major 2]

Actually, that article appeared in Newsweek April 17, 2000. Here we are 9 years later, and great Colts are still being made. The sky isn't falling after all.

This could shed some light on your 9 years later theory

" ...CMI (Colt Manufacturing, Inc.) is owned by New York banker, Donald Zilkha, who still maintains his Iraqi citizenship. Unfortunately, while Mr. Zilkha owns CMI, he *does not* own the name "Colt". That belongs to the State of Connecticut. The State gained ownership of the name when the companies previous owners went bankrupt in 1994 owing the State of Connecticut pension fund $11,000,000.
 
Zilkha's arrangement with the State required him to keep the ailing company in Connecticut for ten years, which included the manufacturing of any gun that had ever been produced in that factory....or pay the State $11,000,000 they lost in the previous bankruptcy...."

http://www.rense.com/politics5/colt.htm

[Marshal Deadwood]

SO,,,let me see if I understand this. Colt is made by Amiericans,,,(mostly),,,and get their paychecks from and Iraqi ?

Ya sure that aint a 'Rampant Camel' on them thangs ?

(jest a teasin' fellas',,jest a'teasin' !)

MD