Got the Belgian Spencer

[John Brooder]

What a beautiful piece of work!  Made by Falisse & Trapmann for Brazilian cavalry in 1873 and converted by unknown, possibly the factory, to centerfire in 1877 according to what I have read..  Serial numbers matching breach block, carrier block, cocking handle, forend ring, tubular magazine and handle with both Belgian and Brazilian proof marks.  Looks all original.  Sorry about the photos.

[John Brooder]

There re many more photos so if there is something that you want to see please let me know.  As far as the barrel twist, I have misplace my rifle cleaning rod and cannot provide that at this time.  The bore looks pretty clean but I haven't given it a good



Thank you for looking. 

[El Supremo]

Thanks, John:
Lucky you.
More photo's please.
Will standby on twist.
What related stuff are you seeking, please?
Smiles,
El Supremo/Kevin Tinny

[John Brooder]

Kevin, Thanks! The only thing that I would love to find is a Brazilian, Belgian or other period made 56-50 center fire cartridge but they appear to be rare as hen's teeth.

[John Brooder]

[John Brooder]

Used a 6-inch pistol cleaning rod with a bearing in the handle and a jag with patch to measure twist and it made a 1/4 turn in 6-inches.  Did this 5 times and it was a 1/4-turn each time.  Does this equal 24:1 twist or are my complete lack of math skills coming back to haunt me.

[El Supremo]

Thanks, John:
Your 4X6 twist at 24" helps.

"HERBERT" a SSS Member, posted a while ago that he owned a Belgian Spencer with 24" twist, and that it shot well with 350-380gr. bullets.

Marcot shows a French rimfire Spencer cartridge, but not a center-fire cartridge. I will ask a friend in Maine who sees Spencer cartridges at gun shows to help. If you have a photo of one, please add it to your Thread. Smiles.
El Supremo/Kevin Tinny

[El Supremo]

Hello, John:

More on cartridge:

Searched the Internet for Belgian and Brazilian 56-50 cartridges. A website popped: WWW.Munitions.org.
Using its search box, two vintage centerfire cartridge photo's are presented. I emailed them, since I cannot Post here via my DROID cell.  Perhaps, please, you can add them to this Thread. Maybe someone will share more about them and IF any might be available.

Also, your much appreciated photo's do not  show a blade extractor. Maybe the Lane version is used. 

The photo's appear to show cases that might be duplicated with modern ones. I can send you some 56-50 centerfire cases to test fit.

El Supremo/Kevin Tinny

[John Brooder]

Thanks for the information Kevin!  I'd love to get ahold of a fresh 56-50 centerfire case.  I am happy to pay for one.
As far as the extractor, see the photos below.  I don't know Spencer's that well yet but there is a blade that slides along the inside of the receiver.  It is smaller/shorter than the one in my 1860.

[El Supremo]

Big help, John:

I noticed a dark line on the inside of the action in a photo. Your latest photo seems to show the shorter blade, spring assisted version, not the Lane that rests at 6:00 relative to the chamber.

Thanks for your PM'd contact info.  I sent some cases, etc for test fitting. They have a lightly wider rim OD and should extract better vs. STARLINE's with narrower rim OD. I can supply cast bullets to simplify your process.

My next pkg will include some bullets to use for measuring the bore's groove and land diameters.  I see .516" groove and .500" land OD's in 1865 Models, but have no info on the Belgian ones.  It's simple to gently drive a slightly oversized slug into the muzzle for preliminary dimensions. If you have no measuring tools, I can do it if you return the slugs to me. 

Your Belgian Spencer presents a great opportunity to gather more
Info that is not in Marcot. Perhaps you can share:
1. Is the firing pin spring loaded so it retracts below the block face before the block is lowered?
2. What are the thicknesses of the receiver at the top, front and above the lever?  These vary with other Spencer 56-50 models.
3. Please try to post a close-up, sharp photo through the buttplate opening that shows the butt end of the outer magazine tube.
4. Oh, what is the approx. length of the chamber?  Another Belgian Spencer seems, from.an Internet Auction site, to be converted to 50-90. I am not sure how a much longer 50-90 could be even single loaed. Maybe the auction house is mistaken.

Many thanks, John.

El Supremo/Kevin Tinny

[John Brooder]

1. Is the firing pin spring loaded so it retracts below the block face before the block is lowered? 
I don't think so but I don't know how to check this?

2. What are the thicknesses of the receiver at the top, front and above the lever?  These vary with other Spencer 56-50 models.
Top of  receiver 1.159"
Front of receiver 1.173"
Above the lever  1.013"
- Please note these were taken with a dial caliper - i have had so-so accuracy with these -I have a digital in a box somewhere that I will try to find

3. Please try to post a close-up, sharp photo through the buttplate opening that shows the butt end of the outer magazine tube. 
See photo



4. Oh, what is the approx. length of the chamber? 
1.16" but it is very approximate - see photo below



Another Belgian Spencer seems, from.an Internet Auction site, to be converted to 50-90. I am not sure how a much longer 50-90 could be even single loaed. Maybe the auction house is mistaken.
See photo above. I don't see how a 50-90 fits