Max overall length for .44-40?

[LonesomePigeon]

 I got an MP Mold 433-640 and made some .44-40 black powder ammunition. They chambered and shot fine in my Uberti revolver.

However, the cartridge Over All Length was 1.62" and the Lee Cast Bullet manual lists the OAL for .44-40 as 1.59". Does anybody know if these 1.62" would cycle in my rifle?

The rifle is a Miroku-Winchester Model 1873. These 1.62" cartridges do chamber no problem when single loaded through the top. I am just not sure if I should try loading through the magazine.

[Bunk]

First be sure you can unscrew the end cap plug on the magazine tube.
Then try the round it will either feed or  it will jam.
If it feeds you are golden.
I it does not refer to it as the miserable male child of a female dog, unscrew the tube and dump everything out.
Reset the seating die.
In the Gunsmith tool section the magazine end cap tool of Uniquetek is the proper tool.
You will need that that and help to hold the gun. A very good vocabulary of profanity may be needed.
Be very careful replacing the end cap it is threaded about a zillion TPI.
At least that is my experience don't ask how I know.
respectfully submitted
Bunk

[Black River Smith]

LonesomeP,

I had a similar situation last year.  I had 44/40's loaded with smokeless for pistols using the original Winchester bullet mold.  These were all short at about OAL of 1.585", using a Lee factory crimp.  Then last year, I found a Rossi 92 in 44/40 and started to test the functioning with these same OAL bullets.  As you can imagine the spring pressure in the rifle caused set-back of the bullets.  The same thing happened in my Uberti 1866.

This then started me on experimenting to determine max length and crimping capabilities.  The results were that a pistol and the Rossi would handle something over an OAL of 1.605" to 1.61".  But my Uberti 1866 toggle-link did not like that 1.605" length and would not lever.  I did determine that a max length for the 1866 was 1.604" and less was better.

In the end, I ended up using a RCBS 44-200-FN bullet mold that I had for years.  That mold has a crimp groove and produces a final OAL of 1.582", which is very close to what a Winchester tong reloading tool and the original Winchester bullet mold produces as a final OAL for black powder loads.

You will just have to try different OAL in your new Winchester 1873 until they cycle.  Remember with an 1873 lifter, that long bullet will not go up.  Go REAL SLOW with this.  It will hit the receiver and stop.  Just push it down with you finger.  You can push the cartridge forward, back into the magazine slightly then slowly work the cartridge back out the opened loading gate.    Use something brass to push the cartridge.  Or use Bunk's approach.  Just do this until you get your maximum working length.

Hope this helps you out.

[Abilene]

Max for the toggle link guns is about 1.6" (the length of the mortice opening in the frame).  Open the lever so the carrier rises and turn the gun over.  If your cartridge will fit into the opening in the bottom, it will feed.

[LonesomePigeon]

Thanks so much for the advice. I think I will make a few dummy rounds so I don't try this with live ammo. I will report my findings. Worst case scenario I can shoot the rounds I already have in my revolver and go back to the Mav Dutchman for my rifle.

[Abilene]

BTW, regarding Bunk's advice about emptying rounds out of the magazine tube.  It certainly is advisable to make sure you can get the mag tube cap off for whenever you might need to and to be able to clean the mag tube, but most times you can back cartridges out of the loading gate on these guns.

[Coffinmaker]

Oh Lonesome One

Normaly, I'da jumped all over this one, but the guys ahead of me just plain nailed it.  After the dissertation(s), there is a really short answer.  The Carrier Block of yer rifle will determine YOUR correct overall length.  If your rounds will drop into and fall out of your carrier, your gold. 


People ARE Hazardous to Yer Health

[Cliff Fendley]

Just try it?

[LonesomePigeon]

Abiline said "Max for the toggle link guns is about 1.6" (the length of the mortice opening in the frame).  Open the lever so the carrier rises and turn the gun over.  If your cartridge will fit into the opening in the bottom, it will feed."

Yes my dummy cartridges do fit in the mortice but just barely. I am afraid to try to cycle them through the magazine because I don't think I would be able to unscrew the magazine cap, the set screw is really tight.

I do have the Big Lube Mav Dutchman which I know shoots great in this gun.