Uberti 1873 El Patrons with black powder?

[DeaconKC]

Okay, I just got a pair of Uberti El Patrons. I was gonna use them for trade bait but the triggers are SO good they are gonna stay. This has caused me to consider using them with BP. Anybody had experience with them running the Holy Black?

[Coffinmaker]

  Oh for Pete's sake   

Not to be crass and judgmental Deacon (Oh ok, yes I am), but why do some folks keep calling it "The Holy Black??"  there is nothing "Holy" about the stuff.  Just Explosive.  Heck, it can even be made with pee.  It's just Gun Powder.  Anyway:

I don't remember (Memory of a Gnat) if the El Patron has a removable Cylinder Bushing or not.  With the Colt style removable bushing, it should run just fine, although I suggest removing the bushing and polishing, if needed, to ensure it turns freely.  If it's just a solid "nub" sticking out the front, you may have problems with the Base Pin getting sticky from fouling.  Carry a little spritz bottle of PAM with you and that can be remedied really quick.

For whatever reason, Suppository Shooters don't foul as badly as Cap Guns.  You may well not like that silly firing pin thingie though.

Play Safe Out There

[Abilene]

I don't think the term Holy Black came about until people started shooting subs and calling it black powder. 

My 3rd gen Colts do not have removable bushings but do fine with BP.  Just use enough lube.

[Dave T]

My experience with the 45 Colt and BP goes back to the mid-1980s.  There are two major factors to remember.

First shoot soft cast bullets sized to match the chamber throats of you cylinders. And second, be sure they are lubed with a black powder friendly lube - and the more the better - think Big Lube.

After that just fill the space available (no wads or fillers necessary) with a bit of compression.  Then go forth and enjoy the smoke, the stink, and the boom!

Dave

[DeaconKC]

Thank you all. Coffin, the Holy Black comment was meant for fun, as I only load it for a 45-70. They do have the removable bushings, thanks for pointing that out. So if I ever get extremely masochistic, I will give BP a try.

[Coffinmaker]

  Well Schucks 

Gosh Abilene, for the most part, a 3rd Gen Colt, and Ruger, and "others" without a special shaped and removable cylinder bushing suffer from fouling.  The little nub doesn't direct gasses away from the gap.  Ruger will even respond to complaints with "our guns aren't designed for BP."

Those guns require a bundle of lube and attention to run consistently with BP and Subs.  Of course, there is no blanket "They Will" or "They Won't."  Always exceptions.

Play Safe Out There

[Dave T]

The little nub doesn't direct gasses away from the gap.

The man who makes wood boxes shaped like people has hit the nail on the flat part!

I've wanted to try a Model #3 Schofield S&W for a number of years but had always heard the Italian import Schofields, chambered for the 45 Colt rather than the more correct 45 S&W, did not play well with black powder.  Believing S&W's propaganda about the 2000 Model Schofield being an "exact reproduction" I eventually bought one those more expensive recreations.

Just as Coffinmaker said, S&W's little nub which replaced the actual bushing the original's had, didn't play well with BP either.  My copy was so bad, even with Big Lube bullets it would not fire more than 4 rounds, and the cylinder had to be turned by hand to get the 4th chamber in alignment.  It wouldn't budge for the 5th round.

The solution (other than selling it) was to use my last can of Black MZ substitute which got me through 25 rounds without cleaning.  I'm told the Black MZ is nothing more than APP so if the Schofield is still around when this stuff runs out I will seek out a can of American Pioneer Powder.

Bottom line is a properly, traditionally designed cylinder bushing is almost a necessity for shooting black powder.

Dave

[Roosterman]

The man who makes wood boxes shaped like people has hit the nail on the flat part!

I've wanted to try a Model #3 Schofield S&W for a number of years but had always heard the Italian import Schofields, chambered for the 45 Colt rather than the more correct 45 S&W, did not play well with black powder.  Believing S&W's propaganda about the 2000 Model Schofield being an "exact reproduction" I eventually bought one those more expensive recreations.

Just as Coffinmaker said, S&W's little nub which replaced the actual bushing the original's had, didn't play well with BP either.  My copy was so bad, even with Big Lube bullets it would not fire more than 4 rounds, and the cylinder had to be turned by hand to get the 4th chamber in alignment.  It wouldn't budge for the 5th round.

The solution (other than selling it) was to use my last can of Black MZ substitute which got me through 25 rounds without cleaning.  I'm told the Black MZ is nothing more than APP so if the Schofield is still around when this stuff runs out I will seek out a can of American Pioneer Powder.

Bottom line is a properly, traditionally designed cylinder bushing is almost a necessity for shooting black powder.

Dave

I shoot Uberti S&W's with black powder with no problem. I just smear some crisco or wonder lube over the cylinder mouths just like a percussion revolver. Keeps everything sloppy and you can shoot all day.

[2TM101]

  Oh for Pete's sake   

Not to be crass and judgmental Deacon (Oh ok, yes I am), but why do some folks keep calling it "The Holy Black??"  there is nothing "Holy" about the stuff.  Just Explosive.  Heck, it can even be made with pee.  It's just Gun Powder.

I make mine with gardening supplies And toilet paper.  Ans it works fine in my Uberti Cattleman 2 as long as I am using the .357 cylinder. even if I am putting short colt in it.  Mine is a conversion model and the 9mm cylinder does not seem to want to chamber reloads regardless of how I make them up, but the black powder is not an issue.

[Oregon Bill]

"Gardening supplies and toilet paper." 
I've been hearing about the TP-based charcoal and it apparently works extremely well.