With the current State of the hobby

[River City John]

Broken Nose hit the nail on the head.

No need to disturb the Congress, nor rewrite the Rules.

I remember one year the Executive Committee gave a special dispensation for a one time change to allow someone to shoot special conditions at the National without amending the Constitution . . .

[Books OToole]

There are ancient fables in the NCOWS community of KVC scenarios that involved yodeling!  Interesting,  IDK.

B.N.Scotty

There is absolutely no yodeling at the KVC matches. (That was your friend River City John's contribution to the National Match in Kentucky.)

We have had:

Talent contests (a disaster IMO)
Spelling bees ( )
Movie Trivia tests
Old West History Tests

But mostly we just have challenging Shooting stages.

Books

[River City John]

Geez!
ONE lousy stage with a little colorful yodeling and you're branded for life as a ne'er-do-well!

[Cliff Fendley]

There was a time Johnson County Rangers shot 22 during the June monthly match to conserve primers since it was right after the Nationals. We stopped around 8 years ago once getting primers was no longer an issue.

We have discussed that we may have to allow that again to give shooters some options depending on how long this shortage lasts.

Surely we will make it through this shortage just like ones in the past we just may have to get creative and lower round counts, shoot 22, or whatever it takes.

[Mogorilla]

I have never been a hoarder per se, but I am an avid cap and ball shooter.   A few years back, family and friends would regularly gift me with gift cards to cabelas and or bass pro.   Every time I got one, I would get some 777 (they had quit selling real black powder), caps and lead.    Realized I am good for supplies in the cap and ball arena.   Rolled 70 paper cartridges this weekend and would like to get up to 200-250 for a start.    I had moved over to shooting 45 colt as it is quicker, since I only have ~100 large pistol primers, I am thinking cap and ball it is.

[ira scott]

There is absolutely no yodeling at the KVC matches. (That was your friend River City John's contribution to the National Match in Kentucky.)

We have had:

Talent contests (a disaster IMO)
Spelling bees ( )
Movie Trivia tests
Old West History

But mostly we just have challenging Shooting stages.

Books

Thanks for clearing that up Books,  I KNEW that RCJ was involved!

Why were the talent contests a disaster,  because there was none?

B.N.Scotty

[Tascosa Joe]

I can spell Bee, but I never saw a bee that could spell

[River City John]

   

        THE LEGEND OF "YODELING EUSTIS" AND HIS FRONTIER JUSTICE

     "There is a story told along the cattle trails of a cowboy whose honesty, steadfastness and skill when riding herd made him the darling of every Trail Boss. A cattle drive was guaranteed profitable if they could hire on this drover. There were fewer beef lost along the journey, higher prices than anticipated offered at trail's end, . . .why even Cookie's grub seemed to improve!
He was known as 'Yodeling Eustis'. He claimed the secret of his success, and hence his moniker, was that his yodeling held a powerful spell over man and beast.

     Now our story takes place at the lazy end of summer two years after the locusts, but several years before the great blizzard. It was the year of that devil twister, if you'll remember.
We find our Hero enjoying some well-earned entertainments at the railhead town after the end of another cattle drive. And these entertainments included whisky, a fine cigar, and a turn at the gaming tables. But unbeknownst to our Friend he had fallen into a crooked game run by an impecunious, vile, most foul. . . .Well!, if you knew half of what I've heard, the less said the better.
     This rake and his cronies thought they had stumbled on easy pickings, and grew smug and discourteous because they believed they would easily cheat our Innocent out of his entire poke.
     But our Pride 'n' Joy was no one's fool, and soon after discovering their deceit he rose to his feet to call their bet. He drew iron and looked them square in the eye.

     And then he began to yodel."


( No shotgun.)

Set up the stage with the targets at different ranges, enough to offer increasing degrees of difficulty, from easy to "you gotta be kiddin'!" Assign an increasing point value as they go up in difficulty.
Then play the stage as if it was a hand of poker. NO TIMER USED. Each shooter plays against the other members of their posse. THERE ARE NO MISSES, and each target must be hit ONCE in ascending order. Once a shooter misses, or shoots a target out of order, they're out of the game for that stage. Draw cards to determine the first shooter. Each shooter builds their point score starting with the first target. When they reach a point level where they're comfortable it's going to be hard to best, they can stand pat and let the next shooter have their turn. If a subsequent shooter raises the best score, those who have not been eliminated can try to beat that new score by starting on the next target from the one where they had left off. 

There could be a lot of flexibility when setting target arrangement and to assign which firearm to be used when engaging groups of targets.
Here's the 'wild card'. All shooters must yodel while engaging their targets.

And the scoring?
It's winner takes all, so the winner has their final point score REMOVED from their overall match time as a bonus. All other posse members have the winning score ADDED to their overall time.
So there is a real incentive to not miss.

[Robert Swartz]

The local club I am part of has a class labeled "Indian Fighter".  Black Powder only, one or two pistols, can be cap and ball or cartridge loaded with bp. Single shot cartridge rifle, bp cartridges. Single or double barrel shotgun, bp loads, NCOWS leadshot sizes. Not a heavily contested class. If you only shoot one pistol, you shoot five targets. Single shot rifle, five targets. Shotgun, two targets. Per each stage. You will see variation in the number of guns. I typically only carry my SAA and 1873 Trapdoor. I would say it's a catchall bp class that is fun to shoot. I like it because I can shoot and not burn up a boatload of ammo.

[Pitspitr]

I'm not sure shooting BP will be that much of a help right now. I had thought it would be: however, after getting my 45-70 reloaded and preparing to reload my 50-70 and realizing that I might not have enough on hand for the 50-70's, I got on Power Inc.'s web site and found that they were sold out too. (at least they were sold out of Goex and OE FF)

[pony express]

I'm not sure shooting BP will be that much of a help right now. I had thought it would be: however, after getting my 45-70 reloaded and preparing to reload my 50-70 and realizing that I might not have enough on hand for the 50-70's, I got on Power Inc.'s web site and found that they were sold out too. (at least they were sold out of Goex and OE FF)

You might check Graf & Sons for some BP. I just got several more pounds from them, I got Graf's brand this time. But their shipping is really delayed since covid started, was about 3 weeks between ordering and delivery. But I haven't checked again, they may be sold out of everything by now.

[ira scott]

Pony,  a couple smart fellers like you and the General should be able to MAKE blackpowder,  right?

B.N.Scotty

[Major 2]

returning to the subject

I was thinking two fold...the present shooter that is caught short on components AND  the possible new shooter , who might attend,  but has no guns ( but might have a Ruger Single Six or  old High Standard 22 or H&R )
no reloading equipment or ammo source during this current blight.
So he is outside looking in....

But just maybe a Ruger Wrangler @ $200 would not be a deal breaker and 22 Cal. is still reasonable & available.

Winchester Super-X Super Speed .22LR is just 3 cents each and Browning just under 4 cents each

Winchester Super-X Super Speed .22LR Ammunition 40 Grain Copper Plated LRN 1300 fps | Cheaper Than Dirt

or Browning 22LR Performance Rimfire 1255 fps 40 gr Black Oxide RN 400 per box (lowestammo.com)


apparently scalpers are selling primers at 30 + cents apiece !!!!

[Mogorilla]

Well, if no one is paying $0.30 a piece, they would not be selling them for that.   If we pay them no heed, the prices will come down.    It is like feeding trolls on the web.   Scared individuals are sure everything is going to be stripped away, so they buy anything.   During the last panic, I knew a few people who were buying cartridges for which they had no gun.    Their off the wall thinking was trade goods when the world collapsed, well it kind of did and toilet paper was the currency du jour. 
I figure I will share with new shooters and friends if they need it because I like it when we all have fun.   I will deal with running out of ammo when it happens.

[Major 2]

you need only to look here 
https://www.gunbroker.com/All/search?Keywords=primers&PageSize=24&Sort=13&View=1&PageIndex=1

Scalpers and the "Scared individuals" feeding the frenzy 

the concept was merely a brain cramp  .... back to yodeling   

[Snake Oil]

7000+ auctions tells you all you need to know... artifical inflation!  Nearly 800 auctions for small pistol primers.

[River City John]

Major 2, to me those listings are confusing. How many individual boxes of a hundred primers are you actually getting for that price? Or are they all per brick of 1,000?

If they're $300.00 FOR FIVE BOXES OF A HUNDRED, or half-a-brick, then shame on them indeed!

[Robert Swartz]

Major 2, to me those listings are confusing. How many individual boxes of a hundred primers are you actually getting for that price? Or are they all per brick of 1,000?

If they're $300.00 FOR FIVE BOXES OF A HUNDRED, or half-a-brick, then shame on them indeed!

The prices are all over the place. On top of this, I keep seeing reposts of the gun control wish list bill that was proposed last year. That I believe has spooked more than a few people. This has even gotten BP shooters spooked.

[OklaTom]

Reading through this discussion brings up several points. First, the Heritage, Wrangler, Stallion, Model P Jr, Bearcat are not approved weapons. The small frame single actions are not allowed. At least not yet. We have been looking for documentation that the Spanish small frames existed before 1900. While logic indicates they did based on when the Belgian DA versions were available, we have not found anything definitive we can use to get that restriction off the Unapproved List. If one of you knows of documentation, submit it to me and I'll continue to work this.

Secondly, our by-laws do in fact state that every NCOWS match must follow all the rules. However, I also no that few club matches do so. And it is not for me to act on that. At a Regional or National level, yes. I tend to leave it to the local judges on what they will allow at club matches. The idea is to have fun. So if your club wants to allow the small frame guns and 22 RF at club matches, no problem in my mind.

22RF with black powder is a fairly simple process. First, I have a mould for a 22 heel-base bullet. I also bought a kit for reloading 22s. It comes with the compounds and instructions for repriming. It is a pain but can be done. It works. It also comes with a tool that doubles as a 22 bullet mould and crimping cavity. It works best with 22 LR, but with practice, 22 L and 22 S can be done.
My process for BP 22s is simple. I pull the bullets from 22 ammo and chuck them in my melting pot, as they come out deformed and can't be reused. I have billets cast in the mould I got from Old West Bullet Moulds and use them. Smokeless powder is disposed of and cases refilled with FFFg or FFFFg ( I use FFFFg in 22 short). Press one of my hand casts into the case neck and crimp with the tool I mentioned. I wipe a bit of SPG on the bullet grooves and drop them in the box. Ready to use.

Here is a link to the kit.

http://22lrreloader.com/design-details/

[Abilene]

As I had never researched any of this, I did not know that the bullets would deform when pulling them, though it makes sense.  But I wonder if some headscratching might come up with a tool that could pull them without damage?  Impact puller modified for .22??