which is correct - .45 Colt or a .45 Long Colt?

[greyhawk]

THIS IS EMBARRASSING !!!
I may have to name my name to Long Bunk Stagner.
What about the many disguises of the .38
Can we hash them out some?
Hummmmm?
I ain't gonna sign this except for my initials
This is all
BS

Bunk --- dont quit now weez nearly there page four is just a couple steps away -we might hit ya up fer a prize fer the feller makes the post that does it ...................

[Coffinmaker]

  Holy Moly 

Zounds!!  We Beez THERE!!  According to my Lap Warmer (confuser), Greyhawk wins the Kupie Doll for taking us to 4, yessiree Bobb folks, that's FOUR pages!!!!  Four pages of absolutely fascinating content.  More life lessons than Gerry Fallwell.  Holy Smoke.

Perhaps with just a tad more dissection, we can get to Five??  Oh Hopefullness.  Such boundless knowledge cannot be suppressed.  CONTRIBUTE I say.

Hide and Watch 

[Bunk Stagnerg]

about nothing gadzooks!
OK lets go for 5 about nothing
as usual
BS

[DeaconKC]

We definitely need to thank Bunk Slobberer for giving us such an in depth discussion forum! Why just having Coffinmaker drive me to shoving my little finger in the old pencil sharpener to keep up has been worth the price of admission.

[Professor Marvel]

Ah My Dear Bunk ---

I fear I cannot kill the thread, it has a life of it's own!

I cogitated upon the subject, and mused out loud, wearopun where upon I could have sworn the thread
grew sad eyes and looked at me like one of those big-eyed sad puppy paintings.

Either that or that the lack of sleep is getting to me... like the time I drove 26 hours straight and saw giant bunnies leaping over the road...

yhs
prof tired

[Major 2]

Ah My Dear Bunk ---

I fear I cannot kill the thread, it has a life of it's own!

I cogitated upon the subject, and mused out loud, wearopun where upon I could have sworn the thread
grew sad eyes and looked at me like one of those big-eyed sad puppy paintings.

Either that or that the lack of sleep is getting to me... like the time I drove 26 hours straight and saw giant bunnies leaping over the road...

yhs
prof tired

Pooka

"P O O K A - Pooka - from old Celtic mythology - a fairy spirit in animal form - always very large. The Pooka appears here and there - now and then - to this one and that one - a benign but mischievous creature - very fond of rum pots, crackpots, and how are you, Professor Marvel ?" "

[Crow Choker]

OK, since the difference in terminology in what is proper to use be it 45 Colt or 45 Long Colt has been hashed over, some feel the thread should be locked, some not, I'll take the road of "high-jacking" a thread with this:

Can any of ya 'splain' to me if ya ever heard the term (and use) in 'splainin' what a known object, thing, part of, physical and /or geometrical location, anything that is known to you, but ya don't have the word to properly identify it. I'm talkin' bout the word/term, "Hoot-i-ki" or "Houd-i-ki". Could be spelled 'Houda-ki to, the 'ki' rhymes with sky. It ain't in the cyber-space of words no matter how ya spell it. In my little space of this earth where I live and grew up, if a person while splainin' things, if he (not to many she's) didn't have or want to 'splain' what they were referencing to used the term.

For directions- "Ya go down the road to where that 'Houd-i-ki" is and take a left". Parts-"I don't know where this"'Houd-i-ki' goes or how it fits". For physical parts of the landscape- "I went over that 'Houd-i-ki' on the north side of the crick and got a shot at that big ten pointer". All kinds of possibilities.

Several years ago I was 'splainin' to my full time Army son-in-law about a location east of my residence where a old bridge was taken out several years before and a section of road was built south of it going around the section of creek/crick to avoid buiding a new bridge. When I was a heavy equipment operator, I worked on the project. Loved that job. Mile down the road-could leave at 0655 and be at work by 7 bells! Anyway was telling the son-in-law about the old bridge that was taken out how the original road curved in and around the heavily tree lined timbered area. Always shaded, darker than normal  through there, all us locals called it "Sleepy Hollow"! Anyway, son-law asked me where was that and I advised him "Down the road east where that 'Houd-i-ki' is"! He looked at me and asked "What is a houd-i-ki"? So I 'splained' to him and he laughed and shook his head saying he had never heard that before. Course' he grew up 100 miles east of me. I told him next time he has his troops out (he's a 1st Sgt) or 'splainin' something to his CO about something to use the term. He advised he 'd have to think about that.

Anyway, food for a thought this early Saturday morning-felt like postin something and thought of this. Gotta go outside now and pick up that 'houd-i-ki' the wind blew over in my yard last night!  Sure miss that Sleepy Hollow drive through---didn't like the fact that the county didn't replace the old bridge and built that 'Houd-i-ki' around it!!!

[Major 2]

Houd-i-ki   ?   nope  ... 'round it might be called a  doohickey

given rise to ...
gizmo, thingamabob, thingamajig,, whatchamacallit, whatsis, widget, doodad, doojigger, gimmick

[Crow Choker]

Houd-i-ki   ?   nope  ... 'round it might be called a  doohickey

given rise to ...
gizmo, thingamabob, thingamajig,, whatchamacallit, whatsis, widget, doodad, doojigger, gimmick

All legitimate and accepted terms!!!!! 

[Coffinmaker]

  Ah Fitzwilly 

It's Saturday Morning.  Saturdays Suck (unless I'm shooting somewhere).  All the Kings Horses and all the Kings Boys and Girls are loose from their respective Cubicles.  RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!!  The CUBICLEITES are LOOSE.  Clogging up everything.  My weekend runs from Monday thru Friday.  You see, I are Retarded . . . er . . Retired.  Yep, that's it retired.  Really long weekends now.  Except for Saturday and Sunday.  Cubilcleites ya know.

Now, what does this have to do with the OP you might ask.  Absolutely nothing says I.  ZERO, Zip, Nada, Not-a-Thing.  It's Saturday and I'm not shooting.  At means I are bored and am a nuisance.

Hide and Watch.

[Bunk Stagnerg]

would a discussion on the evils of certain substitutes, especially one that start with a "P" or one that is 111 past the sign of Satan?
Going for 6
Bunk 

[Abilene]

Houd-i-ki   ?   nope  ... 'round it might be called a  doohickey

given rise to ...
gizmo, thingamabob, thingamajig,, whatchamacallit, whatsis, widget, doodad, doojigger, gimmick

Don't forget dillybopper.   
Crow, I never heard of houd i ki
Maybe it was started by somebody who with dyslexia trying to say doohickey??

[Professor Marvel]

Pooka

"P O O K A - Pooka - from old Celtic mythology - a fairy spirit in animal form - always very large. The Pooka appears here and there - now and then - to this one and that one - a benign but mischievous creature - very fond of rum pots, crackpots, and how are you, Professor Marvel ?" "

Why, thank you Harvey,   It is always nice to hear from you :-) ... I hope you are well also...




Since Bunk ... or somebody... brought up "Other Cartrdiges" , particularly the numerous .38's
I thought I would throw oiut my entire list of "older" cartrdiges which both provide some
historical stuff on whichto base the "Long Colt" nomenclature, and which also add to the confusion... or fun...


.22 Short
.22 Long
.22 Long Rifle

.32 S&W
.32 S&W Long (.32 Colt New Police)

.32 Colt [inside-lubricated .32 Long Colt variant]

.32 Short Colt
.32 Long Colt
.320 Revolver (.320 European, .320 Bulldog, .320 Webley)

.38 Short Colt
.38 Long Colt
.38 Special

.38 S&W
.38 Colt New Police
.380 Rim
.38 S&W Corto
.380-200 British Service
.380 Revolver Long [Webley pattern from 1860s]

.41 Short Colt
.41 Long Colt
.41 Long Colt smokeless


.45 Mars Short
.45 Mars Long

.455 Webley (.455 Webley Revolver Mark 1)
.455 Webley (.455 Webley Revolver Mark 2)
.45 Schofield (.45 Smith & Wesson/S&W Schofield)
.45 Colt Government (.45 Colt Short)
.45 Colt (.45 Long Colt)
.450 Adams (.450 Boxer, .450 Revolver, .450 Short/Corto)
.455 Webley (.455 Revolver, .455 Colt)

[Major 2]

Always loved the movie...

[Bunk Stagnerg]

What about the .45 very short Colt, the .45 CAS Adirondack Jack's contribution to hand gunnery?
Major I think you left that one out.
Carrying on the nonsense.
Bunk

[Major 2]

   that is the good Professor's list  ...

[Bunk Stagnerg]

sorry Major,  was so blinded by the brilliance of this discussion I got distracted.
But shiny things  distract me no offense intended Professor.
And Deacon I do not slobber...drool a bit at a Dairy Queen Blizzard  perhaps but not slobber.
BS
.

[Professor Marvel]

My Good Major -

I too enjoyed the movie immensely.. until (back in my youth, before the interwebs) I had time to do a serious library search
on Pookahs and found that they were actually a "less than friendly" entity that were said to lure children and other "innocents" to their death,
usually via falls into chasms in fields and whatnot.... rather like the "tommyknockers" in mines.... altho some maintain that "tommyknockers"
are actually trying to warn miners that danger is imminent...

My Dear Bunk -
I did actually, deliberately, without malice, but with forethought leave out the .45 CB or .45 Short Colt as it is a more modernisch device,
and I was after the more  archaic cartridges ( and I fauled the spelling bee again, in my above list) .

In the list was the extreme oddball, the .45 Mars - apparently Webly was experimenting with ugly autos

https://www.militaryimages.net/media/webley-mars-45.29295/full

the wiki article is so amusing I must provide some snips:

snip--------------------
The Mars Automatic Pistol, also sometimes known as the Webley-Mars, was a semi-automatic pistol developed in 1900 by the Englishman Hugh Gabbet-Fairfax and distributed by the Mars Automatic Pistol Syndicate Ltd. of Birmingham. It was manufactured first by Webley & Scott and later by small gunmakers in Birmingham and London. Manufacture ceased in 1907.

The Mars Automatic Pistol is noted for being available in a variety of 8.5 mm, 9 mm and .45 calibres. These were all bottlenecked cartridges with a large charge of powder, making the .45 version the most powerful handgun in the world for a time....

The Mars Automatic Pistol was rejected by the British War Office .... because of the unacceptably large recoil, considerable muzzle flash, and mechanical complexity.

The captain in charge of tests of the Mars at the Naval Gunnery School in 1902 observed, "No one who fired once with the pistol wished to shoot it again".

Shooting the Mars pistol was described as "singularly unpleasant and alarming".
endsnip--------------------

.45 Mars Long Specs:
220 gr  FMJ bullet  at     1,200 ft/s  producing    700 ft⋅lbf

"Ballistics are similar to the .45 Winchester Magnum. "
but no -
.45 Winchester Magnum Specs
230 gr (15 g) JHP at    1,600 ft/s  producing   1,307 ft⋅lbf


thus, we can see it would actually be closer to

the .45 Super
200 gr (13 g) JHP    1200 fps     639 ft⋅lb
230 gr (15 g) FMJ    1100 fps            618 ft⋅lb

or the .451 Detonics Magnum
200 gr (13 g) JHP    1281 fps     729 ft⋅lb



yhs
prof can't spell

[Coffinmaker]

  My Good Perfesser   

I find your bringing up of the Mars Automatic Pistol to be curiously refreshing.  Until today, I was unaware of the actual existence of the Webley-Mars in the lexicon of pistolness.  Actually quite interesting.  It also sounds (reads) as such the recoil was some robust as it twer.  Such as I (Wimpasarus) would probably find it somewhat uncomfortable to play with (shoot).

I do not however, find phault with one for Phauling a meir Spelling Bee.  I find mine own spelling to be atrocious enough my spel czech is unable to find a suitable substitute.  Sally Fourth and All.

Hide and Watch

[Professor Marvel]

  My Good Perfesser   

I find your bringing up of the Mars Automatic Pistol to be curiously refreshing.  Until today, I was unaware of the actual existence of the Webley-Mars in the lexicon of pistolness.  Actually quite interesting.  It also sounds (reads) as such the recoil was some robust as it twer.  Such as I (Wimpasarus) would probably find it somewhat uncomfortable to play with (shoot).

I do not however, find phault with one for Phauling a meir Spelling Bee.  I find mine own spelling to be atrocious enough my spel czech is unable to find a suitable substitute.  Sally Fourth and All.

Hide and Watch

Ahhhh ... perhaps my issue is that I have a Spelling Lithuanian?

falling down the rabbit hole of strange and dead cartyridges can lead to some wierd crap... which can be Great Fun!
The PLethora of strange semi-auto's being invented at the turn of the century is a marvelous topic all by itself!

I once had an encyclopedia of obsolete cartridges .... many were strange European inventions.

That is not even counting the crazy wildcat cartridges.

I was interested in, but never pursued , the .38/45 Clerke , a .45 ACP necked down to take .38 bullets
that was introduced in Guns & Ammo in 1963...

with a  130 gr @ 1,245 ft/s with 445 ft⋅lbf  it was on par with the .38 super 130 FMJ @ 1,215 ft/s  with 426 ft⋅lbf
but the .38 super was already there, readily available, and worked fine atnd had a really burning load of
115 Gr  @ 1,395 ft/s

then came the 9mm Win Mag, the .451 Det, the .45 Win Mag,all the other .45 Magnums :-(  ... 
the 10mm, and the .357 SIG and I got overhwlemed by too many choices  bored and went back to
"old stuff" that did not hurt to shoot. And the Tin Cans, Bowling Pins, and paper/cardboard  targets did not care one wit
what I missed them with!

Now look what you've done, you've made me end my sentance in a propostion!

yhs
prof mangled