1870's Issue hats

Robert Swartz · August 18, 2020, 09:47:33 PM

What's the recommendation for the issue hats circa 1870's. I've read about CW issue stocks still being in use shortly after the war. Also understand those caps were shoddy and in disrepair in a short time. A CW forage cap wouldn't really work for me. So, I want a decent issue cap. Who makes them besides the Quartermaster Shop? Don't tell me about "Dirty Billy", not worth my time dealing with him. Another hat I might be interested in is the Andrews hat. Any good reproductions of these?

Major 2 · August 19, 2020, 03:54:57 AM

You might try

http://www.ushist.com/indian_wars/us_military/uniforms/hats_indian-wars.shtml

pony express · August 19, 2020, 06:13:06 AM

I've never actually tried to buy anything from that US history website, but I've not heard any good reports from anyone who did. But it's a good reference site.

Major 2 · August 19, 2020, 06:41:36 AM

I've met Terry Leavey , worked with him on a few films, mostly different dept.'s ( he in wardrobe ) I was the Art Dept.
But I recall he was one of my set dressers on one shoot , and we got on fine....

I have not had dealings in 25 years though, he was just a thought,
His 72 Cap looked good.
..your call... I'm a Lighthouse

Bat 2919 · August 19, 2020, 11:26:31 AM

I bought an "M1905 Tan Campaign Hat" form US History, my one and only purchase from them. I wasn't impressed and I see they say this manufacturer is now out of business, not hard to figure out why.

I got my black officers (private purchase, better quality) 1876 campaign hat from your friend Billy. This was my second hat from him so I knew what I was getting into when I ordered. He's slow and cantankerous but he knows his hats.

Pitspitr · August 19, 2020, 12:07:15 PM

I don't know if they're still in business, but these guys were museum quality:
Greg Starbuck
P. 0. Box 30948 50
Savannah, GA 31410
(912) 897-1027

http://www.njsekela.com/
Nicholas Sekela
Historical Clothiers
P. 0. Box 28
Butler, NJ 07405
(201) 283-0800

This outfit is really good too:
https://www.quartermasterdepot.com/

I've personally used all three sources with no complaints

Major 2 · August 19, 2020, 12:32:15 PM

I have not talked to Greg (Greg Starbuck) in years , he made my Confederate Officer Kepi...I don't know if he is still active....but he was in 2019

Tim Bender ( retired 2013 ) was my choice for my Spam-Am Campaign & my 1912 Punitive Hats , I also had a Bell Crown of his...
Just TOP quality ... His hats turn up on eBay often ....

Ha ! I was trying to think of Nicholas Sekela...and I kept coming up with Neil Sedaka

which I knew was not right !

as far a dirty billy (lower case intended) I would not deal with him in a fire sale if I sold bottled water !

Pitspitr · August 19, 2020, 01:08:11 PM

Well, breaking up is hard to do.

1961MJS · August 19, 2020, 02:45:22 PM

Hi

If you want a Kepi, I think it's Dirty Billy or possibly Quartermasters Shop. I remember reading that while most Quartermaster Shop stuff is good, their Kepi's not so much. I doubt I could find where I read that since I didn't want a Kepi then anyway. Starbuck's stuff looks good, but I haven't dealt with him.

If you want a period slouch hat, then pretty much any custom hatter can make a great one that fits your head for between $250 (Bunny fur) and $600 (100% Beaver). As long as know a crown height and a brim size you're golden. I can recommend Mike Moore of Buckaroo Hatter in Covington Tennessee, and Roy Jackson of Jaxonbilt Hats in Salmon Idaho. Roy sends you a conformer to measure your head. I sent Mike a copy of the outline Roy used... If you can get into a custom cowboy hat shop with a color, a crown height, a brim size, a ribbon width, and a bow style it's pretty much yours. Those are the TWO cowboy hat guys I've dealt with.

Later

Robert Swartz · August 19, 2020, 08:51:02 PM

Quote from: Pitspitr on August 19, 2020, 12:07:15 PM
I don't know if they're still in business, but these guys were museum quality:
Greg Starbuck
P. 0. Box 30948 50
Savannah, GA 31410
(912) 897-1027

http://www.njsekela.com/
Nicholas Sekela
Historical Clothiers
P. 0. Box 28
Butler, NJ 07405
(201) 283-0800

This outfit is really good too:
https://www.quartermasterdepot.com/

I've personally used all three sources with no complaints

that he made

...yes, Starbuck makes great hats. I had an excellent Union forage cap that he made. Sold it, along with all my really good Civil War gear about 10-11 years back. I'm not in a big hurry. Just trying to see what's out there,

Robert Swartz · August 19, 2020, 08:57:18 PM

Quote from: 1961MJS on August 19, 2020, 02:45:22 PM
Hi

If you want a Kepi, I think it's Dirty Billy or possibly Quartermasters Shop. I remember reading that while most Quartermaster Shop stuff is good, their Kepi's not so much. I doubt I could find where I read that since I didn't want a Kepi then anyway. Starbuck's stuff looks good, but I haven't dealt with him.

If you want a period slouch hat, then pretty much any custom hatter can make a great one that fits your head for between $250 (Bunny fur) and $600 (100% Beaver). As long as know a crown height and a brim size you're golden. I can recommend Mike Moore of Buckaroo Hatter in Covington Tennessee, and Roy Jackson of Jaxonbilt Hats in Salmon Idaho. Roy sends you a conformer to measure your head. I sent Mike a copy of the outline Roy used... If you can get into a custom cowboy hat shop with a color, a crown height, a brim size, a ribbon width, and a bow style it's pretty much yours. Those are the TWO cowboy hat guys I've dealt with.

Latergett

I have real nice black slouch hat that was made by either Tim Allen or Tim Bender, don't remember which about 20 years ago. One of the few CW things I kept. May just use that instead of getting an Andrews hat. Get me a 72 forage cap and be happy. Yes, Greg Starbuck makes good stuff. Had one of his forage caps.

Bat 2919 · August 19, 2020, 10:28:12 PM

I was forewarned about DB before I ordered my first hat from him but no one else makes a Tropical White 1895 kepi so I ordered one from him and when it finally arrived I was very happy. That's why I went back to him for my officers 1876 complete with the Bracher ventilator installed. He's not my first choice but if I'm looking for something no one else makes, he can make it. He knows what I want and offers his "suggestions" about how to make it more authentic. Not an easy man to deal with but a wealth of knowledge none the less.

Robert Swartz · August 19, 2020, 11:12:11 PM

Quote from: Bat 2919 on August 19, 2020, 10:28:12 PM
I was forewarned about DB before I ordered my first hat from him but no one else makes a Tropical White 1895 kepi so I ordered one from him and when it finally arrived I was very happy. That's why I went back to him for my officers 1876 complete with the Bracher ventilator installed. He's not my first choice but if I'm looking for something no one else makes, he can make it. He knows what I want and offers his "suggestions" about how to make it more authentic. Not an easy man to deal with but a wealth of knowledge none the less.

I can agree with this. Both counts, lol.

1961MJS · August 20, 2020, 11:02:27 AM

Hi

I'm considering a Kepi, but I wear my hats down on my head pretty far. I'm not sure if I'd look good in a 1872 Kepi. I hear that they feel like they're about to fall off all of the time.

How do you get an order in with Greg Starbuck? I've seen his Facebook site, but I don't go Facebook. If Zuckerbutt wants my data he can hack my laptop.

Later

River City John · August 20, 2020, 11:21:46 AM

Dixie Gun Works offers passable goods for the money, too.

My take on wearing a kepi, . . . when I wear one in a match I'm constantly losing it whenever I bend over to brass. It's a forage cap, ample "jam down on the crown" fit. An 1872 will ride higher, so would be more prone to being unable to resist gravity.

I've gone to wearing either a straw or a battered Boss of the Plains for shooting and keep the kepi for sitting around the campfire.

RCJ

1961MJS · August 20, 2020, 11:34:07 AM

Quote from: River City John on August 20, 2020, 11:21:46 AM
Dixie Gun Works offers passable goods for the money, too.

My take on wearing a kepi, . . . when I wear one in a match I'm constantly losing it whenever I bend over to brass. It's a forage cap, ample "jam down on the crown" fit. An 1872 will ride higher, so would be more prone to being unable to resist gravity.

I've gone to wearing either a straw or a battered Boss of the Plains for shooting and keep the kepi for sitting around the campfire.

RCJ

Sounds like an idea. I have a great Spanish American War hat, all beaver from Mike Moore. I wore it at Muster. I may have to get Union Civil War Light Colonel kepi for Dress wear.

Later

Drydock · August 20, 2020, 11:42:42 AM

I use the chin strap. Works great!

A word: Some Kepi's are deeper than others. The 72 had a reputation for being shallow, but it depended on who the contractor was. Ennyways, most any CW sutler sells Kepi's, and they are close enough to the post war design to be within the variance from different contractors. The Kepis I've seen from Quartermaster depot are both good quality, and deep enough to stay on modern heads.

I've got an M1872 from F. Burgess, and I really need to wear the chin strap with that one,

I have a battered, 30 year old Kepi I got from C&D Jarnigan that is still my favorite. http://jarnaginco.com/catframe.html

Major 2 · August 20, 2020, 12:51:01 PM

My federal Kepi was made by the late Ray Giron....

one of the few pieces/equipage I retained when I retired for campaigning in 2001

Robert Swartz · August 20, 2020, 07:36:59 PM

Quote from: Major 2 on August 20, 2020, 12:51:01 PM
My federal Kepi was made by the late Ray Giron....

one of the few pieces/equipage I retained when I retired for campaigning in 2001

..I did the same when I quit CW reenacting about 15 years ago. I have a nice Bender or Allen slouch hat, don't remember which. About the only thing I kept. At the time didn't imagine I would find somewhere else a lot of that stuff would be useful again, lol. I still do some 1812 and F&I events, kept everything but my muskets. I fell into a .62 cal Fowler and recently acquired an 1816 that has been defarbed and remarked. It's a Pedrosoli on top of that. A shootable gun.