40-60 load data ???

[Slamfire]

  Well, it's cold & raining ,, to much time to think,,, according to COTW, the load for the 40-60 win. is 21gr. of IMR-4198 ,, w/ a 210gr. cast bullet,, according to Lyman's 49th Edition , starting load is ( drum roll ),,, 22gr. to max. 28gr." Warning Don't go below starting loads ". I'm at 26.8gr. to 27.2gr. with no hi- pressure signs " YET " ( Chaparral ,, w/ H-4198 ) I'v used 3- diff brands of primers .
Sooooo,, ?  ( If this has been discussed before ,, I MISSED IT ).



   need coffee ,, Hootmix.

[King Medallion]

Did you look thru the "Load Data for the 40/60" thread?

[Slamfire]

 Yes sir I did ,, it just seemed like a big difference ,, just a rainy day question 



coffee's ready ,, Hootmix.

[dusty texian]

It is something to think about . This is the kind of thing that really throw's a beginner off . One reference say's this and another say's that . Then throw in the rule of thumb to start with a 10 percent reduction in load for safety and work up from there . Wow the difference get's even bigger .  Slamfire as a side note have you tried any IMR 3031 in your 40-60 ? I have tested IMR 3031 in my 24" barrel 40-60 using the .406 " 210 gr. bullet over 28 gr. of 3031 and a  piece of TP between cornmeal filler and powder . This load show's no over pressure sign's and is very accurate . ,,,,DT

[Slamfire]

 Hey O'l son , haven't yet , but always look'n for something better.  Speaking of fillers ,, I'v never used any,, seen where folks use all kinds,, soooo , what about " fresh coffee grounds " don't know how it would work but sure would smell good !!! (lol-lol-)


think i'll have a cup of " filler ".,, Hootmix .


  Ck. your PM.

[dusty texian]

The coffee grounds should work OK , bet you have plenty . Have tried the load mentioned without the filler , but the accuracy is better with the cornmeal filler . I know it sounds goofy but it works .  ,,,DT

[Slamfire]

 Hey DT o'l son sorry  ,, been hav'n a bunch of " DO's ",, do you compress the corn mill or fill just to the bottom of bullet ?

  coffee's ready ,, Hootmix.

[dusty texian]

No compress with 3031 , just fill the gap Amigo .,,,DT

[King Medallion]

I use towel laundry lint from the dryer. works great, endless supply. unless of course you never bathe. You do bathe down there, don't ya? I mean, there's gotta be a crick somewhere relatively close by? 

[pinto beans]

greetings all,

I have submitted my two pence worth on this product before but will throw in couple more cents worth here.  Puff-Lon has worked VERY well for me and is used in two different rifles with cast bullet loads (I am Not affiliated with this company, just a happy customer):

http://pufflon.com/newfront.html

Best of luck with the reloading!!

P.B.

[dusty texian]

Have loaded every 40-60 WCF brass I own .  That is one of the easiest cartridges to work with . Cleaned all of my 76 rifles . Now what to do ? ,,,DT

[Slamfire]

 Snuck ( it's a word ,, here ) off to the range 2 days ago ,, 40-60 , changed frt. sight had to do new zero ,, 125 yds, Rail road iron used to hold up cross ties as a back stop,, rail 3" wide , painted orange,, 1 shot , witnessed by a feller there w/ binoc's.  " Man ! dead center ",, 40-60 what's not to like. I'm chase'n a 500yd. 12" bull at a friends place ,, did the 300 yd. 12" ( once ), I don't just want to hit it , I want to " group " some hits. I am go'n try the 3031 , will be over to the new gun shop next week. This next week I will be reforming some 45-70's to 40-60's,, have loaded the others so many times some of the primer pockets are loose.


stay safe,, Hootmix.

[dusty texian]

Take a look at Graf & Sons , they have Jamison brass 40-60 WCF  in stock  1 dollar each . Not bad deal , I picked up another hundred just because . ,,,DT

[Slamfire]

Hey DT ,, thanks ,, do you know the OAL of the cases ?

Hootmix.

[dusty texian]

Still waiting on this new batch of cases . My old Jamison cases are  Length 1.860" with a rim thickness of .055" , I use these cases in 4 different Winchesters they work great . With the 45-70 case rim being thicker you can bring it down for a tighter headspace fit . ,,,DT

[King Medallion]

Take a look at Graf & Sons , they have Jamison brass 40-60 WCF  in stock  1 dollar each . Not bad deal , I picked up another hundred just because . ,,,DT

I saw that, after I ordered 100 from the guy on Guns International!    Hindsight! Oh well, I have 200 rounds to load for if/when I get that caliber rifle.
Now, just need to find brass if the other 2 calibers, 50/95 and 45/60. Getting a a strong pull to get that Big 50! There are a lot of them for sale on gunbroker right now.

[dusty texian]

I saw that, after I ordered 100 from the guy on Guns International!    Hindsight! Oh well, I hat 200 rounds to load for if/when I get that caliber rifle.
Now, just need to find brass if the other 2 calibers, 50/95 and 45/60. Getting a a strong pull to get that Big 50! There are a lot of them for sale on gunbroker right now.

You still got a fair deal on the brass , this brass from Graf & Sons is a pretty good deal for a buck a piece . ,,,,DT

[dusty texian]

Here is something to think about  in the 1930's the 40-60 WCF was loaded with a solid head cartridge 210 gr. Jacketed bullet at a speed of over 1,900 FPS .  That is a very substantial increase over the Bp. load and lead bullet . Anyone sharing info about this loading would be greatly appreciated . A pic. of the cartridge . ,,, DT                           This info from  ( Winchester 73 &76  )  Author    David F. Butler .,,DT

[jthbjr]

Dusty, there were several smokeless powders available in the first half of the 20th century that were formulated for good velocity at low pressure in large capacity cases. Old reloading books will reference loads with "Lightning" and "Sharpshooter" and for our types of guns, giving higher velocity and lower pressure than black powder. They were single base powders made by Hercules. In the same family as "bullseye" as i recall. Problem was they caused extreme barrel erosion from being very hot burning and were very unforgiving of going over the max load. The cartridge companies had access to them longer. Old loading manuals had loads for black powder cartridges that seem far fetched until you find out that they had access to powders that we don't have. And that we wouldn't want to use.
John, still in the fort

[dusty texian]

John the early smokeless loading's are interesting to me . I think the big companies that were  developing these early loads kept their finding's as secret as possible for reasons of trying to stay ahead of the competition  . I also have an idea that they were fazing out the old model gun's by stopping production of the ammunition for these old time gun's and not developing  new smokeless loads for them  and at the same time introducing the new and improved firearms and ammo  . That's not to say that the early powders were not hard on the old mild steel guns , no doubt that it was , and a safety issue also .  It's was an exciting time I'm sure , I can imagine the look on a fellow's face after first time firing a 30-03/06 back then . It was the end for the old Dinosaurs /1876  Winchester but some of the Old Timers liked the old guns and hung on to them even after the improved guns were offered  . A side note when purchasing my first Winchester 1876 many yrs ago a 28" full Oct.Standard Sporting Rifle  the seller said if you would have been here yesterday ( heard that before ) you could have bought the case of ammunition for it . Then he began to tell me that there was most of a case left of 1000 rounds 45/75 . On a second purchase from him I did manage to get the re-loading tool's that belonged to the original owner found in the house . My guess the original owner liked the old rifle because the bore is near perfect and he planned on having plenty enough ammo for it .,,,DT  PS hope that last big blow out in Mason Co. did us no harm . Ron