Do you have a Green Barreled Long Rifle

[Tsalagidave]

I have long arms that have period bluing, blacking, and browning. I have recently come across a turn of the century (1700-1800) recipe to green a barrel. Does anyone have a greened barrel? I'd like to conceptualize how it will turn out and would like to see pictures.

-Dave

[Professor Marvel]

Why My Dear Dave -

I have never before heard of such a thing, and am posting my increduluousness as both support in finding said recipe, and a placeholder ( ie show replies...)

I found an almost random snippet with no provenance or references, perhaps it can help in the search

"On a related note the US M1803 rifle, Yes 1803 Harpers Ferry are sometimes found with a brownish varnish...even on the barrel and lock.
Period US manuals(mostly plagiarized from the British Baker manuals) recommend browning or greening these rifles in the field with a tinted camphor varnish if they became shiny and reflected glare.. Rifle Corps at this time advocated stealth and preferred their arms to be browned and non reflective. Regulars on the other hand proffered their arms (1795 Springfield Muskets) to be in the bright. Regulars also wore blue uniforms with red and white facings while the Rifle Regiments wore green frocks and trousers trimmed in yellow fringe."

yhs
prof mumbles

[Niederlander]

Interesting!  I've never even HEARD of that.  I, too, will be following this...??..

[Mogorilla]

Okay, colour me curious on this.    I would love to know the formula/recipe.  I am an analytical chemist, so my metals/inorganic chemistry is in the dim past but very curious if it is a chemical reaction on the surface of the metal, or a coating.    I would also think you could pick up a steel piece at the hardware store and run the experiment and show us pictures.  hint hint hint.   

[Tsalagidave]

I found this in Wm. Duane's Hand Book for Riflemen (1812)

It is titled "To Preserve the Rifle from Rust" but the author expands on the importance of camouflage.
It is a camphor-based solution and like the Prof. pointed out, appears to be heavily "borrowed" from British manuals.

Here is the recipe. Start with:
1 oz. Camphor
1 gill. Oil of turpentine
1 gill. Florence oil (Florentine olive oil)

Simmer over an open flame in an earthen cup until the mix is incorporated in a uniform state, putting in the camphor last.
Next, add in an ounce of clean, white bees wax. Melt the whole adding in a little sweet oil (virgin olive oil) or turpentine.

For Color:

* Blacked -  Add about an ounce of powdered black lead (graphite)
* Browned -  Add about an ounce of red lead oxide (yes, it?s very toxic  especially as a powder) or red ochre
* Greened - Add about an ounce of powdered verdigris
* Blued - Add about an ounce of Prussian Blue (made from oxidation of ferrous ferrocyanide salts & still available today)

The mixture is applied warm onto the bare metal and rubbed in evenly.
I am thinking about getting a Southern Rifle kit from Track of the Wolf and doing up the metal.  I'll use a dark stain on the wood. I am really intrigued about something that exists in historical texts but is almost unheard of today. I have a feeling that as historically accurate it may be, it's also going to be ugly to our modern muzzloader's eyes.

[Mogorilla]

None of that seems like a surface reaction like Cold Blue is, seems more of a coating.  It makes me wonder if some of the antiques we see were treated this way, just lost the coating after 200 years.     I am definitely interested in seeing the experiment.   

[Tascosa Joe]

I have been messing with this era for 40 years and have never heard of greening a barrel.  I would email Walt Gussler at Williamsburg, VA.  (If he is still alive)

[Tsalagidave]

I agree. It is more like a coating than it is a "bluing" as we all know it. The fact that it just isn't seen out there on the originals as we expect to see it is either the color wears off fairly easy or it somehow fades and/or gets re-coated.

Either way, I'm game.  I love doing something that is period but is so far outside of conventional reenactorisms that it looks like a FARB item and gets a lot of side looks. Thanks for the lead on Walt Gussler. I don't know the man but he would be the guy to ask.

-Dave

[Blair]

Dave,

First off it is Walace Gussler. And the last I heard, he was Furniture Curator. (1992/3)
I have never heard of barrel "greening" in my 50 + years involved in this trade.
Did it happen? Probably! But I would not consider it a common practice.
I would assume it was a (painted) coating of some sort based off of a copper oxide pigment.

My best,
Blair

[Tsalagidave]

Dave,

First off it is Walace Gussler. And the last I heard, he was Furniture Curator. (1992/3)
I have never heard of barrel "greening" in my 50 + years involved in this trade.
Did it happen? Probably! But I would not consider it a common practice.
I would assume it was a (painted) coating of some sort based off of a copper oxide pigment.

My best,
Blair

I have to agree with you Blair.  The book clearly instructs these camphor coatings to be painted on. You are also correct on the copper oxide. Verdigris is the primary ingredient that gives the green color.
I'm fascinated by this because it is a documented process but very few people have heard of it in modern times. It is something that died with the original people of the period...all the more reason why I'd like to see what it looks like.

-Dave

[Mogorilla]

Just finished the last of my Florence oil.   Spent 3 weeks in Italy this summer (hotter than the devil's drawers, as we were there during the heat wave) and one of the weeks was in Florence.   We shipped back from olive oil from a winery in the Chianti region, which is just a hop away from Florence.   Serious difference from any oil here.

[1961MJS]

Hi

This is interesting.  I've browned quite a few Russell Green River knife blades.  What I've done is a rust browning with Laurel Forge Plum Brown, not a paint though.  The rust brown finish is tough, but my kid and his room mate decided it was evil and took it off with a Brillo Pad.  I've also cold blued blades.  I may have to try greening a knife blade just for grins. 

Later

[Oregon Bill]

For heaven's sake, if anyone here greens a barrel or anything else, please post photos! 

[Tsalagidave]

I plan on getting a Southern Rifle kit in the spring. I will follow the recipe  and see how it is turning out.  Next step, I need to make some verdigris. (My wife will love that.) Oh well, what happens at the work bench, stays at the work bench.

-Dave

[Blair]

Dave,

How do you plan on making your verdigris? And what do you plan on using?
My best,
Blair

[Baltimore Ed]

Have everyone in cas city clean up around their chicago screws on their holsters and mag pouches and mail it to him.  In no time Dave will have enough verdigris to green a Chevy.

[Professor Marvel]

Have everyone in cas city clean up around their chicago screws on their holsters and mag pouches and mail it to him.  In no time Dave will have enough verdigris to green a Chevy.

Or have everyone pull the old green cartidges from their belt loops....

Prof Marvel

[Tsalagidave]

Have everyone in cas city clean up around their chicago screws on their holsters and mag pouches and mail it to him.  In no time Dave will have enough verdigris to green a Chevy.

I am going to immerse copper shavings in distilled vinegar, then decant and dry. I know it was a fur  trade article and I have made small portions before but this is my first time making a larger batch of the stuff.  I have no Idea how much I will need for this.  Something tells me that this will be a real messy, frustrating project that I hope I'll learn a lot from. (Probably to not try it again.) But curiosity is getting the best of me.

-Dave

[Blair]

Dave,

Just a thought that may save you some time... see if you can find some copper wool. Like steel wool but made from copper.
Oxidize this in a mild acid, and try it out on different barrel steels to see what you get.
My best,
Blair

[Tsalagidave]

Thanks Blair, actually, you read my mind. Between the machine shop shavings and some copper wool, I should have enough to work with. You hit on something I did not think about.  I have some old discarded steel tools that I can use as guinea pigs to see how the green turns out.  I am guessing it it will have that pukey green color going on wet and hopefully it will mellow a bit as it sets in.

-Dave