Hammer shotguns

Oregon Bill · December 10, 2005, 09:49:16 AM

I owned one of the Baikals several years go with the fake hammers, and I know they now make a model with functional hammers. But it always seemed the hammer ears were a little small for faster work. What are some of the other options in hammer guns out there, and are they worth a hoot? Also been thinking about the old Husqvarnas.

Marshal Will Wingam · December 10, 2005, 11:38:34 AM

The hammers are a bit slower. Most categories allow a hammerless double so that would be better unless the category you want to shoot requires one. I personally prefer a hammerless. When I was a kid, my only shotgun was a Parker SxS 12ga with mule ear hammers. I got that out of my system early, although I still like them. I got pretty good at cocking it on the way up to shoot in one motion. Never could beat a hammerless for speed, though.

Oregon Bill · December 10, 2005, 11:46:45 AM

Marshal Will: I am narrowing down my impression to the early 1870s, and I don't believe a hammerless gun would be a good fit. That's why the interest in the slower hammer guns.

Marshal Will Wingam · December 10, 2005, 11:50:58 AM

Early 1870's may be a bit early for hammerless but check with the NCOWS pards. They should be able to tell you for sure.

Micheal Fortune · December 10, 2005, 12:05:06 PM

The 1878 Colt coach gun is what everyone seems to think is the best thing running these days, of course everyone has their opinion.

Here is a link to TTN who makes (or imports) a modern copy.

http://www.ttnintinc.com/gunmodels.htm#coachgun

It's the one that I'll order here soon anyway.

Four-Eyed Buck · December 10, 2005, 12:29:07 PM

I have the TTN. Love it, I had the lighter hammer springs put in and changed to the bigger front bead. These things are solid and perform as advertised. The hammers are canted towards the centerline of the gun and can be cocked together with one thumb. It shucks the STS hulls I use without any polishing in the chamber too. They have some weight to them, have extended forcing cones, so recoil is pretty neglidgeable for a coach configuration. They are considered cylinder choked, but personally, I think they're a little tighter than that. My shells are 7/8ths oz. loads and I have no problems with KD's around here, and the occassional pop-up birds have been delt with more successfully with this one than the Stoeger I was using before............Buck

El Peludo · December 10, 2005, 12:58:52 PM

Hammers are a bit slower than hammerless, but practice, and some action work can really help speed things up. I have Rossis and Remingtons, both modern and antique; never done any slickin' up on 'em, and used to get along real well when I was shootin' regular like.

Oregon Bill · December 10, 2005, 02:33:05 PM

That TTN 1878 looks pretty sweet, but if it is indeed a close copy of an 1878 Colt, that's too late for me -- not that the Baikal is a copy of anything. Seems I heard there might even be an NCOWS class that allows muzzleloading shotguns, which would be a surer bet for circa 1872. Also, I have seen a lot of original shotguns in museums and in the real West, I think long-barrelled guns were in the vast majority, even for stagecoach and defensive use. A scan of the shotgun chapter in "Firearms of the American West, 1866-1894" shows a number of shotguns in the hands of Wells Fargo and other guards and agents, and nearly all are long-barrelled, including the 10-gauge the Bill the Kid used againt is owner, Deputy Sheriff Bob Ollinger, in 1881. The only real shortie is Doc Holiday's sawed-off 12 with pistol grip.

Will Ketchum · December 11, 2005, 05:17:41 PM

Most of the guns being made today aren't copies of anything. The TTN shotgun is simular to many guns that were available in your time. If it were me and I was that concerned about having the gun fit my era I would move my dates up to 1878 and not worry about it. What revolvers and rifle are you considering?

I have one of the TTNs and it is by far the best shotgun for our sport that I have ever owned.

I believe they are importing a longer barrled virsion now

Will Ketchum

Wymore Wrangler · December 11, 2005, 11:17:06 PM

The TTN is suppose to be a copy of the 1878 Colt double barrel....

Oregon Bill · December 12, 2005, 12:56:02 AM

Howdy Will:
I am debating between Remington Armies in .44 or Colt 1861 Navies in .36 for the revolvers, and plan to use a Spencer in .56-50 for the rifle. I don't care if I'm slow, as long as I'm accurate on the target as well as historically. Latest I can stand to go is 1874 and Adobe Walls. Prefer to develop an impression associated with the Modoc War of 1872-73, as it was fought not far from here. Lots of opportunities for scouts, volunteers, settlers, freighters, miners, etc., in addition to regular Army infantry and cavalry.

Will Ketchum · December 12, 2005, 05:24:38 PM

Bill, if your going to shoot those pistols as C&B and not conversion cylinders then you would be shooting the NCOWS Pistoleer class and a muzzle loading shotgun would be fine.

The biggest problem with Pistoleer for a new shooter is that you spend so much time loading your guns you don't get much time to associate with the other shooters which can be beneficial for a new shooter. Once you get your routine down then you get some more free time to help score or pick up brass and so on.

Will Ketchum

Major 2 · December 12, 2005, 06:13:58 PM

Another TTN owner here... and it is by far my favorite...
I shoot open tops & 1860's , My Henry and just got my Spencer.

I had a Stoeger and I used a borrowed Rossi a few times . I was really impressed by the out of the box TTn,
over the Stoeger which required polishing to even shuck shells and open smartly.
I 'm told the same with the Russian Baikals.

Will Ketchum said...
"if your going to shoot those pistols as C&B and not conversion cylinders then you would be shooting the NCOWS Pistoleer class and a muzzle loading shotgun would be fine."
I'll add...
This class is limited to just two shots for the Shotgun per stage, so there is no disadvantage.

Oregon Bill · December 13, 2005, 01:27:42 AM

Sure hope I can find a pistoleer-class stage to shoot someday, and that the gang will accept Spencers.

blue drifter · December 17, 2005, 12:17:44 PM

Quote from: Four-Eyed Buck on December 10, 2005, 12:29:07 PM
I have the TTN. Love it, I had the lighter hammer springs put in and changed to the bigger front bead. These things are solid and perform as advertised. The hammers are canted towards the centerline of the gun and can be cocked together with one thumb. It shucks the STS hulls I use without any polishing in the chamber too. They have some weight to them, have extended forcing cones, so recoil is pretty neglidgeable for a coach configuration. They are considered cylinder choked, but personally, I think they're a little tighter than that. My shells are 7/8ths oz. loads and I have no problems with KD's around here, and the occassional pop-up birds have been delt with more successfully with this one than the Stoeger I was using before............Buck

buck
how much did it cost you to get the hammer springs changed.I have A new sparten 220 and the hammers are hard as hell to pull back. just looken to get close $$$$

Major 2 · December 17, 2005, 12:54:18 PM

You did not ask me , But I know

Anywhere between $95-140 I been quoted. Now that's not just hammers springs, thats smothing the operation both Action & opening and Polishing the chambers if needed.

With the TTn comes a spare set of Hammer springs that are softer ( so you don't need to buy them )

I would think either the gunsmith will lighten you OEM Sparten ( Remington/Baikals ) springs or charge extra for a set.

blue drifter · December 17, 2005, 01:25:41 PM

Quote from: major231 on December 17, 2005, 12:54:18 PM
You did not ask me , But I know

Anywhere between $95-140 I been quoted. Now that's not just hammers springs, thats smothing the operation both Action & opening and Polishing the chambers if needed.

With the TTn comes a spare set of Hammer springs that are softer ( so you don't need to buy them )

I would think either the gunsmith will lighten you OEM Sparten ( Remington/Baikals ) springs or charge extra for a set.

major, thank you very much for the info. and merry chrismas to you and yours.

Four-Eyed Buck · December 17, 2005, 01:26:03 PM

TTN sent me a set on request, believe they now include them with the gun, as well as the larger front bead.Mine was a fairly early gun. I changed the springs out myself, but some have to be fitted to the individual lock they're going into. One of mine was that way and I had to have my smith help me fit it. Once done though, really nice handling..........Buck

RattlesnakeJack · December 18, 2005, 11:12:57 AM

Though not a "replica" of anything in particular, I love my Rossi Coach Gun. The hammer spurs are set close enough together, and the spring pressure is light enough, that they can easily both be cocked at the same time. Yet I have never had a failure to fire from light hammer fall - nor any other malfunction, for that matter. They break open easily and seem to shuck most hulls without problems.

The downside is that I don't think they are made any more! You might be able to pick one up second-hand, however ....

blue drifter · December 22, 2005, 10:50:06 AM

ha guys
well out here in jersey their arent many gunsmiths.I found 4 and call them all. nobody would work on my hammer springs. so I though I would try and do it myself ( ha ha ) so I called wolf and they said they don't
have the springs for A spartan 220 ( remington inport ) I said my hammers are as hard as hell to pull back
he said can't help ya. he said why don't you call remington. so I called rem and asked for A tec. he said
you cowboy shooters wan't everthing so it shoots fast, fast, fast. well we don't make the softer springs
and we don't sell the springs,nor do we install them!!! use the gun for what it was made for!!! thank you for useing
rem inport, and good by. hell out here in jersey, I should ask the MOB, they must have A good gunsmith.