Cap & Ball without wads or lube?

[Coffinmaker]

Hey Greyhawk  

Glad to se your properly concerned     about the care and feeding of yer Balls     Greasy or not, if ya don't pay attention to yer Balls it can get to be a real >>>>> Cock Up  ,  er problem.  Yes it can  (Can is metal container fer yer Balls  )

Unfortunately, there are more than just a few "Old Wives Tails" out there.    And  one must be particularly careful to take care of those Wives Tails  

Here is the basis of the problem.  Way back inna Wabac (Sherman and the Perfesser), a fella was standing around wid a Cap Gun.  Another fella asked him how to shoot that contraption     We can just about guess, the fella with the contraption really didn't know how either.  Colt didn't provide (a what to do now that it's out of the box book) anymore than Uberti or Pietta do    So we start the whole ball rolling with the blind leading the blind.  Cap Guns were then and are now a learning experience.  In many cases, Trial and Error.  Whether the way a person gets their guns to work is correct or not, that method becomes "right" and is repeated as gospel.  Bunch of time down the road, it gets real blurry, whom said what to whom and was it actually "right."  So .... now we have a bunch of information, a goodly portion of which is crap, but has been repeated as gospel so long .. it must be right.

My suggestion is to do as I did when I started shooting Cap Guns.  I asked questions of EVER Cap Gun shooter I could find.  I asked what they did, and then Why they did that.  If they couldn't explain "why" it means they didn't know any more than I did (ignore em).  Then I read everything I could find on the subject.  Some of that was crap too.  Then I went shooting and tried all that I'd learned.  Some of it even worked.  I've saved and husbanded the things that work.  I repeat (Parrot) nothing I hear or read until I do it myself and see if it works.

The bottom line here, Cap Guns are FUN.  Much more interesting than Suppository Shooters.  Cap Guns make ya really appreciate a good match and treasure a clean match.  Let's get out there and SHOOT.  If the Snow would just melt!!!

[greyhawk]

Hey Coffinmaker
hows we sposed ta keep a straight face wen you keep writin this greasy balls stuff 

I dunno - ya got me all disytracted - was gonna write somethin clever too - saved me whole years quota of clever stuff to put in that one line an its gone .....pffffft

So -- I got lucky with my first capgun - a well used ASM 44 (one o the fake 1851 navys the experts like to dump on hereabouts)
I think the feller sold it knew what he was doin - trigger is real nice - innards work good - sights spot on - yeah somebody tuned that thing to shoot. That was my first handgun -- (we got a load of trouble to own a handgun in this country!) - then I got a lil Ruger single six 22 thinking it would work to keep my eye in - I could just go shoot, dump it back in the safe. Funny thing is I have never shot that Ruger as well as the old capgun - try as I might I cant do it.
Later came a 36 pocket model - dont shoot that one that much but its a nice piece and they a pigeon pair in looks - one the mini version of the other and thats pretty cool
Son got a Walker for his first handgun - yeah - why would ya wanna do that ? big ugly thing - but he took it to our local pistol club and under a low tin roof at night, a touch excess cylinder gap, 65 grains of 5FA GOEX, first shot he stops the place!!! (they thought somethin blew up) second shot - they all come to see what it was blew up!!! -----o k this is why ya get a walker!!! 
He followed with a 1860 army - looked good needed work - early on it stripped the gears under the barrel where the ratchet loading lever works - beyond my pay grade at the time to replace those little gears so I fabricated a remy/early colt lever that kept the lines of the gun intact - done a lot of work on those two pistols - found out I enjoy that almost as much as shooting them -- so yes to fun for sure - but theres more to it even -  satisfaction rates higher than fun I think - take a hundred and fifty year old design - propellant invented in the 13th century - sights that no bullseye shooter would entertain for a minute - non orthopedic grip - put a decent score down with that - very satisfying - whether its a bullseye score or the bang and clang stuff.
The point of my post I forgot..................................             

[Lefty Dude]

When you get older the Balls get smaller !!!!

[PJ Hardtack]

 Let's get out there and SHOOT.  If the Snow would just melt!!!

Yeah - knowwhatchamean ..... we got another foot of snow last night giving us a total of about 5' on level ground. More on the mountains and hills.
That's good from the wildfire point of view, but those that live on flood plains and rivers are already anticipating flooding. The lake we live on has risen as much as 8' feet above the norm in the past. Looks like the same may happen this year.

Now I gotta git out there and put the snow plow to work, clearing our 100 yd driveway and the 500 yd gravel road to the paved road. Then I'll bail out the neighbours and the Community Hall for the ladies quilting club.

Gonna be a busy morning.

[Gabriel Law]

PJ:  gives meaning to your otherwise meaningless winter. I'm looking forward too to green-up.  Was out snowshoeing at the Blackwater today.  What a day!  Clear blue, five feet of powder, temp just below freezing.  Great to see so much moose sign!  But looking forward to burning more powder this year...last year's work schedule and wild fire situation left me wanting.  Not this year.  Getting a new lens in my right eye too real soon.
Back to the thread...I could not be happier with my Deluxe Pietta Navy 51's.  I shoot round ball, grease over the mouths of the chambers and a .375 pure lead ball.  I replaced my nipples with TOW's brand, and they fit my #11 CCI caps perfectly.  I had to grind out the access ports on the frame to get at the nipples with an inline capper but I love the pistols.  They shoot to the sights with a full chamber of FFFg GOEX (less ball space), but agree they are anemic.  At Rope Burn City two years ago, I lost a whole stage 'cause the 36's couldn't activate a steel first target.  I must look into the DDD bullet moulds.
Have enjoyed this thread.

[PJ Hardtack]

Well, my winter has been far from "meaningless".

I've done a lot of bullet casting, lots of reloading and I shoot weekly at our indoor range, mostly IDPA. I x-country ski or snowshoe daily, sometimes both. I intend to come out of this winter fitter than I went in as I hope to to a "Dirty Mudder" event come spring.

As I was mounting the snow plow on my Taco today, one of my dogs was raising Cain over something. I went to investigate (with a corn broom in my hand!) and he was nose to nose with Miz moose and her calf. She would advance, the dog would retreat and the game went on until she got bored and stepped into the DEEP snow where the dog could not go.

I've found their beds in the snow all over our property and the surrounding country. They winter on this side of the lake where we have lots of willows.

I spent the morning plowing our driveway and those of several neighbours. One of them is on her own as her husband is now an invalid and has to be taken to the hospital on a regular basis.  She has livestock to feed. She pulls hay to them on a plastic sled and refers to me as "her angel in a red truck" for the snow removal I do.

I have the means and the ability to be of service, and it is my pleasure to do so.

Anyhoo - backattheranch - "cap guns" are both a challenge and a joy to shoot, grease, no grease, wads or no wads. You have to work to get them to perform and function through a match, but it sure beats 'pop-gunning".

[Coffinmaker]

AARRAAAAAAGH!!   

IT'S SNOWING AGAIN!!  At'll teach me to run off at the blabber fingers.

[PJ Hardtack]

Yeah, we got some more in the forecast as well. We're running out of space to push it.

Back to what Gabe Law was saying about snowshoeing .....

Some "talk" Mountain Man, others "play" Mountain Man. We get to LIVE Mountain Man! In my case, all I have to do is step out the door and I'm likely to run into a moose. If I cross the lake and go into the big tress, I'm alone, and I mean ALONE. Same applies to the Crown land all around me.

Any time of the year, if you go down, you're on your own. I usually have my dogs with me except when I am hunting. I give my wife a rough idea as to where I'm going, but I often change my mind enroute. We don't have cell service out here so unless someone is a good tracker, I'm on my own.

This has never been a concern as it never occurs to me that anything could go wrong. "Yea, though I walk in the valley of death ....".

[Dick Dastardly]

Ho PJ,

We all have to go sometime and passing in surroundings chosen by you is at least better than going in a hospital bed with tubes and needles stuck everywhere.

My bride passed here with me at her side.  It's the way she wanted it.  So, when I cash my stack I could only hope to go as peacefully.

DD-MDA

[PJ Hardtack]

We're a way off topic, but being aware of our mortality is never a mistake.

I've been told that I have a 'death wish' because of some of the things I've done. My response - "What's the worse thing that could happen?" Reply - "You could die." My response - "I can live with that. Why can't you?"

I have friends who have always 'played it safe'. Three are well overweight, one is diabetic (as a result of obesity), two have been involved in bad MV accidents and suffered badly because of obesity, one drinks and smokes despite a history of heart problems, etc. etc.

One of my work mates didn't have a driver's licence as he thought it was too dangerous on the road. One day he was killed waiting for the bus when a vehicle jumped the curb.

Right now I'm as I type this, I'm watching my dogs have a nose to nose with Miz Moose and her calf not 50 yds away. It's snowing lightly and looks like a scene from a Xmas card. They've been having a stand off for the past 45 minutes. She interrupts her feeding on willow twigs every once in awhile to make a feint charge and goes back to feeding.

Right now the moose are standing in the driveway feeding on the willows lining the road. The dogs will not approach them closer than 15-20 yards.

I could put an end to it by walking out and the moose will fade into the forest, but I'm enjoying the scene - life in the Cariboo.

[PJ Hardtack]

Just when I didn't think it could get any better - it did!

I went out to draw the dog away from the moose and she charged! I guess she was fed up with being harassed by the dog who was emboldened by my presence.
This is the 2nd time I've had the experience. The first time a few years back, I had my 50-70 carbine in my hands and she turned away 15 yds from me. This time I was bare handed.

She didn't have her head down like the other moose, but knocked me ass over tea kettle. Why she didn't stomp me when I was down, I don't know. The Grace of God yet again in my life? I guess she made her point and that was it.

I've got a sore spot on my left thigh, but no bruising. I think she caught me with her fore leg. It happened in a blur and all I could do was to turn sideways so as not to take the hit face on.

I limped away and carried on walking the dogs. Miz Moose and her calf took the opportunity to make good their escape.

How do I feel about it? Well, that's about as close to death as I've been for a while, but compared to the icy chill of being diagnosed with the "Big C'' eight years ago, it was just an exciting episode. I don't blame the moose for protecting her calf and I don't blame the dog for protecting his territory.

I'm now in a select group of people who can say that they've been charged and knocked down by a moose and lived to tell about it.

Life is good .....

[Dick Dastardly]

Chainfires are generally not fatal.  They are more dangerous to someone standing beside you.  As already said, we face greater risks getting to and from a match than we do at the match.  Life is uncertain.  Eat dessert first.

The lube in the lube groves of Big Lube®LLC C&B bullets helps seal the chambers better than wads or over ball smears.  The lube is held captive between the driving bands and properly lube/sized, the bullets make the chambers water proof from the exit ends.  Not only are multiple chamber discharges avoided, but guns thus loaded are more reliable in wet/rainy conditions.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

DDD speaks the TRUTH.  Chain Fire is not a lethal phenomenon.  Exciting??  Yes.  Surprising??  Yes.  Will you need to change yer shorts??  Probably.  His remarks about the chamber sealing qualities of "Big Lube" bullets be spot on  (Shameless Plug of EPP UG bullets).  They do haul a Butt Load   of Luby stuff with em down the bore. 

I shoot the EPP UG - 36 as Cast.  The EPP UG - 45 needs the Luber/Sizer.

Smedley 

[Rooster Ron Wayne]

I shoot Pietta's in 1851's 44 calibre or 1860's 44 caliber .
All with APP .
No lube .
Round ball.
Slixshot nipples .
Remington #10 caps .
Pushed tight with a Antler .
I load on a Powder inc press.
I wipe down cylinder and pistols after every stage .
Works 100% Every time .
Rooster Ron Wayne

[Bunk]

Personally, I use a home-made wad using the Mike Belivue method and pure fur felt lubricated with a mixture of 50% by weight tallow rendered from beef kidney fat and beeswax.

I tried the little pure lube wad and had it melt in the Texas summer.
12 cylinders loaded and 12 cylinders shot something between a squib and a cough.
The felt wads work just fine because there is no oil to bleed out.

One 36' piece of that felt will make wads for a lifetime.
At least that is my method.
Bunk

[Bunk]

that is a thirty six INCH piece of felt sorry about that
Bunk

[Rooster Ron Wayne]

I personally think the majority of chain fires come from bad fitting caps .
If you cut a good ring of lead when seating the balls I doubt you will ever get a chain fire from the front .
But bad fitting Caps or Caps falling off is more likely to give you the dreaded chain fire .
Rooster Ron Wayne

[Dick Dastardly]

Howdy Rooster,

I heartily agree.  Most chain fires happen from the REAR of the cylinder.  Remember to always use caps that snugly fit the nipples and don't fall off till their chamber is fired.  After the chamber is fired many times caps do fall off.  But, by then they are not an issue, they only seem to gum up the works so the cylinder won't rotate.  Many times this can be cleared and the stage continued.  Thus the difficulty of shooting frontiersman gunfighter style.  FWIW, I've shot Frontiersman GF with my brace of ROAs.  I wouldn't even attempt it with my 1860 open tops.  I do, however, usually shoot FCGF with both my open tops and my ROAs with no difficulty.

DD-MDA

[Lucky R. K.]

I agree with both Rooster and Dick that most multiple discharges come from the rear. I had an 1860 Cenature that used to scare me to death when I shot it. After a lot of head scratching I finally figured out that the cone of the nipples I had installed were a bit long and when the gun recoiled from firing the rest of the caps fired. Nipples with shorter cones fixed my problem.

Lucky

[greyhawk]

I agree with both Rooster and Dick that most multiple discharges come from the rear. I had an 1860 Cenature that used to scare me to death when I shot it. After a lot of head scratching I finally figured out that the cone of the nipples I had installed were a bit long and when the gun recoiled from firing the rest of the caps fired. Nipples with shorter cones fixed my problem.

Lucky

I proposed that here in a long post about a month ago - must have not yelled it loud enough