Richards Type II conversion 44 Special

Jake C · August 16, 2017, 12:52:13 PM

Quote from: Pappy Hayes on August 16, 2017, 11:51:06 AM
Abilene do you have pictures somewhere here on the forum? Never mind I found the pictures. Nice looking gun. I had my mind made up to stay with the 44 but seeing your gun has me confused which way to go. I guess maybe the determining factor would be I would not know when I would get the navy grip. I don't even know where you get such a thing

VTI gun parts is a good option for grips and grip frames. You might also be able to find those same parts on Ebay or something.

Pettifogger · August 16, 2017, 07:29:47 PM

Here is one of a pair of Type I's I am working on. I like Type I's because of the conversion ring mounted rear sight and floating firing pin

Coffinmaker · August 17, 2017, 10:46:36 AM

Pettifogger,
Nice Project. The ASMs were/are really neat guns. Most accurate .38s I've ever owned.

Whatcher gonna do about the final finish?? Nickel ... Hard Chrome ... CCH/Blue ... Blue/Blue??

Week and simple minds are curious(er).

Pettifogger · August 17, 2017, 05:44:29 PM

It's nickeled. Unless the finish is damaged while I am working on it, I will leave it with the nickel finish. These guns were messed up by the previous owner. The first thing I did when I got them was run a range rod down the barrel to make sure the chambers lined up with the bore. Many of these had the cylinder notches cut in the wrong place so when fired they shaved lead something terrible. If they had been bad they were going to make a nice pair of lamps. The cylinder chambers lined up OK so I am rebuilding them.

Coffinmaker · August 17, 2017, 07:01:44 PM

Pettifogger,

Way cool. At one time I had a real thing for the ASM Type 1s. Actually still do, just don't mess with them anymore. At one time had 11 of them, to get enough parts to keep 5 running. Finally just sold em all on.

I think being built on a quasi 1861 frame/cylinder/barrel made them the best looking conversions on the PLANET!!

Pappy Hayes · August 22, 2017, 05:51:32 PM

Trying to remember how the Type II and other conversions tend to shoot. Do they tend to shoot high or low?

Tuolumne Lawman · August 22, 2017, 08:02:47 PM

Just like the 1860s, they shoot high. 250 grain 45 will shoot higher than 200 grain.

Pappy Hayes · August 25, 2017, 08:41:19 PM

If I buy a Richard's Type II with 51/2 barrel, could I switch it with one of my 8 inch Barrels? Both of my 8 inch barrel revolvers needed some work on the table area because the cylinders were dragging. Cimarron did the work but the step down area on both of them lost some of the definition. I would like for at least on of them to have the definition. Hopefully I explained it clearly. If my Richard's Mason wasn't charcoal blue I would have tried swapping the barrels with it.

Abilene · August 25, 2017, 09:58:57 PM

Yes, the .44 RIchards-Mason and Richards Type II barrels in any barrel length are interchangeable. Some fitting may be required, of course.

Pappy Hayes · August 25, 2017, 10:20:48 PM

What kind of fitting

Pappy Hayes · August 30, 2017, 09:36:35 PM

I loaded some empty 44 Russian in one of my Type II and cycled the cylinder. It turned hard like it was hanging up. I put the brass in my other Richard's and it cycled fine. Any ideas what is wrong with the other One? I loaded 44 Colt in it and it worked fine.

Crow Choker · August 30, 2017, 10:30:23 PM

Maybe the 44 Russian brass is a "hair" thicker rim thickness and could be draggin on a high spot or burr on the recoil shield. Check the brass heads and see if there are any semi-circular scratches or rub marks on them. My Open Top when I first got it would cycle fine empty and with unfired rounds in it, after the first two shots the two empty fired brass would rub on a burr. I had to turn the cylinder by hand and not the hand that's suppose to be turning it. They had semi-circular scratches from a small burr on the lower right area of the recoil shield. Evidently the brass upon firing would get blown back enough upon firing causing the hang up. Filed the burr off and never a problem since.

Abilene · August 30, 2017, 11:13:35 PM

Quote from: Pappy Hayes on August 30, 2017, 09:36:35 PM
I loaded some empty 44 Russian in one of my Type II and cycled the cylinder. It turned hard like it was hanging up. I put the brass in my other Richard's and it cycled fine. Any ideas what is wrong with the other One? I loaded 44 Colt in it and it worked fine.

I cannot think of any reason. If that Russian brass had spent primers in it, make sure none of them are high (scrape marks on the primer). Do you have any 44 Spcl brass? The rim on the Russian and Special is exactly the same. Maybe you were holding the gun a different way when it hung up? I haven't heard of it being a particular problem on the Type II, but any of the OT's and conversions can hang up a round if the loading gate edge isn't even with the frame at the point just above the loading gate screw. Though aiming the gun down while cycling would prevent that one from happening.

Pettifogger · August 30, 2017, 11:35:12 PM

Real typical problem is the barrel/arbor fit. Or in the case of Uberti the non-fit. If the wedge is pushed in a bit further on one than the other that can cause the cylinder to bind. Try pushing the wedge out a bit and see if it cycles OK.

Pappy Hayes · August 31, 2017, 06:45:49 PM

I backed the pin off a little and it is cycling good now with the 44 Russian cartridges. I must have push it in too tight the last time I cleaned it. Thank you for your comments

Pettifogger · August 31, 2017, 07:12:23 PM

Quote from: Pappy Hayes on August 31, 2017, 06:45:49 PM
I backed the pin off a little and it is cycling good now with the 44 Russian cartridges. I must have push it in too tight the last time I cleaned it. Thank you for your comments

The problem will only get worse until you repair the underlying defect. The arbor fit has to be corrected. Once done the gun will give years of service.

Coffinmaker · September 01, 2017, 05:13:50 PM

PLUS ONE to PETTIFOGGER. Uberti built Open Top type guns MUST have the Barrel to Arbor fit checked and Corrected BEFORE doing anything else with the gun.

Rooster Ron Wayne · March 04, 2018, 07:29:45 PM

I would also have to add .
The second thing you should do.
Is replace the firing pins .
The Smith Shop sells some very good firing pins that need to be fitted .
But will last a life time of shooting .
Rooster .

Abilene · March 04, 2018, 08:52:41 PM

Opentops used to have long thin pointy firing pins that pierced primers and bent. A number of years ago they switched to a much better conical FP.

Rooster Ron Wayne · April 07, 2018, 06:49:36 AM

I have a pair of Longhunter tuned 1872 Army's in 44 Special .
I like shooting full load APP with a 200gr Lee Bullet .
I did switch to shooting the 44 Russian cartridge just to not beat the hell out of the guns .
But I also have a pair of 1851's tuned the the Goon , With some R&D cylinders and Percussion cylinder .
Its hard to decide witch ones to shoot .
The nice part of the 1872's is the loading gate makes reloading much easier .
Since you dont have to knock out the wedge and take the gun apart to load .
Sorry im just rambling on .
Rooster Ron Wayne