Barrel Obstruction

[Coal Creek Griff]

I almost decided to create a new profile just so that I could ask this question without admitting that it was me that made this kind of mistake.  Please be kind to me; I feel pretty stupid and helpless.

I just purchased a brand new Uberti NWMP carbine in 45-75.  I want to cast bullets, so I decided to slug the bore.  Now, I've slugged bores before and rarely had an issue.  This time, however, I'm having some serious problems.

I lightly oiled a clean bore and used what I thought was a dead soft bullet in the 50 caliber range.  It was in my bin of pure lead.  The bullet seemed to go in OK, but was much harder to drive down the bore than usual.  I usually use a short hardwood dowel to get it going, then a somewhat longer dowel.  By then, I can usually push the slug through with a cleaning rod.  This time, however, the slug stopped about 10 inches into the barrel.  My  longer dowel was starting to get mangled, so I dropped a shorter dowel into the bore and used another short one to try to tap the slug through.  The shorter dowel then got stuck on top of the slug.  I think that it was deforming in the bore.  I tried using a steel rod on top of the dowel (with the steel rod covered with duct tape to keep in centered and to protect the barrel), but it just further damaged the short dowel.  (Folks, I probably kept making matters worse, but each step seemed like a good idea at the time.)  Next, I thought that a piece of hard oak that was a perfect fit for the bore would help push the whole thing through evenly.  I cut a piece of oak about 2 inches long and sanded it for a good fit down the barrel.  That got dropped in on top of the whole stack and I tapped it with the steel rod again.  Now the piece of oak appears to have deformed and is also added to the obstruction.

I'm at a loss here.  I really don't want to take my brand new gun to a gunsmith and have him remove the barrel to somehow clear the obstruction, but I'm (oh, I hate to say this) stuck.  I feel like a fool and I'm staring at my beautiful brand new expensive gun and I feel like I just ruined it.

This whole thing is embarrassing, but I need help here.

With a tear running down my cheek,

CC Griff

[Pettifogger]

I'm sorry but I'm sitting here laughing hysterically.  I'm sure we have all had similar experiences where everything just seems to be getting worse despite our best efforts.  No use going through all the various "you shouldn't have done" scenarios.  I assume you are talking about driving the bullet from the muzzzle end.  I would disassemble the rifle and try driving everything out from the breech end.  Once the bolt is out you can run a rod down the firing pin extension hole.  DON'T use any more wooden dowels at this point!

[Crow Choker]

Been there, done that once with a British Enfield No. 4 Mark I .303 rifle while slugging it. Tried all kinds of ways to get it out, ie. more oil, heating barrel with hair dryer, using various rods, wooden dowels, including trying driving it out both ways. Finally dumped some Kroil down the barrel, let it set overnight, and went back at it the next afternoon. After sticking a brass rod with the end sort of mushroomed, some dozen taps got things moving, and the slug came out. No damage to bore. Don't know why to this day it happened, never have had problems before or since. Lottsa luck!!!

[Coal Creek Griff]

Thanks, fellas.  First of all, I appreciate the kind words, even if Pettifogger did laugh at me.  Actually, about all I could do at that point was to laugh through my tears.

The gun disassembled easily, much to my appreciation.  It took a lot of work and more than a few prayers, but I did manage to drive everything back out from the breach, as suggested by Pettifogger.  Even though the slug didn't go all the way through, I'm not doing that again.  I'll just measure what I have and call it good enough.

I don't see any damage to the bore, although I wouldn't be surprised if a bore scope would reveal something.  The proof, though, will be in the shooting.  Many years ago, I had a double action .38 that someone (not me that time) had stuck a steel rod in from the breach to drive out an obstruction.  Of course the rod was at an angle because of the tight fit through the frame opening.  The guy (not me, remember?) put a huge gouge in the bore, The damage didn't seem to affect the accuracy, though, so it never bothered me too much. 

Thanks again.  I had visions of having to buy and fit a new barrel after the first day of ownership.

CC Griff

[Professor Marvel]

Ah My Dear GRiff -

no worries, we all experience oooopsies.

As Pettifogger said:
- disassemble
- go from the other side
- use solid brass rod or my preference, coated steel, as large diameter as you can fit
- next time use a much smaller lead pill, or preferably an oval fishing weight or round ball with much less bearing surface,

trying to add oil from the bore side "might" make the wood swell

one fellow I know got the bore so jammed up with wood he had to dismount the barrel and heat gently up to just short of 500 deg F which caused the wood to char and degrade, but did not cross the magic scary temperature - re  "500 degree embrittlement"  - bear in mind I am not advising this .....

please see http://www.brownells.com/GunTech/500-F-Embrittlement-in-Steels/detail.htm?lid=10576
for discusson of the phenomenon

----------------------------
and here's my oops today - posted AFTER you !
----------------------------
yhs
prof marvel

[Fox Creek Kid]

[Coal Creek Griff]

That's me! I'm still embarrassed by the whole event.

CC Griff

[Coffinmaker]

Plus to Pettifogger.  I was sitting in my Hotel rom at an "away" match when I first read this and I am fairly certain those in the next room thought I was off my nut, cause there was nothing funny on TV.

It isn't polite to point fingers and laugh out loud ....... but ....... as Pettifogger said so eloquently, we (Gunplumbers) have ALL had those days when "bad" has gone to "worse" despite our best efforts.  I once stuffed a customer's rifle in the trashcan and left it there for days.
I hated that rifle.

So, we aren't necessarily laughing "at" you as much as we're laughing with you.  (You DO believe that ..... right??).  I've always believed there was no mechanical problem I couldn't solve with a large enough hammer 

Coffinmaker

[Pettifogger]

Plus to Pettifogger.  I was sitting in my Hotel rom at an "away" match when I first read this and I am fairly certain those in the next room thought I was off my nut, cause there was nothing funny on TV.

It isn't polite to point fingers and laugh out loud ....... but ....... as Pettifogger said so eloquently, we (Gunplumbers) have ALL had those days when "bad" has gone to "worse" despite our best efforts.  I once stuffed a customer's rifle in the trashcan and left it there for days.
I hated that rifle.

So, we aren't necessarily laughing "at" you as much as we're laughing with you.  (You DO believe that ..... right??).  I've always believed there was no mechanical problem I couldn't solve with a large enough hammer  

Coffinmaker

+100%

[Coal Creek Griff]

I really do appreciate the understanding.  It made me feel a lot better about things.  Getting the obstruction out of the barrel made me feel pretty good too.  It's good to know that I'm not alone in running into frustrations like this.

As far as I can tell after firing ten more rounds the other day, things seem to be functioning fine.  It was just a low-powered, trial handload at pretty short range, but the bullets were mostly going into one hole.  That was a relief too.

Thanks, gents!

CC Griff

[Good Troy]

Thanks for being honest enough to share your experience CCG!  This is good information if, or should I say when, I do something similar...though I could tell a simalar story about a bullet sizing die (not as much of a pucker factor, as dies are MUCH cheaper than barrels!). 

[Coffinmaker]

Just so Griff can feel better (Snicker Snicker)
Several Lustrum ago, a customer brought me a brandy new Rossi '92.  Wanted the sights fix'd.  Whined he couldn't get it zero'd.  In fact, he couldn't get it on the paper (24 inch target) at 30 paces.  Said he fired 6 rounds, no holes inna paper.  Fix it please??

Something didn't sound right, and the factory sights were dead center on the bore.  The bore.  I couldn't see down the bore.  Bore light,
couldn't see down the bore.  Dark.  Really dark.  Ran a rod down the bore.  Stopped half way.  I asked again how many rounds fired.
Six.  No holes inna paper.  Is it gonna be hard to fix??

Got out my heavy brass rod and a dead blow and started pounding.  It was slow.  It took a lot of pounding.  I got really tired of pounding on that '92.  I also became very very cross as the owner wanted to know what I was doing.  Finally, "plunk" a bullet came out the breach, then "plunk" SIX times.  The guy had fired SIX Squibs.  Stuck em inna bore nose to tail.  Six.

there was more to the whole story, but it gets real boring and real sad.  You see, the customer was real dumb.  He was still dumb when he left the shop with his "fix'd" rifle.  I gave him a Hodgdons Reloading Guide for free.

Coffinmaker

[Fox Creek Kid]

CM, a gunsmith buddy once showed me an old Ruger Service Six .357 with the same problem:  six bullets stuck in the barrel end to end!!! Novice "reloader" brought it to him. 

[Coal Creek Griff]

In both cases, at least all of the fired shots were probably sqibs.  Get a full charge round behind the blockage and things might be different.  I felt foolish the other day, but not THAT foolish.  It's been about 30 years since I stuck a bullet in a barrel from a squib/overly light load, but at least I knew what happened.   Scary stories.

CC Griff

[wildman1]

CCG, I would take a slug that will fit easily into that bore and start it in to see if it tightens up where you encountered the previous problem go carefully as you probably do not want a repeat of the problem. If you could find a pure lead RB of the proper dimensions that would probably work. I would be curious if it were my rifle as to whether there was indeed a problem. wM1

[Coal Creek Griff]

I've wondered about that too.  I think that I had ended up with a harder lead bullet in my "pure lead" bin.  It was hard to drive right from the start and harder yet to drive back out.  I may get up the courage to try again with a smaller RB that is actually pure lead, but I'll probably wait for the nightmares to die down first...

CC Griff

[Coffinmaker]

Remember ...... No SCARS ......... No GOOD STORIES   

Coffinmaker

[The Trinity Kid]

CM, a gunsmith buddy once showed me an old Ruger Service Six .357 with the same problem:  six bullets stuck in the barrel end to end!!! Novice "reloader" brought it to him. 

Glad everything worked out well, CCG.

At the shop where I was working earlier this year, we have a cutaway Colt .38 barrel on the wall above the reloading supplies.  It has 11 Remington Golden Sabers wedged in it nose to tail.  The 12th was a full power load that blew the top strap, cylinder, front of the frame and forcing cone all to heck. We all know who did it, too.    He won't ever live that down.  Things could have been worse, though, as nothing but his pride was injured. 
To quote a crusty old cowboy I know,  "We can all be boneheads, but owning up to it separates the men from the morons."

--TK

[Mossyrock]

One of the advantages of being a member of "The Flintlock Underground" is that I always have a good supply of dead soft roundball in calibers ranging from .32 through .72.  Those come in real handy when slugging bores.  While haven't gotten one permanently stuck, I DID manage to drive a brass rod THROUGH the roundball once.  That's talent right there....  Pure talent!   

[Fox Creek Kid]

Always lube the bore & ball both liberally beforehand. Never stuck one yet. Actually, for more precise measurements buy some pin gauges.