Shotgun wads

[Yakima Red]

Howdy, to the point. I have been getting 3/8 wads for my 12 gauge BP loads from Ballistic products. They had these great ones that held together well. Then they changed to ones with a black mylar finish (plastic type coating) on each side. After a match a bunch of this black coating is now stuck to the inside of the barrel.

I have not been able to find any in 3/8 without this coating. I hate splitting wads to get my column height. All others seem to only come in 1/2 inch.

Any other options that any of you folks out there are using?

[Dick Dastardly]

Take a look at Circle Fly.  They make a full line of "natural" wads.  I get mine from them.

http://www.circlefly.com/

Keep on smokin'.

DD-MDA

[Bunk Stagnerg]

Take a 12 gauge case cut off at the crimp. 4 c/c FFg powder OP wad, 1/2" felt wad and 4c/c shot. OS wad and roll crimp.
Easy to do and leaves no mess in the barrel.
Bunk

[Dick Dastardly]

Howdy Bunk,

This is a "square load".  Much like I use in my 16ga guns.  It's plenty strong, uses common components and takes the KDs down with authority.

The real trick is to deliver maximum mass on the targets.

DD-MDA

[Bunk Stagnerg]

If you want to deliver maximum mass on target, I am told that, before you crimp the case pour melted paraffin wax onto the shot column.
I have not tried it yet because my load always delivers the goods.
Next time I load shells I might try a couple and see what happens.
Yr' Obt' Svt'
Bunk

[Gabriel Law]

Bunk:  the wax soaked shot column would be, in effect, a single projectile.  The point is to use shot.  If 7/8 -1 1/16 ox of shot doesn't knock 'em down, I'd call it a miss, not an in-effective load.

[john boy]

Handbook:
Shotgun  Shell  shall  not  be  scored  (ringed)  as  to  cause  the  shot - shell  case,  wad,  and  shot column to be shot from the
firearm as one projectile.
But with the paraffin poured in the shot column, it will melt in the bore before it leaves the muzzle ... ergo won't work to produce a single projectile
Have to remember, the initial BP ignition temperature is about 4000 degrees F  

[zymurgeist]

No it won't melt in the bore. Even if the heat gets past the wad, even if you decide not to use a wad, it won't affect the majority of the shot column.

[wildman1]

If you want to deliver maximum mass on target, I am told that, before you crimp the case pour melted paraffin wax onto the shot column.
I have not tried it yet because my load always delivers the goods.
Next time I load shells I might try a couple and see what happens.
Yr' Obt' Svt'
Bunk

Try it with one at a cardboard target and you will know for sure. If the temp inside the shotgun shell reached 4000 degrees it would vaporize the plastic and probably melt the metal part of the case. wM1

[Bibbyman]

I'm not sure if this will help on the original post but this video shows how I make roll crimped 12 gauge black powder loads using plastic cup wads.  I have made the same load using fiber wads.  I have patterned both loads and the loads with fiber wads have a big hole in the middle.

In any case,  you can roll crimp shells and make them to any length you want.  A guy I shoot with took to roll crimping his black powder loads and they turn out about 2" long. 

[Coffinmaker]

When I dove headfirst into loading and shooting All Brass 12Ga, I found exactly the same problem using fiber wads.  Really big hole
in the middle of the pattern.  About where the target is.  Not really rewarding to have to shoot two or three times to take a single
target down.

Then I watched Bibbhyman's vid where he introduced the 10Ga plastic wad to the 12Ga All Brass hull.  Having the Plastic Wad with a
Shot Cup made a huge difference.  Now, where there "was" a large hole in the pattern, there is now a very tight shot pattern.  Slaps
targets down with authority.

I really like and recommend "Bibbyman Productions."  I may even have to hang onto and reload plastic 12Ga hulls.  Nah.

Coffinmaker

[Montana Slim]

If using fiber wads only....I suggest using a bit less powder volume than shot (heavy on the shot, light on the powder).
Better patterns...especially true when using a modern shotgun and/or coachgun. Old shotguns have tighter bores.
I've also been known to squirt melted crisco into a shell just prior to crimping. Hard crust in the bore will mess with your patterning as shooting progresses.

Slim

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I take it y'all are using sawdoff barkeeps' guns. My skandinavian guns are full length and mostly Ful/Full. I try to load to allow some spread.

There is another trick to get shotguns to shoot tight. Load less powder to reduce the pressure that deforms pellets.

Why do you need 10 gauge shot cups. 12gauge works the same way. Load them over a 10 or 11 gauge over powder wad. Has anyone tried wrapping a 12gauge wad with something like butchers paper to make a snug fit, and to add to shot protection?

[Bibbyman]

I take it y'all are using sawdoff barkeeps' guns. My skandinavian guns are full length and mostly Ful/Full. I try to load to allow some spread.

There is another trick to get shotguns to shoot tight. Load less powder to reduce the pressure that deforms pellets.

Why do you need 10 gauge shot cups. 12gauge works the same way. Load them over a 10 or 11 gauge over powder wad. Has anyone tried wrapping a 12gauge wad with something like butchers paper to make a snug fit, and to add to shot protection?

The reason the 10 gauge plastic wads seem to work better in 12 gauge brass hulls is that the brass hulls are thinner than than plastic by some significant amount.  I use 12 plastic wads in 12 gauge plastic hills.   I'm shooting a CZ-USA hammer coach gun at times butt I've shot ol'timey guns more often.  Last match I shot my Colt 1878 (TTN clone).  I've also shot my Baker 10 gauge and my 12 gauge Baker Leader - all full length and modified/full chokes.   

I've tried wrapping 12 gauge wads with masking tape to use in 10 gauge plastic hulls.  I still used a 9 gauge over powder wad (brass hulls) over the powder.

Using 10 gauge plastic wads in a 12 brass hull just works without any other effort or extra wads. 

[Dick Dastardly]

You can always take 1/2" fiber wads and split them to 3/8".  Save the 1/8" pieces to combine to make a 3/8" wad.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

Aw Cummon.  Some of you guys are MACHOCHISTS!!  SIMPLIFY!!  Make it EASY!!  Why spend half again your loading time, wrapping
12Ga wads in carefully (or not so carefully) cut butcher paper, carefully (or not so carefully) inserting the carefully wrapped wad in a
Brass 12Ga hull, when you can just slide in a 10Ga wad and be done??
My original reasoning was to eliminate the gooey, messy, nuisance of the pre-lubed 11Ga x 1/2 inch cushion wad (pain to get in the hull)
and the attendant big hole in the pattern it causes.  PRESTO!!  Bibbyman to the rescue.  10Ga wad.  Adding a bunch of steps to
the loading process just doesn't make any sense.  I had already tried cutting 12Ga wads to get shot cups to set on top of the Lubed
Cushion, it worked, but I was still stuck the messy process with the cushion wad.
Reducing the powder charge also was not the answer.  I'm already down to a 50Gr propellant load.  Much lower and I could throw the
cup of shot faster. 
So ....... we come back to K.I.S.S.   Skip all the "half measures" and just stick a 10Ga wad in there and be done with it.  Simple.

Back to our regularly scheduled programming

Coffinmaker

[Yakima Red]

You can always take 1/2" fiber wads and split them to 3/8".  Save the 1/8" pieces to combine to make a 3/8" wad.

DD-MDA

Ah, thank you Mr. Dastardly for getting back on topic. Yes I can do this, but I would like to find some 3/8 without the Mylar coating. Someone used to manufacture them, that's how Ballistic products got them. Where oh where does all the good stuff go?

[Bunk Stagnerg]

Hello the Camp
I am puzzled by the problem of melted plastic in the bore when, I suppose, using Gun Powder as opposed to using nitro Powder.
I have shot away literally tens of thousands of rounds of 12 and 20 gauge shells both factory and reloaded at skeet, trap and hunting in the past 50 years. Usually a couple of passes with a tornado brush and a patch of solvent and the bore is shiny bright.

My SASS Gun Powder load is FFg powder, card and fiber wad, shot and over shot wad closed with a roll crimp.Cleaning  is easy by running a wet swab through the bore a couple of times followed by a couple of dry patches and a Ballistol patch.

Plastic has no place in Gun Powder loads as the internal temperatures are too much for plastic. I do use cut down Reifenhauser type shells because the tube body is thinner and makes a better roll crimp. Compression formed shells have too thick a body and have a somewhat smaller internal diameter and do not work well with card and fiber wads. No plastic wads pass through my SASS barrels with Gun Powder.

I save those compression formed cases for loading my daughters shells, and they work well with nitro powder, plastic wad and a pie crimp on my ancient MEC machine. The shells I use for Gun Powder loads are trimmed to 2 1/2" and are loaded, shot, and discarded because usually they are burned to a crisp. The endless supply of range pickup empties are my usual source, but I did score a couple of hundred Federal paper 12 gauge hulls which load beautifully and are very period correct.
Yr' Obt' Svt'
Bunk

[Bibbyman]

Hello the Camp
I am puzzled by the problem of melted plastic in the bore when, I suppose, using Gun Powder as opposed to using nitro Powder.
I have shot away literally tens of thousands of rounds of 12 and 20 gauge shells both factory and reloaded at skeet, trap and hunting in the past 50 years. Usually a couple of passes with a tornado brush and a patch of solvent and the bore is shiny bright.

My SASS Gun Powder load is FFg powder, card and fiber wad, shot and over shot wad closed with a roll crimp.Cleaning  is easy by running a wet swab through the bore a couple of times followed by a couple of dry patches and a Ballistol patch.

Plastic has no place in Gun Powder loads as the internal temperatures are too much for plastic. I do use cut down Reifenhauser type shells because the tube body is thinner and makes a better roll crimp. Compression formed shells have too thick a body and have a somewhat smaller internal diameter and do not work well with card and fiber wads. No plastic wads pass through my SASS barrels with Gun Powder.

I save those compression formed cases for loading my daughters shells, and they work well with nitro powder, plastic wad and a pie crimp on my ancient MEC machine. The shells I use for Gun Powder loads are trimmed to 2 1/2" and are loaded, shot, and discarded because usually they are burned to a crisp. The endless supply of range pickup empties are my usual source, but I did score a couple of hundred Federal paper 12 gauge hulls which load beautifully and are very period correct.
Yr' Obt' Svt'
Bunk

Maybe it's the plastic in the wads that make the difference but my experience with plastic wads in black powder and BlackMZ loads show no melted plastic deposits. I recover the wads and they show no signs of scorching or melting.  In fact, I have even loaded some of the wads for a second trip.

I have loaded plastic hulls multiple times.  4-5 and they split or burn holes.  But started to roll crimp and those hulls are one time use only.  Now I'm using brass hulls. 

[wildman1]

The reason the 10 gauge plastic wads seem to work better in 12 gauge brass hulls is that the brass hulls are thinner than than plastic by some significant amount.  I use 12 plastic wads in 12 gauge plastic hills.   I'm shooting a CZ-USA hammer coach gun at times butt I've shot ol'timey guns more often.  Last match I shot my Colt 1878 (TTN clone).  I've also shot my Baker 10 gauge and my 12 gauge Baker Leader - all full length and modified/full chokes.   

I've tried wrapping 12 gauge wads with masking tape to use in 10 gauge plastic hulls.  I still used a 9 gauge over powder wad (brass hulls) over the powder.

Using 10 gauge plastic wads in a 12 brass hull just works without any other effort or extra wads. 

Where do you get 10 gauge plastic wads?
wM1