Bullet Lube that melts higher than 85 degrees

[Black River Smith]

Has anyone created a home bullet lube that has a melting range that starts higher than 85 degrees?

I have made batches of the most common suggested BP lubes but all have a melting range that starts at 70 to 85 degrees.

If you have come across a combination that melts high would you please share the ingredients and 'maybe the percentages'.

Thanks

[Rebel Dave]

If you are using Bees Wax, increse the amount of it that is in you recipe, that should raise your melt point. I make two lubes one for summer, and one for winter.

Rebel Dave

[Blair]

When I was a kid, we use to chew Beeswax like gum.
At the normal human body temp of 98.6, it only got soft, but did not melt.
My best,
Blair

[hellgate]

Blair,
I sure hope your normal body temperature is not 92.6 or you'd be in a coma or hypothermia. I assume it was a slip of the digit from 98.6 but back to lubes....

Black River Smith,
Are we talking BP lube or smokeless? I use deer tallow and beeswax in a 50/50 ratio for both smokeless and BP reloading. For a softer lube (using for BP only) I'll mix the 50/50 mix with beeswax & lard or even softer with olive oil. I assume mutton tallow and deer tallow are similar in consistency.

Smokeless lubes can be hard as wax and work fine but you need a softer lube for BP.

[Blair]

hellgate.

Thank you. I corrected my typo.

The point was and still is that plain Beeswax has a higher melting temp than 85 degrees.
My best,
Blair

[john boy]

Here's some choices:
Beeswax has a melting point range of (144 °F to 147 °F).
Paraffin melts above approximately (99 °F)
Bayberry Wax melts at (100 °F)
Soybean Wax melts at (120-135 °F)
Palm Wax melts at (140 °F)

[Black River Smith]

The lube will be used for both BP and smokeless.  The main reason is I believe in shooting full BP and therefore equivalent smokeless velocities (sometimes ever so slightly higher).  Using original documented lead alloys.  Not trying to reach high velocities except in large cal rifles but that is still at ~1400.

The only combo that shows higher than 85 is 1:1 Bees / Dixie Mutton Tallow.  It has a range of 100 - 136 degrees F.

The only reason I have not just settled on this mix is because a lot of mixtures use some type of oil.  I like that idea but any oil causes  the low temps, IMO.  Any liq fluid at room temp will create a slightly higher low end of the range.

Emmerts lube 50/40/10 is 82 - 102 while 60/20/10/10 is only 85 - 104.

[Dick Dastardly]

FWIW, Big Lube PL-II does what you want.  A third of the content by weight is container blend Soy Wax.  Another third is high density micro crystalline mechanical casting wax and the third ingredient is vegie shortning.  If you want to cut back on the flowability a mite, you could cut back the amount of vegie shortning.

DD-MDA

[rickk]

Paraffin waxes come in a variety of melting points... ranging from around 100 to around 150 F and even higher.

Usually we scrounge and don't even know what we got, but if it is critical, it might be worth buying a 145-150F melting point formulation.

here is one source that Google just found me:
https://www.candlescience.com/wax/igi-4625

[Freedom]

The best advise I could ever give anyone about lube is just bite the bullet and order SPG !

I have wasted so much time, money and good ingredients. There is NOTHING sold under ANY name that will even compare to SPG.

I have had fair success with many commercial and homemade lubes...but not one of them will do it all like SPG. Just so nice to work with and it preforms

Pan lubing with it is really makes it shine.

[Noz]

I have come to the same conclusion.

[Ranch 13]

Bullshops Nasa, Big Sky's bsc, lube, DGL, SPG, they all have a following, they all have the wins behind them to prove their worth.
Buying a know quality blackpowder bullet lube is an investment in time saving and better shooting.

[Black River Smith]

Thanks for all the suggestions.  I believe I will try the higher temp paraffin first.  I made up the Gatofeo outside lube with gulf paraffin wax and got 90 to 140, so I will try some of the high temp candle paraffin waxes and see what the change is.

Then see what DD micro crystalline material will create.  Hope to find some form of casting wax at Hobby Lobby.

I have a pound of Carnuba wax but don't want to just 'experiment with it'.  It should raise the temp but.....

Thanks

[Montana Slim]

During the war ending in 1865, standard lube formula was 50/50 of beeswax/deer tallow.

Not sure why the hangup on 85 degrees. On a 101 degree day in Iowa (kinda rare)......it easily gets over 140 in my Explorer when it's parked out in a hay field.

We had such days back at the NCOWS matches near Ackley. No performance issues with my BP ammo (with a 505/50 (or softer lube).....but, there were a couple shooters using the "other" powder & had a lot of sqibs. They pulled some rounds and found powder contamination from the lube....I do recall being surprised when they said they used SPG (FWIW).

Temps could be a higher concern when the bullet/cartridge combination permits the bullet tail (&lube grooves) to be sitting exposed (not contact with inside of the cartridge case). Just me..but I would avoid that situation via sizing, bullet selection or seating depth whenever possible.

Best,
Slim

[hellgate]

BP shooters (like myself) may still be getting powder contamination in the heat but due to the full case volume of powder it can't spoil the whole charge as easily as those using smok***ss and 2-5 grains of powder.

[Montana Slim]

BP shooters (like myself) may still be getting powder contamination in the heat but due to the full case volume of powder it can't spoil the whole charge as easily as those using smok***ss and 2-5 grains of powder.

Agree...a little contamination of 2-5 grains of propellant would be significant....I did not mention I use the same BP lube formula with ALL my lead bullet loads. Many, many 9mm, .38's, 357 mag, 45 ACP, etc, etc. fired each year. Ammo often sits inside the vehicle parked in the hot summer. Gotta love ripping 357's at over 1400 fps & see very minimal traces of lead fouling...less than typical hard-lubed bullets at lower velocities.

Slim

[Black River Smith]

Montana Slim,

My concern with a high temp lube does center around the NCOWS Nationals.  My first Nationals was at Ackley in '99 where the temps where at 104 degree.  My BP ammo all went off like it should but I was using Natural Lube 1000 bought in the mid 90's.  It was sold in plastic jar's and had a solid consistency unlike the tube pasty stuff still being sold.  My whole interest is to try to create something that would hold up to higher temps, without adding too many ingredients into the mixture.

I do not believe that the store bought stuff is the only way to go.  I like being able to create my own, for my use, when I need too.   But I keep running into this lower end melting point of 85 on almost ever suggested mixture on the web.  I am concerned about the runoff of any part of a melting lube.  Paul Matthews in his books stated that chamber's can get higher than 125 between shots, so a chambered bullet could start to melt before being fired.

Recently I melted some of the high temp paraffin I have for candles (133 degrees) and it has a range of 88 degrees first liquid to 133 for final melting solid.  So, I am at a stopping point until I can get some form of micro-crystalline casting wax as DD suggested.

I also tried to get ahold of deer fat but no-one in my area will sell the fat from processing to individuals.  I do not hunt so I cannot aquire it myself.  I hope it really is not the key ingredient to higher melting lubes.

[hellgate]

Slim,

I have a ton (figure of speech) of microcrystalline casting wax. How much do you want for a sample? PM me. My father-in-law was a sculptor using the lost wax method for bronzes.

[Montana Slim]

I've never done a scientific test of melting temps of any my lubes....maybe a potential for a retirement project.

I can say that my softest....& yes this will be my lowest melting temp lube (but don't know the actual melt temp) has been made from a 50/50 mix (volume) of melted beeswax & olive oil. Very stable, clean & low on the "funny smell" scale. No trouble with this, high temps and BP.

I'm actually using closer to a 40/60 lube of beeswax/deer tallow ...and, had to substitute a bit of melted Crisco as I'm plumb out of deer tallow. (50/50 will be "harder" than 40/60). I have a brick of mutton tallow to start using next year. If your looking for these types of products, i recommend checking with a butcher in a small town, used to working with local hunters & farmers. He may not be able to SELL you the products as they may technically be property of the person paying for the custom processing, but perhaps he'll inquire with his customers.

With BP, I would personally stick with pure beeswax & any of the numerous types of oils/fates mentioned. start with a higher beeswax content & adjust accordingly with your results.

Regarding chamber temp of 125 DEG.  I'd say all our guns get this warm during hot weather & multi-shot strings. However, after chambering a round, it will take an appreciable amount of time for the temp to transfer to the bullet lube. This is primarily a function of the mass of the components in the cartridge...big cartridge, bullet & lots of powder will soak a lot of heat. In CAS, we typically are required to fire a round if it is chambered or under the hammer, so normally this would take/after chambering. BP makes more heat in the barrel (than the other stuff) due to leaving more residue. All basic heat transfer stuff...fortunately I won't have to do retrieve any of my college texts to do analysis on that.

BTW, my former "handle" is "hot-gun"...I earned this from well heating the barrel on any firearm I might be using. ..If I were having powder lube issues it would surely show up in my 9mm auto. I do rapid fire drills and magazine changes, even on hot days. 18-round magazines and I do have five of them. I love the wet lube star on the muzzle & super easy cleanup from use of the BP lube...although the lube does generate a LOT OF SMOKE when fired.

Slim

[Black River Smith]

Hellgate,

I do not mean to be presumptuous, but I will ask, can you afford the same offer, you gave to Motana Slim, to me (Black River Smith), of a small test sample quantity of casting wax?  I am the originator of this posting and the one experimenting with lubes for a higher temp range and would like to make DD mixure, as a trial.

I have now checked at all the normal craft stores and art supply stores in my town and no-one sells a true micro-crystalline casting wax.  The casting wax I found on ebay for jewelry has a melting point of only 156 degrees not close to the normal 170's of casting waxes.

Thanks for a reply.