38-55 First data feom Old Einsford 1½ Fg.

[Dick Dastardly]

Just back from the range.  I got the old Ohler 33 graph out and shot over it.  For a change, it worked flawlessly.

2.5cc of Old Einsford under a .135 over powder card under the Big Lube®LLC DD-38-55 RNFP 250 grain bullet.  The brass is mixed bag 30-30 fireformed to 38-55 with Fed Lg Rifle primers.  Rifle - Winchester Legendary Frontiersman.  Too much lipstick.

1.   1162
2.   1171
3.   1126
4.   1125
5.   1172

Lo=1125, Hi=1172, ES=47, AV=1151, SD=23

All five shots inside a 5" circle within the black at the 4pm quadrant from 100 yards.  Recoil so much more pleasant than the big ol 45-70 with 500 grain bullets.

This is not a bad result from the 1st outing with this rig and this data.  I'm thinkn' that my eyes don't see a lot better than that, new glasses and all.

Felt good to snap some caps.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

Well ..... My Stalwart 38-55 Shooting friend,  I have first data for 38-55 too!!  So .... TAKE THAT 

I'm currently shooting "I don't know how much" but it fills the case 2F APP, with no over-powder card, under a special cast EPP UG -36
Bullet, Weighs about 90Gr as cast with NO lube and a big pistol primer.
     1.  No idea the velocity, but "real fast" and over the top of the target.
     2.  No idea the velocity, but still "real fast" and still over the top of the target (adjusting my "hold.")
     3.  Still no idea the velocity, 'cause I don't own a chrony, but really fast, now on the target (still adjusting 'hold.")
     4. thru 10.  Who cares how fast.  Just "fast."  On target and grouping about 1 1/2 low at about 4 O'clock.  It's ringing steel so
         I are happy.
Oh, forgot, W-W cases.  Second hand or they'd be Starline.  Handi Rifle, 38-55 Target, 28 inch barrel.  Smith enterprises rear sight and
a really tall, brass, Skinner front sight.  Still need to drift the sights.  Still need/want to shoot more. 

This thing is FUN!!  Especially with non-traditional bullets.  What a HOOT!!!

Coffinmaker

[Dick Dastardly]

Ho Coffinmaker,

I've used that very load to dispatch bunnies in the back yard.  No recoil and the bunnies go "puff".  Bear won't even pick up the pieces. . .

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

DDD,

I noticed that.  Or ... rather ..... didn't notice that ...... or "yea wow!!"  Setting that load off was really fun!!  Like .... ZERO recoil.
Big Fiery Round with the Speed of Light,  A Cloud of Smoke and a hearty Hi-yo Sliver .... Away.... and that little sucker is seriously
speeding away.

Some kind of fun to play with.  Wacky idea to shoot that itty bitty bullet outa that case, but what the heck ..  22-250??  220 Swift??
Same same idea.  Make itty bitty bullet go really really fast.  FUN!!

Coffinmaker

[Dick Dastardly]

I kind of wonder about using that light load for Plainsman?  It will reach out to 50 or more yards.  Same bullet in Cowboy 45 Special for the pistols.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

DDD, .......
Twoud appear great minds think alike.  My primary reason for acquiring a Handi-Rifle was to play in plainsman.  Now, I've acquired another Handi in 45 Colt.  My first thought was EPP UG 45.  Seems silly to me to play at "planesman" with 350 - 450Gr 45-70 when all I have to do
is ring steel inside 50 yards.

I think the 38-55 sith those whollipin big 90Gr bullets will be sufficiently accurate to 50 yard to be good player.  Save lead, zero recoil, fun to shoot.  My Knew-2-me 45 has a 20 inch barrel and is so "Handi" I'm considering cutting my 38-55 down from 28 inches (heavy) to
about 22.  Make it really ... "Handi."

Coffinmaker

[Dick Dastardly]

FWIW, I have target results showing 1" groups from my Thompson Center Seneca rifle with 30g of FFFg Schuetzen under EPP-UG bullets.  Just no recoil at all and a pleasing group.  I never took it beyond that, but my 1860 open tops with Kirst Konverter cylinders loaded with Cowboy 45 Spl. ammo shoot extremely well.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

DDD,
Now that you mention it .........    I shoot Pietta 1860s with Taylor's R&D type conversion cylinders and EPP UG bullets, Cowboy 45 Special cases and about 16 - 18Gr 2f APP.  Shoot a treat.  Very manageable recoil and accuracy is just great.  I don't actually use 45 Colt
cases in any of my 45s anymore.  Strictly C45S.  That may change however, when I stat loading for the Knew-2-Me 45 Colt Handi.

I shoot both EPP UG bullets (45 & 36) "as cast" with great accuracy and NO lubes.  APP is wonderful stuff for folks who would rather sit
on the couch than lube bullets    I am lazy.  I just want to shoot, I don't particularly want to "work" at it.  Work is a four letter word.

Guns-R-Fun

Coffinmaker

[Dick Dastardly]

Seems the Air Rifle people have found me.  They really like the EPP-36 design bullets for their air guns.  I have letters from Air Gun shooters that are shooting sub MOA groups.  They also use no lube.  Apparently the dual fragile driving bands do a good job of engraving and sealing the bore.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

Same same the EPP UG - 45.  Air Gun folks think they are the Beez Kneez.  Shoot little itty bitty groups with em.  Very accurate.  Can't
really use any lube with Air Guns.  Major No No.

I've found both the EPP UG bullets work extremely well in my Cap Guns as well.  No need for round ball.  They are a little more expensive to shoot, but hey, ain't no free lunch!! 

Coffinmaker

[Dick Dastardly]

Howdy Coffinmaker,

The EPP series of bullets emulate round balls in weight.  So, if you're casting your own the only real difference in price is the lube, depending on how the round balls get lubed.  The same amount of alloy works for both.

DD-MDA

[Coffinmaker]

It is amazing just how well some non-traditional projectiles work.  Especially the EPP UG design.  When I started using them in Cap Guns
the accuracy was just wonderful.  I personally don't care to chase little itty bitty groups.  Minute of pie plate can be very acceptable,
although both in my Cap Guns and Cartridge guns, the groups have been more like a folded dollar bill.  Quite acceptable.

Before AJ dropped out of the business end of CAS, he developed a really superb bullet to accompany the C45S cartridge.  The superb
"Barnstormer" bullet is just amazing.  Weighs just at 130Gr, has more bearing surface than any other 45 Cal "pistol" bullet I've ever
loaded, looks ugly as sin and shoots tiny little groups.  Really fun for CAS.  It's just a shame that what I have is all I'm going to be
able to get.  I shoot them very sparingly.

Guns - R - FUN

Coffinmaker

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I have a Swedish capegun with a 9.3 mm  X 57R as the rifle bore. I wonder if the little .36 EPPUG can be sized down? What a small game gun that would be.

[Dick Dastardly]

Sir Charles,

What size would that be in English?  This bullet resizes very well.

DD-MDA

[Cuts Crooked]

Seems the Air Rifle people have found me.  They really like the EPP-36 design bullets for their air guns.  I have letters from Air Gun shooters that are shooting sub MOA groups.  They also use no lube.  Apparently the dual fragile driving bands do a good job of engraving and sealing the bore.

DD-MDA

That's old news. somewhere on the web is a video of an air gunner taking a hog with EPP boolits. Saw it a couple of years ago.

[Coffinmaker]

Old News??  So??  Bares repeating.  Some folks are unaware there are some rather interesting large bore "air guns" running around
using projectiles normally thought of as strictly powder powered guns.  The EPP bullets, "as cast" work very well in air guns.  I was
amazed how well the .36 worked in a 38-55, as opposed to more traditional fodder weighing in at 230+  88 - 90Gr pills are some
KOOL!!

Coffinmaker

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Sir Charles,

What size would that be in English?  This bullet resizes very well.

DD-MDA

I think it is .366. I am not at home or able to look it up easily.

[Dick Dastardly]

No luck here Sir Charles.  The bullet drops at .361".  It may bump up, but that's a quite a bump.

DD-MDA

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Typo? .381.   The six holer you sold me went to Sun&Air in England. I'll have to look & see if I kept any samples.

[Dick Dastardly]

Howdy Sir Charles,

I miked some of my EPP-36 samples and the driving bands measured .375" to .380".  The working drawing looked more like .361 to me.  My error.  I can send you some samples to try out if you wish.

DD-MDA