Original Trapdoor Rifles

[Cowtown Scout]

If those rifles shoot half as good as they look, then you've got some real tack drivers there!

I've not had time to shoot any of them yet.  My goal is to shoot all of them except of course the .58-60 RF 1st Allin. In looking for an original round to display with it I've found two, one for $95 and the other is $100.

[Niederlander]

VERY cool, Scout!

[Drydock]

I am in awe!

[Jake C]

I've not had time to shoot any of them yet.  My goal is to shoot all of them except of course the .58-60 RF 1st Allin. In looking for an original round to display with it I've found two, one for $95 and the other is $100.

I'm almost certainly wrong here, but couldn't you make up a round kind of like what one would use to shoot a .577 Snider?

[pony express]

I'm almost certainly wrong here, but couldn't you make up a round kind of like what one would use to shoot a .577 Snider?

Probably you could make something up in a centerfire case, but that would require a different breechblock.

[Pitspitr]

Probably you could make something up in a centerfire case, but that would require a different breechblock.

Yes, but he's looking for one to display

In looking for an original round to display with it...

[Jake C]

Ah, right. Still, very very cool! 

[Cowtown Scout]

I'm almost certainly wrong here, but couldn't you make up a round kind of like what one would use to shoot a .577 Snider?

What I was attempting to state was that I won't be shooting the original rim fire model 1865 because of the cartridge. Those original rounds are rare and not cheap if you can find them. All the others are centerfire and I have brass for them and currently load for 45-70, just have not found any 50-70 lead bullets of the right diameter yet (I don't cast).

[Cowtown Scout]

Yes, but he's looking for one to display

Yep, besides adding original period slings to the long arms, I've started looking for the correct rounds to display with the arms. Already have too much $$ invested in old dead cows, but that pales to what's invested in the arms themselves.   

However one day I hope to be able to develope many different displays of long arms.  Except for these photos posted here I've only displayed and presented a portion of my collection once. That was for a Boy Scout function last December, I had 30 pieces of history out on the tables. It took about 1-1/2 hours to present and went from the French & Indian War to present day.

[Jake C]

What I was attempting to state was that I won't be shooting the original rim fire model 1865 because of the cartridge. Those original rounds are rare and not cheap if you can find them. All the others are centerfire and I have brass for them and currently load for 45-70, just have not found any 50-70 lead bullets of the right diameter yet (I don't cast).

My bad, totally missed the rimfire bit there. I can imagine, but I really like that idea for display, I bet it'd look very cool.

I'm in the same boat. I currently rent, so casting will just have to wait until I have my own place. Buffalo Arms might have some lead .50-70 bullets, but I'm pretty sure that they're only available in lots of 50 and they're fairly pricey. Maybe you could post in the classified, see if anyone can cast some bullets for you for a bit cheaper?

[Cowtown Scout]

My bad, totally missed the rimfire bit there. I can imagine, but I really like that idea for display, I bet it'd look very cool.

I'm in the same boat. I currently rent, so casting will just have to wait until I have my own place. Buffalo Arms might have some lead .50-70 bullets, but I'm pretty sure that they're only available in lots of 50 and they're fairly pricey. Maybe you could post in the classified, see if anyone can cast some bullets for you for a bit cheaper?

I can find .512 diameter cast lead bullets and that works for modern 50-70 rifles, however everything I've read states the original military 50-70 take .515 diameter bullets. Can only find molds in that diameter but not cast bullets. Still looking and I don't mind buying in large quantities. Will need them if I every shoot a 50-70 on competition.  Haven't slugged any of my barrels yet, but I currently have 7 rifles in that caliber.

[Drydock]

http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_info.php?products_id=1361

http://www.montanabulletworks.com/BB_50_caliber.html

[Cowtown Scout]

http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_info.php?products_id=1361

http://www.montanabulletworks.com/BB_50_caliber.html

Excellent!!
Thanks Drydock

[Niederlander]

Scout, I predict you're going to love the .50-70!  It's been my personal experience it's easier to get a .50-70 Trapdoor to shoot well than the .45-70 versions.  My '68 put five rounds in to two and a half inches during some load testing from the bench.  Point of impact was two inches high and two inches left of point of aim at one hundred yards.  I've used the same loads in a Navy Rolling Block and a Sharps carbine, and they shot extremely well, also.  (My bullets fall from the Lee mold at .515 from wheel weights.)  Enjoy those old Springfields!

[Jake C]

Welp, made up my first batch of .45-70 rounds (415 grain lead bullet over about 63 or so grains of Alliant Black MZ (2F equivalent)). These are some heavy rounds! I do have a question. In the GAF regs, it says no bullets over 405 grains. So does anyone have a source on some soft lead bullets at the 405 grain weight?

I'll let you folks know how they shoot this weekend, hopefully.

[Good Troy]

My source for 405 bullets is Buffalo Arms.  I purchase grain hollow based, soft (20:1 mix) bullets.  They have these (and others) available with black powder compatible (SPG) lubricant.

Also, you may consider purchasing "THE" manual on loading for trapdoors by J.S. and Pat Wolfe.

http://www.amazon.com/Loading-cartridges-original-Springfield-carbine/dp/157579019X/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1437583540&sr=1-3&keywords=trapdoor+springfield

It has information on original loadings, including reduced loads for carbines (about 55 grains volume of black powder).  I've found it very helpful and well worth the money!!

[Jake C]

My source for 405 bullets is Buffalo Arms.  I purchase grain hollow based, soft (20:1 mix) bullets.  They have these (and others) available with black powder compatible (SPG) lubricant.

Also, you may consider purchasing "THE" manual on loading for trapdoors by J.S. and Pat Wolfe.

http://www.amazon.com/Loading-cartridges-original-Springfield-carbine/dp/157579019X/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1437583540&sr=1-3&keywords=trapdoor+springfield

It has information on original loadings, including reduced loads for carbines (about 55 grains volume of black powder).  I've found it very helpful and well worth the money!!

Thank you kindly! The book will be one of my first purchases when my next paycheck comes in. Right now I've only loaded up two rounds. I'll start playing with loadings soon.

[pony express]

While I'm not the Ordinance Officer, I really doubt if anyone's going to break down your loads and weigh the bullets. There tends to be some variation in the weight of cast bullets anyway, depending on the exact alloy used to cast them. I use a cast bullet from a Lee mold, supposed to be 405 gr, I haven't weighed them to see exactly what they weigh. It's a flat base bullet, and I use a 3/8 fiber wad over 55gr Goex 2F for my GAF load.

[Drydock]

Yep, I'd say you're within the margin of error.  And I AM the Ordnance Officer!

[Jake C]

Yep, I'd say you're within the margin of error.  And I AM the Ordnance Officer!

Ah, good to hear it. I had kind of assumed, but you know what they say about assuming...