crimp die for 12 gauge brass?

tommy4toes · March 19, 2015, 08:41:48 PM

Does anyone make a crimp die for 12 gauge brass? I'd like to roll the edges a little for ease of getting into the chambers. Thanks!

tommy4toes

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · March 19, 2015, 09:19:55 PM

A gun smith made one and I bought it. Just a punch actuated with a hammer. Presently it is just another artifact in my "gathrins", As Jeff Cooper used to say; "An ingenious solution to a non-existent problem"!

Lefty Dude · March 20, 2015, 01:35:55 AM

I use a Lee Loader and a plastic mallet.
However CH4D makes a die for the purpose intended, and it is a mite on the pricy side.
When I get tired of the plastic mallet, I shall reward myself with the Die set and relieve my wallet of close to $200.00 for the complete 12 ga. Brass die set.
Buffalo Arms has this set listed in the on-line catalog.
Maybe this Year, I just bought two more boxes of brass shells. This brings my total 12's now at 200 Magtech's.
I do a slight case mouth roll on all the case's prior to the reloading. I can still pressure fit the card & wads in the case. I find that once I do the roll it will last at least 6-8 loadings, maybe more.

Fingers McGee · March 20, 2015, 09:59:02 AM

RCBS makes a 12 ga die set for brass hulls.

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · March 20, 2015, 01:59:53 PM

Quote from: Fingers McGee on March 20, 2015, 09:59:02 AM
RCBS makes a 12 ga die set for brass hulls.

I have that as well! All I use is the shellholder and the deprimer.

Blackpowder Burn · March 20, 2015, 05:35:44 PM

I have the RCBS die set also. The deprimer broke the first time I used it. They sent me a replacement and it broke also. I use the shell holder for priming and the die for putting a roll crimp on the cases.

Tascosa Joe · March 21, 2015, 10:57:23 AM

Quote from: Sir Charles deMouton-Black on March 20, 2015, 01:59:53 PM
I have that as well! All I use is the shellholder and the deprimer.

+1

tommy4toes · March 24, 2015, 11:33:19 PM

OK - I doubt I'll go for the $200 set.... maybe I can talk my local 'smith into making something. These brass shells are cool looking.

Tommy4toes

Bibbyman · March 25, 2015, 04:37:36 AM

I can see where the roll crimp would help a lot with loading the round in the gun. But does the crimp straighten back out on firing? If not, won't the crimp have to be removed before you load them again?

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · March 25, 2015, 10:04:13 AM

Quote from: Bibbyman on March 25, 2015, 04:37:36 AM
I can see where the roll crimp would help a lot with loading the round in the gun. But does the crimp straighten back out on firing? If not, won't the crimp have to be removed before you load them again?

1. No.

2. No.

The crimp on brass hulls does not hold the load column together. IF PRESENT, its function is to aid insertion in loops on a leather shell belt.
With the technique used by many fast shooters, any crimp is not an important factor.

I have seen a video clip, but basically remove two shells from the belt, between thumb and forefinger of the weak hand, primers up. With the open gun breach about shoulder height held by the wrist in the shooting hand. Touch the shells to the breach in line with the bores (they will be verticle, primer up) and rotate the shells in line with the bores and press in with the weak hand. This works with all types of shell and makes a crimp of much less importance.

Lefty Dude · March 25, 2015, 03:29:41 PM

Quote from: tommy4toes on March 24, 2015, 11:33:19 PM
OK - I doubt I'll go for the $200 set.... maybe I can talk my local 'smith into making something. These brass shells are cool looking.

Tommy4toes

Make sure your "Local Smith" follows the proper chamber spec for the sizing die. 12 ga. chambers are slightly tapered, not straight. This is the problem with the RCBS die set.
That is why I will pay for a quality set of dies to load all brass shells.

Coffinmaker · March 25, 2015, 09:24:01 PM

Since switching to All Brass (as opposed to Half Brass ;}), I've just bought myself to load my SxS a little differently. Not much, just a little.
Since I've gotten older and found I'm Half Fast and it is a little slower to shoot a Hammer Double with All Brass, I just relax and enjoy the ambiance of shooting Gunfighter with Cap Guns and a Hammer Double. Just plain FUN.

There are a couple of fellas that are a smidgen faster than me, but really, my fun just lasts a smidgen longer ;}
And "they" don't shoot Gunfighter with 3 inch barrel Snubbie Cap Guns. Wusses!

Coffinmaker

Oh, forgot, for the OP ..... I don't find a bit of a roll on an All Brass to be that beneficial.

rickk · March 26, 2015, 07:37:49 AM

As already pointed out, the RCBS 12 gauge dies will do the job. They will also fix up a hull that got stepped on a little.

Be aware that they wont fit in a "standard" 7/8-14 threaded press. The thread size is 1-1/4"-12.

That means, Rock Chucker, Lee Cast Classic, or a Corbin swage press. The Lee "Cast Classic" is the cheapest way out and it is very much up to the task.

Also, be aware if searching for used RCBS 12 gauge dies that there are 2 versions out there. The current version is made for Brass hulls. The older version is made for reloading 12 gauge plastic hulls.

I've got the dies. I use them to deprime and reprime and to straighten dented brass hulls. The rest of the loading operations are done with some wooden tools that I made on my lathe. A length of 5/8" storebought dowel will probably work just as well. I tried putting a little crimp on a few hulls but didn't really like it so I stopped doing it. It made reloading a bit more tedious. It will make pushing them in to snug belt loops a little easier but I didn't see much in the way of an advantage as far as loading a double. There might be some reliability improvements with a taper if using a pump however.

Rick

tommy4toes · March 29, 2015, 06:25:11 PM

Thanks for all the info, guys! I got to try out some brass shells at the 2015 Range War - Cowboys vs. Law Enforcement match in Las Cruces, NM yesterday; was just shooting the double and even the "straight" ones worked fine. I want to try them in my '97 next.

I have 20 hulls to test things out. I love how the fiber wads come out on fire !!!! Pretty cool !!!

Tommy4toes

Coffinmaker · March 29, 2015, 08:54:18 PM

Don't be too surprised if you don't like the way All Brass hulls run in your '97. Most of thugs in my neck of the woods have found the '97 chokes on brass hulls.
I don't know why. I don't know why that may be true. I quit shooting pump guns about the same time I retired from Gunsmithing and haven't paid attention. Actually, since I retired, I can't afford to "pay" attention. I do know some of the guys were griping the '97 tended to damage the case mouth.
Like em alot inna Rabbit Ears double though. Way cool.

Coffinmaker

Lefty Dude · March 30, 2015, 12:45:49 AM

I run smokeless 16 ga. all brass in my 97 Winchester. They feed and function like corn thru a Goose.

tommy4toes · March 31, 2015, 10:21:49 PM

Totally way cool! Tried 6 out at the 2015 Range War: Cops vs Cowboys. Used my Stevens rabbit-ears. I think I'm hooked......forget the '97!

Tommy

rickk · April 02, 2015, 01:32:47 PM

If you are afraid of burning wads starting a fire, soaking the wads in molten bullet lube will make that much less likely to happen.

hydin · May 01, 2015, 06:08:34 PM

Might be an odd question, and I don't mean to hijack the thread, but can I pay someone to crimp some brass 12 gauge shells I have? Seems like it'd be cheaper than buying the reloading equipment and the dies and all that.

Editing this to be a little clearer. I meant crimp the empty shells.

Dusty Morningwood · May 03, 2015, 08:58:07 AM

I have put a roll crimp on shells using a copper fitting that reduces from 1" to 1/2". The interior of the fitting has a curve where it reduces and if you run the shells up into this with your press, it makes a passable roll crimp. Of course, I resize my cases with an old Lee Loader and then do everything else by hand. No reloading press.