I've Said Good BYE to my PRS Big Lube Bullets Today

[john boy]

Under the bench today, found 6 sleeves of PRS Big Lube bullets.  They are the last of them and are now loaded for the next successive matches and then hello only Ideal 454190's!
Shot thousands of the PRS bullets but after much experimentation with accuracy past 100yds, have found the 454190's to be the bullet of my choice, even out to 500 meters

[Roosterman]

Nice shooting John Boy. No sense shooting bullets that won't perform. Used to shoot Big  lubes in cowboy matches , 30 to 40 yards being the typical range. Past 100 yards they get wobbly.

[rifle]

Good shooting. Must be a good rifle like the old "One of One Thousand" Winchester used to sell back in the day.

Wonder......what do you do to contend with fouling if yer usin the Holy Black? Wipe the bore after every shot? Load alube pill/grease cookie under the bullet?

Without the fouling control could you shoot like the pic shows?

The 454190 is a good bullet. Ideal 454190"s from an Ideal mould or Lyman mould? I use a Lyman mould. My Winchester 1873 by Uberti(Sporting Rifle with the long barrel) like those bullets. Of course it likes all kinds of bullets. It is like a "One in "Ten Thousand" Winchester.

I use smokeless powder in it to get the accuracy. I use the Holy Black mostly in the single actions revolvers and Sharps rifles and Hawken rifles.
I've shot the Big Lubes and thunk they are good to help contend with fouling. I've heard others state the Big Lubes are accurate. Everything is relative though. Not every one shoots that far out as you do. Yer like "Gus" in the "Lonesom Dove" movie.

I've put more than a few ground hogs that dig holes in the farm fields to "Pushin Up Daisies" with my "73" out a longways. Not much past 400-500 yards though. That takes some shootin skill and....A LOT OF LUCK for me. 

Anywhoooo....good shootin Hombre!

[Roosterman]

Just wondering John Boy, what are you using for sights to shoot that far. I can only get to 200 yards with my gun's factory sights, not enough elevation to go farther, it's a real looper.  That, and the factory sights are so course there is alot of room for sighting error at  great distance.

[john boy]

what do you do to contend with fouling if yer usin the Holy Black?
Ideal 454190"s from an Ideal mould or Lyman mould?

Blow tube - Ideal and Accurate molds.  Use the Accurate more often because it is a 5 cavity  

Roosterman, the Uberti '60 Winchester has a barrel ladder sight.  I put a globed foresight on it.  It took some adjustment on the ladder because it is calibrated for yards and the Rams are 500 meters.  Got lucky - 2 in a row and then finished the bank but not with successive rounds

[Roosterman]

Blow tube - Ideal and Accurate molds.  Use the Accurate more often because it is a 5 cavity  

Roosterman, the Uberti '60 Winchester has a barrel ladder sight.  I put a globed foresight on it.  It took some adjustment on the ladder because it is calibrated for yards and the Rams are 500 meters.  Got lucky - 2 in a row and then finished the bank but not with successive rounds


[/quote
Ah yes, the ladder would work great. the '73 rear doesn't have enough travel to shoot past 200 yards. Sticks em right in the dirt shortly there after. One of my buds has a '73 and can't get to 200 yards with it, about 25 yards short in the dirt.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Wouldn't a 500 yd. shot in NJ technically be either in the ocean or another state?      

JB, what's the ROT on your Henry?

[john boy]

Kid, there is only one mid range club in NJ: Cumberland Riflemen in Millville.  The club has a 10 position 600 yd pitted riser target range.  The shooting position at 600 is covered.  The other ranges in Jersey are max 300yds and there are no 1000yd ranges

FYI ... Sea Girt Range in NJ back in the days of Creedmoor matches had a 1000yd range.  The target was on a floating platform in the Atlantic Ocean!

The twist ratio on the Uberti Henry is normal 45 Colt caliber -  1:16

[pony express]

  The target was on a floating platform in the Atlantic Ocean!

That must have been interesting, if the sea wasn't really calm on match day.

[rifle]

when I used the Uberti "73" to plunk at the hole diggers on the old farm I used standard factory sights. I knew what step to put the elevation rear to. Then how hight above the rear to set the front sight. Then what part of the barrel to set in the rear sight and aim with the top of the front. If I remember right the "E" in Uberti stamped on the barrel got me to 500 yards. After that it was just "about this much barrel" close to the rear was bout right.  After that it was plain ole questimation with how far to raise er up to get WAYWAY out there. I could raise er up so far the butt stock was way under my arm not supported at all except by the hand on the wrist and the other on the forearm. The 45 Colt shot like a rainbow and I had to questimate the range close to hit or even kick dirt on a ground hog or rock in the plowed dirt. The rocks were round and shone white in the sun and black when the sun was behind them.

Instant feed back seeing the bullet kick dirt lets the brain figger it out better. Zen does the rest except fer LOTS OF LUCK. 

I wouldn't lie to ya Hombres. A 45 Colt bullet with the sectional density the way it is with a 230-250gr. bullet isn't supposed to be that accurate way out there......but.......it can be as is illustrated in that pic in the beginning of this thread.

Side note......back then my shootin Buddy used a FAL rifle with armor piercing bullets(.308?) to shoot at hills and sometimes get the ground hogs to be driven OUT of the holes.   

Everyone should live on a farm and get to shoot all over the place at least fer one or two decades of their shootin life. If ya smoke cigs you can smoke half of one waiting fer the 45 Colt to strike the dirt 600 yards out. ha ha ha ha ha

[john boy]

That must have been interesting, if the sea wasn't really calm on match day.

The platform was anchored on pilings

[Dick Dastardly]

Ho JB, have you any experience with the Big Lube®LLC DD/PUK/ROA 45-210 grain bullets at distances beyond 100 yards?  I've been experimenting with it in my 45-70 Roller and find it surprisingly accurate.  Because of it's medium sectional density it doesn't do well out beyond 100 meters, but till then it seems to do quite well.

DD-MDA

[john boy]

...have you any experience with the Big Lube®LLC DD/PUK/ROA 45-210 grain bullets at distances beyond 100 yards?

No Dick, I haven't.  Not even 7 yards because I don't own the mold or have any of the bullets

[Roosterman]

Ho JB, have you any experience with the Big Lube®LLC DD/PUK/ROA 45-210 grain bullets at distances beyond 100 yards?  I've been experimenting with it in my 45-70 Roller and find it surprisingly accurate.  Because of it's medium sectional density it doesn't do well out beyond 500 meters, but till then it seems to do quite well.

DD-MDA

Good Golly, what do you have, a 1 in 48 twist on that roller? The math just doesn't work for that one, must be an act of God....

[Noz]

Long range ballistic with the old smokers is a mixture of science, skill, luck and a little voodoo tossed in.

[Roosterman]

Long range ballistic with the old smokers is a mixture of science, skill, luck and a little voodoo tossed in.

There's something to be said for that. But, in my experience, short bullets in fast twist barrels aren't known for tremendous accuracy.
This year will be my 35th year shooting BP and that bullet/gun combo wouldn't be my first choice.

[john boy]

and a little voodoo tossed in

Noz, where can I get one of those little voodoo's  Do they know how to spot too?

[john boy]

But, in my experience, short bullets in fast twist barrels aren't known for tremendous accuracy.

Greenhill and Powley proved that decades ago.  Powley even identifies a min-max twist.
And if your not satisfied with the work of those 2 fellas - Charlie Dell has an excellent calculator too along the lines of Powley's

Then when your done with these, throw in Don Miller's MV Calculator  ... your good to go except for Mother Nature and a good set of eyes

[Dick Dastardly]

I corrected my typo.  I meant 100 meters, not 500.

DD-MDA

[Roosterman]

I corrected my typo.  I meant 100 meters, not 500.

DD-MDA

I doubt you're going to get better than an 8" to 12" group with that bullet in a 45-70 @ 100 yards.