44 Mag to 44WCF conversion.

Gripmaker · June 22, 2014, 05:56:10 PM

I know this isn't a thread for just any lever actions but does anyone know how hard it would be to convert a Rossi 92 from 44 Mag to 44WCF? Or do you know of a gunsmith who can tell me? Have high power loads for 44WCF that out-perform the Mag with much less recoil and pressure...easier on the gun and these old bones.

Thanks, in advance, for your help.

jimbobborg · June 22, 2014, 07:42:54 PM

Not going to work. The rim on the 44-40 is much bigger than on the .44 Mag, the bolt face won't work between the two. I'd suggest you find a .45 Colt version and have it sleeved to 44-40.

Gripmaker · June 22, 2014, 09:21:21 PM

Thanks for the reply. I think I'll just look for a 92 already chambered in 44 WCF. It will probably be much cheaper.

Trailrider · June 22, 2014, 10:13:10 PM

Quote from: jimbobborg on June 22, 2014, 07:42:54 PM
Not going to work. The rim on the 44-40 is much bigger than on the .44 Mag, the bolt face won't work between the two. I'd suggest you find a .45 Colt version and have it sleeved to 44-40.

You might need to obtain a breechblock for the Rossi M1892. It will depend on the particular model Rossi. I have a "M65" in .44-40 and an old model "Puma". How much difference there would be, and from whom you could obtain a proper breech block, I don't know. You would probably have to have a new breechblock fitted to the locking lugs and receiver, as well as rechambering the barrel to .44-40. Years ago, I had several M1886 Winchesters fitted with M71 breechblocks/locking lugs that I originally obtained from Numrich Arms. In both instances, I didn't change the chambering, but it wasn't that difficult for a qualified gunsmith. What it would cost, and whether it wouldn't be just as easy to find another Rossi in .44-40, I can't say, but I'd bet the latter would be more economical. Best of luck with your project. Oh, one other thing... The .44-40 brass does have greater case capacity than the .44 Magnum. BUT, the maggie was intended for higher pressures, and in spite of the .44-40 having greater capacity, case life and safety might be compromised.

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · June 23, 2014, 09:11:16 AM

The chamber conversion won't work that well. The 44-40 is fatter at the base and skinnier at the neck. This one comes up every once in a while. The advice to find a piece in your desired chambering is good.

Gripmaker · June 23, 2014, 10:10:43 AM

Thanks for all the info. After rechecking my books and talking to the top lever action man in the country (it's not that kid from Texas), I solidified my decision to just look for a 92 in 44WCF. First, the rim on the 45 Colt is actually smaller than the 44 Mag so rebarreling or sleeving one would have the same problems as started with. Also, even though the 44WCF has a fatter base, there is ample room to rechamber a 44 mag barrel to 44WCF but, the bolt head would still need to be redone unless another bolt, in the appropriate size, is obtained and installed. This work would be extensive enough and costly enough to just purchase another rifle.
SOOOOOOO, while it could be done, I have other things that are more important to spend my money/time on. What the heck...it was something to think about.

Thanks again to all who commented.

Coal Creek Griff · June 23, 2014, 10:25:37 AM

There are several 44-40 Rossis on Gun Broker right now. ..

CC Griff

w44wcf · June 23, 2014, 11:34:59 AM

Quote from: Gripmaker on June 22, 2014, 05:56:10 PM
I know this isn't a thread for just any lever actions but does anyone know how hard it would be to convert a Rossi 92 from 44 Mag to 44WCF? Or do you know of a gunsmith who can tell me? Have high power loads for 44WCF that out-perform the Mag with much less recoil and pressure...easier on the gun and these old bones.

Thanks, in advance, for your help.

Gripmaker,
If you desire a M92 in .44-40 than as the pards have indicated, it would be better just to buy one than have the .44 Magnum converted.

On the other hand, if you are wanting .44-40 performance, you could use loading data for the .44-40 in your .44 magnum. The case capcities are close enough that there would not be much difference. A friend of mine uses .44-40 data in loading .44 Magnum cases for his rifle. He is really happy with that.

I'm not sure what you mean ..... "Have high power loads for 44WCF that out-perform the Mag with much less recoil and pressure...easier on the gun and these old bones."

Higher power .44-40 loads will recoil as much as equivalent .44 Magnum reloads.

w44wcf

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · June 24, 2014, 11:04:34 AM

My son & I have both .44 RM and .44-40 arms. We find that the same loads give substantially the same performance in both, whether smokeless or BP.

Trailrider · June 24, 2014, 12:28:50 PM

Extensive testing I did a few years ago, comparing loadings in .44 Magnum versus .44-40, using a convertable Ruger Vaquero, showed that Remington .44 Magnum brass has between 89 and 93 percent of the case capacity of W-W .44-40 brass. In order to have bullet trajectories and aiming points nearly the same in this gun (around 950 ft/sec with the same 213.5 gr bullet in both cartridges) it was necessary to reduce the charge of Hodgdon's UNIVERSAL powder from 8.0 gr. in the .44-40 to 7.5 gr in the .44 Magnum, or approximately a 6 percent reduction (93.7 percent of the .44-40 load). It is possible that using W-W brass in .44 Magnum would produce a slightly less difference. Nonetheless, using the same load in the .44 Magnum case as was used in the .44-40 would increase the pressures in the maggie. That is a basic law of physics: a smaller volume of gas will result in higher pressures, and higher velocities, unless some other factor obtained.

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · June 27, 2014, 11:06:56 PM

Trailrider; I suppose you are right, allright. I don't firewall so I had some leeway. as for point of impact, the critical factor is bullet weight. As my old reliable bullet for all .44s is the RCBS 44-200-(i can't recall the name attached) the POI was the same in my OMVs

Flint · June 30, 2014, 07:04:50 PM

The other problem is the diameter of the forward portion of the 44-40, as mentioned above. Even a 44 Russian chamber, recut to 44-40 might leave a ring near the bottleneck, certainly a 44Special will, and a 44M mouth is much larger than a 44-40, due to the brass thickness, and with a true 44-40, the bullet diameter as well..

Nimble Fingers · January 25, 2015, 07:46:59 PM

It is yup to you with what you want to do to go forward, but i will tell you what I did with the John Wayne .44-40 I got. I had bout a Numrich arms .44 mag barrel to go on it and when i took it to a gunsmith by me to switch the barrels, he asked me why I wanted to do that. I shoot .44 special and wanted the Winchester to match my Colts, to which he replied that he could use a .308 tool to change the chamber to go to the longer .44 spcl case and still fire .44-40, he did it and gave me two fired shells to prove it. I have gone thru a few matches, and the gun has not failed in any way. No some of you might slap my wrist for ruining the rifle barrel, but I will take it to my grave if my offspring don't want it. As I said it is a suggestion that cost me $60.0 and I am very happy with it.

Nimble Fingers