failures to detonate caps

William Tell · February 22, 2014, 09:52:38 AM

this morning while on Facebook, I read Mike Beliveau post about failures to detonate caps on a rifle he was testing. His solution was to
adjust the main spring. I also have this problem but it is on my Armi San Paolo 44. cal Navy. and only on two cylinders. I have gone the route of chancing the nipples but that didn't work. I just don't understand why only two cylinders don't fire. I am no way a gunsmith, have little experience in black powder, only what I have learned from working on this pistol that was left to me by a very dear friend. Can adjustments be made on the main spring ? can a novice handle it ? Thank's for any help .

rdstrain49 · February 22, 2014, 10:05:29 AM

Is the hammer making contact with the caps on the two chambers that are not firing? If not, shim the nipples with a very thin washer. If you don't have a suitable washer, try taking a few wraps around the nipple, just above the threads, with some fine copper wire. As far as the main spring, you only need about 3 1/2 pounds of hammer fall for reliable ignition. This can be measured with a set of trigger weights. Good luck

William Tell · February 22, 2014, 04:48:41 PM

O K , thank you for reply, as a novice I am not sure what you mean by washer, do you mean a metal washer like on a spark plug on your car or can it be plastic . If it is metal can I purchase at hardware or auto parts store ? I like your answer seems reasonable and a lot safer then what I was thinking by not completely tightening the nipples . thank you.

rdstrain49 · February 22, 2014, 06:14:51 PM

I have found some small washers that fit ok, If I remember right they were glow plug washers from a radio controlled airplane. The copper wire is not a long term fix but should give you an indication as to the source of your problem. You might also ask your question at this site. Bunch of rather coarse red necks (I fit right in), and lots of knowledge when it comes to all things cap & ball.

http://gunslingersgulch.com/index.php

William Tell · February 23, 2014, 06:55:36 PM

Found small round washers, actually they were like a wire made into a washer. After several attempts to make the washer fit, it was the same size as the nipple, I had to call in my brother-in-law. What he did was heat up the washer with a lighter and made it fit.
Pretty cool i thought . Anyway it fit, I then installed the nipples, really, really tight. The first time with caps it would not turn. So I found that I was able to tighten the nipples a little more. Of course the new nipples used #11 caps which didn't help. But IT WORKED !! First time in long time I was able to fire all six cylinders.Thank you guys very much.

rdstrain49 · February 23, 2014, 07:24:16 PM

Now you have to figure out why only two holes weren't firing.

pony express · February 23, 2014, 08:15:57 PM

Well, if you changed nipples already before using the washers, then the problem must be the cylinder, apparently two of the holes for the nipples must be cut a few thousanths too deep. Since it's not an Uberti or Pietta, then a replacement cylinder probably won't be available, so the shim under the nipple would be the only solution

Wolfgang · February 24, 2014, 07:53:52 AM

I was having cap failures on the ASM cylinders that I was using in my Original Remington. I found that the nipples on the ASM cylinders required more "push" when seating the caps that did the nipples on my Pietta cylinders. I was getting about a 50% failure rate . . . but they would go off on a second hit with the hammer. Just my experience.

Fiddling with cap & ball stuff . . . and finally getting it to work . . . . is part of the FUN of shooting cap & ball . . .

St8LineLeatherSmith · February 25, 2014, 07:57:06 AM

Quote from: pony express on February 23, 2014, 08:15:57 PM
Well, if you changed nipples already before using the washers, then the problem must be the cylinder, apparently two of the holes for the nipples must be cut a few thousanths too deep. Since it's not an Uberti or Pietta, then a replacement cylinder probably won't be available, so the shim under the nipple would be the only solution

thats exactly what I was thinking it was also
always a good idea to use antisieze compound on the threads of the nipple for easy removal. makes the task of replacing the nipples a lot easier when it comes time.

rickk · February 25, 2014, 11:54:02 AM

I wonder what would happen if you moved the nipples around?

Would it follow the nipple or say with the offending cylinder?

William Tell · February 25, 2014, 04:59:59 PM

Moving the nipples made no difference. The problem stayed with the same two cylinders. But that problem has gone away with the use of washers. I have done everything wrong in this world of Black-powder but what a blast. Wrong powder, wrong balls, and more.I know my buddy has had a ball watching from heaven ! I actually shot myself with my pistol. The first time i shot, i used to little powder and wrong size ball (too small) , shot at a board sitting in a ditch so I was I shooting down,about 15 ft. away. I watched the ball leave the barrel, hit the board , and bounce right back into my stomach , with enough power left to leave a red mark . But like I said before it has been a blast.

ps. duelist1954 on you tube, the possible shop and you guys
in the darksider's den have been a great help.

rickk · February 26, 2014, 01:40:36 PM

I think you have thing under control, but rest assured you are not the only one to have this problem. I found a thread that discusses this in great detail. Some of the information was contained in images that are no longer there, but there is still lots of discussion left...

http://1858remington.com/discuss/index.php?topic=5117.15

Rick