is the '97..............

[Kaboom Andy]

strong enough?

I was planning to find a way to buy a '97 but!!! I heard that the '97 is not strong enough to survive the abuse of CAS shooting. Shooters say that they collect more than one just to bring parts from them, it's true?
In one post A shooters say: "I broke the 20th '97 so now I'm switching to a double..................".........I'm lil bit scared coz in Italy it's quite impossible to fix it!!!
I'm thinking to stay with my double or buy a new one instead of switch to a '97........................someone have suggestions?

[Wymore Wrangler]

Lots of old and new reproductions 97 out there, like any gun, somewhere along the line it could break, but I wouldn't let that stop you....

[Camille Eonich]

Andy,  I have been shooting my '97 since my first CAS match in Jan 2003 and the only problem that I have ever had with it is the ejector broke.  That was when I was dry fire practicing a couple of nights a week with it.  The ejectors cost about $8 a piece and I keep 3 or 4 on hand now.  It has only broken once.  Stump hasn't even had that much trouble with his. 


If you get a '97 let Harland do his majick on it.  Once he gets done going through it you won't have anything to worry about.

[Advertising]

[Camille Eonich]

Oh yeah let me add in that all 3 of our '97s are original Winchesters not the Norincos.

[Kaboom Andy]

  Thanks Camille.......................and you are right with the "Magic Super Slick Harland Wolff Action Job" through it , no more problems 

[Lars]

Over years and years of shooting CAS/WAS there are two gun failures that are most common. One is with 97s failing to eject, although there are various other malfunctions that also happen. VERY few folks seem to have 97s that ALWAYS function correctly. For most folks, I cannot and will not recommend 97s, no matter when or where made, or who did what to them.

The one thing that many folks in CAS/WAS do that is considered "gun abuse" in other shooting sports is literally slam open and closed 97s and doubles (rifles and revolvers get their fail share of same kind of abuse). Great way to batter parts, especially on older guns with softer steels, and start that gun down the path to failure. IF you are willing to develop a technique that avoids the slaming open and closed, then you can expect less battering and breakage.

Lars

[Micheal Fortune]

I have a 1898 '97 and have been shooting it with no problems.  I have and extra set of ejectors in the gun cart just incase but haven't needed them yet. 

[Marshal Will Wingam]

My wife's been shooting her '97 for 3 or 4 years with no problems. I have one that looks like scrap iron, but it still shoots fine.

[Doc Neeley]

I have to agree with the above. I got mine for $50 and the extractor was broken and had to be fixed. Been shooting it since. I try to use the lightest loads I can of course in respect to the old girl.

[tarheel mac]

Well, the '97 is possibly the single most popular shotgun in CAS, so there must be something right about them...I don't think I would worry too much about possiible failures.

[The Arapaho Kid]

I've been doing CAS for a little over a year and I see more old 97's at shoots than two shooters like mine.  The 97 is a very popular gun and anyone who is familiar with it can really rattle those rounds down range.  They are a whole lot faster than two shooters.

[Camille Eonich]

That depends on who is shooting the double barrel Arapaho.


For instance the fastest shooter on an eight shotgun stage this past weekend was Red River Ray with a time of 24.56 seconds (he shot it again later in 22 seconds) the next fastest time was 28.18 seconds by a man with a 97.


How many double barrel shooters have you seen in the three matches that you have shot and how much do the people that you have seen shooting them practice with them?

[Micheal Fortune]

The general consensus Kid is the fast ones shoot a shotgun round a second.  4 shot string should be 4 seconds or less.

Most people use the Model 97, there are a lot of different speed loading techniques for the right handed shooter.

I shoot a side by side most of the time these days.  I'm left handed and it's just quicker for me.

To fully answer your question.  It's a tie, if you have someone practice with a side by side it's amazing how fast they can shoot it.

Here is a link to Doc's Video's, check them out when you get a chance.  Get good with your shotgun and it will also get you out of last place.
http://www.jspublications.net/vids/index.html

[Kaboom Andy]

Hy Kid,
in my post I'm not discussing how fast could be a '97 vs double..............it's only a matter of PRACTICE!!!! I saw Red River Ray and his speed is impressive, I saw OKC with a '97 and his speed is impressive too. Choose which kind of shotgun you want to use and how much you want to practice with it it's your personal decision only.
My fear is ....can the '97 survive to the abuse of CAS shooting? The answer seems to be  YES

Regards

[Joyce (AnnieLee)]

Howdy Kaboom Andy!

Yep, there are still a lot of good '97s out there, and yes, there are a lot of '97s out there that are junk.  Since you are "across the pond", you aren't able to check out the shotgun in person before buying it, so there's an added difficulty. Is there any way you could have a pard over here take a look at it before you jump through hoops to have it sent to you? If you can have Harland look at it and fix any possible problems, that would be a big bonus.

By the way, Red River Ray and his double was the top shooter at the Northeast Regional.


Good luck!



AnnieLee

[Kaboom Andy]

  Hy AnnieLee,

yes, I've some friend (Island Girl, Oklahoma Charlie, Harland Wolff, Camille & Stump) that can check for the '97 before to buy it..............Is what I'll want to do, the only problem was........... ."I want to be sure to buy an affordable shotgun!"

Really I'm pretty fast with the double too and it offer the "best" cowboy look in this sport...................it's a big debate "Double vs '97" and it's an hard decision too

[Joyce (AnnieLee)]

It sounds like you are in good hands then, Andy and are left with that wonderful dilemma, "the choice!"

I ended up waffling and have one of each! Still need to spend more time with my Stoeger, though. I am slow and it doesn't shuck shells the way I'd like it to.

Have fun with your decision,



AnnieLee

[Arcey]

....need to spend more time with my Stoeger .......it doesn't shuck shells the way I'd like it to.

AnnieLee

Tried cleanin' out the belly button lint?

[Joyce (AnnieLee)]

....need to spend more time with my Stoeger .......it doesn't shuck shells the way I'd like it to.

AnnieLee

Tried cleanin' out the belly button lint?

Aye, that was the first thing I tried! Seems that somewhere along the line, the left side extractor was rounded a touch so it won't grab shells the way it should. To compensate for that, I've had work done on the lining of that barrel. It's better but still not good.

AnnieLee

[Camille Eonich]

Yeah well, I think that I'm going to be in the market for a good double barrel the first part of the year.  I may be playing around in Frontier Cartridge a bit since I had so much fun at the Big Iron.