45 Cowboy Special

Dusty Tagalon · October 20, 2013, 10:04:20 PM

A couple years back, the 45 Cowboy Special was banned. I think we need to look a little bit closer. As I measure the 45 Cowboy Special vs .455, I think it could be used in the ..455.

Case dimensions;
Bertram Brass .455
length .871 diameter tapered .468-.475, rim diameter .520

45 Cowboy special
length .889, diameter .471, rim diameter .505.

I am looking for a couple of volunteers to see if the 45 Cowboy Special will work in a 455 Elly/455 Webley. I will send the volunteers 10 rounds of 45 Cowboy special Brass to try, bonus to the first to respond, 19 rounds of Bertram .455 brass. If i is usable in a .455, I want to have 1 to submit to NCOWS side by side for comparison, if it doesn't work, it is a non issue.

Brian

pony express · October 20, 2013, 10:33:04 PM

It's also pretty close to the dimensions of a .46 short rimfire. I believe these were used in 1858 Remington conversions.

Case length: .836, Rim diameter: .530, Case diameter: .458

Also pretty close to .44 Henry rf.

Case length: .875, Rim diameter: .519, Case diameter: .446.

Would that make it acceptable as a centerfire replacement for unavailable rimfire cartridges? Really seems not that much different than a .44-40 in a Henry?

Fredcdobbs · October 20, 2013, 11:06:25 PM

Can't help you but here is a pretty picture of Schofield and Cowboy.
I load mine with .455 dies.

OklaTom · October 21, 2013, 06:33:56 AM

What is the rim thickness of the 45 Cowboy? Most of those Webley calibers had a much thinner rim and the thicker rim of the 45 Colt or Cowboy won't fit between the recoil shield and the cylinder. I have to have my 442 Webley brass custom turned down to make the rim thickness right. I have a Webley RIC in 455 Webley that has not been altered, if you want to try...

rbertalotto · October 21, 2013, 07:26:56 AM

What do you mean "banned"?

I was under the impression that it is totally legal for SASS.

JohnsonBarr · October 21, 2013, 07:32:57 AM

The particular reason for banning the 45 Cowboy Special was that it was being used in SAA Colts and clones chambered for 45 Colt. While the 45 Schofield cartridge was a period correct interchangeable round, the Cowboy Special case length did not exist in our time period. Pretty much a SASS gamer thing.

That being said, using the 45 Cowboy Special case as a starting point to re-create obsolete cartridges for other weapons like the Webley's and Remington cartridge conversions would be acceptable. I have a Webley war child that was cut to accept 45 ACP with moon clips. While the rim thickness of the 45 Auto Rim binds against the recoil shield, the 45 Cowboy Special cases work wonderfully.

River City John · October 21, 2013, 09:07:47 AM

Quote from: rbertalotto on October 21, 2013, 07:26:56 AM
What do you mean "banned"?

I was under the impression that it is totally legal for SASS.

"This is NCOWS!" (Must be said like General Leonidas in "The 300")

RCJ

rbertalotto · October 21, 2013, 09:11:19 AM

Opps.......forgot I was in the NCOWS area............

Fredcdobbs · October 21, 2013, 03:50:26 PM

Quote from: rbertalotto on October 21, 2013, 09:11:19 AM
Opps.......forgot I was in the NCOWS area............

I think SASS even allows 45 ACP in your revolver if I remember correctly.

Abilene · October 21, 2013, 04:41:17 PM

Quote from: Fredcdobbs on October 21, 2013, 03:50:26 PM
I think SASS even allows 45 ACP in your revolver if I remember correctly.

And .40S&W and 9mm and others, as long as you have a gun chambered for it, use lead bullets, and keep it at SASS power levels. Recently even 1873 rifles have been re-chambered for 45acp.

JohnsonBarr · October 21, 2013, 04:48:51 PM

I am guessing that the 'NCOWS Members Only' forum isn't really what it seems. Offfdaa!

River City John · October 21, 2013, 04:59:20 PM

I should point out to Mr. Barr that this is the open forum.

The real Wizard of Oz is behind the curtain.

RCJ

Dusty Tagalon · October 21, 2013, 05:50:11 PM

The Rim thickness could be an issue, .050 45 CS vs .031 on the .455.

Brian

yahoody · October 23, 2014, 02:28:39 AM

bump

Two Bit Charlie · October 24, 2014, 09:31:23 PM

Quote from: JohnsonBarr on October 21, 2013, 07:32:57 AM
The particular reason for banning the 45 Cowboy Special was that it was being used in SAA Colts and clones chambered for 45 Colt. While the 45 Schofield cartridge was a period correct interchangeable round, the Cowboy Special case length did not exist in our time period. Pretty much a SASS gamer thing.

That being said, using the 45 Cowboy Special case as a starting point to re-create obsolete cartridges for other weapons like the Webley's and Remington cartridge conversions would be acceptable. I have a Webley war child that was cut to accept 45 ACP with moon clips. While the rim thickness of the 45 Auto Rim binds against the recoil shield, the 45 Cowboy Special cases work wonderfully.

Mark, you use "Gamer" like it's a bad thing!!

Shotgun Franklin · October 24, 2014, 09:56:22 PM

Instead of trimming to .45 ACP length, trim to the .45 Government round. It was issued to the Army, close to a .45 Colt rim but the length of a S&W .45. You can find info in 'Cartridges of the World'.

OklaTom · October 29, 2014, 11:32:05 PM

Quote from: JohnsonBarr on October 21, 2013, 04:48:51 PM
I am guessing that the 'NCOWS Members Only' forum isn't really what it seems. Offfdaa!

The "Members Only" forum is NCOWS Chambers http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/board,62.0.html

yahoody · October 30, 2014, 08:29:25 PM

Quote from: JohnsonBarr
I am guessing that the 'NCOWS Members Only' forum isn't really what it seems.

Not sure what it is or isn't. I got this. "off limits to you"

Which in my mind pretty much made a joke of this, "Open discussion relating to National Congress of Old West Shootists, authenticity".

So much for an open discussion. I saw all I needed to know about NCOWS from its members before the thread was deleted from public view.

Books OToole · October 31, 2014, 12:49:31 PM

Yahoody;

A few years ago we (NCOWS) had a problem with non-members just stirring up $#!^; so we created the members only section to have serious (& somewhat heated) discussions just among members.

As soon as you get your NCOWS number you can register and get access.

Books

OklaTom · October 31, 2014, 03:05:47 PM

Quote from: yahoody on October 30, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
Not sure what it is or isn't. I got this. "off limits to you"

Which in my mind pretty much made a joke of this, "Open discussion relating to National Congress of Old West Shootists, authenticity".

So much for an open discussion. I saw all I needed to know about NCOWS from its members before the thread was deleted from public view.

According to a PM I got, Yahoody now has access to the members only forum NCOWS Chambers