Another post on "toe plugs" - yea, I know but I want to hear your opinion please

[bedbugbilly]

O.K. - so here's the deal . . . .

I've made a number of holsters with toe plugs but am still "learning".  The last holster I did with one was for a Remington '58 NMA Pietta "Police" (Navy) - slim jim style.  On that one, I tried a "beveled" toe plug - cut a 45 degree angle on inside of bucket toe with matching 45 degree angle on the plug and sewed in.  It came out O.K. and looks O.K. but I think I prefer an inset toe plug with 90 sides slid in to the toe of the bucket.  Anyways . . .

Obviously, some folks like toe plugs, some don't - that's fine - different strokes as they say.  Those that use their sidearms to hunt seem to like them to keep out dirt and snow - some don't.  I can see both sides of the argument.  However . . . some of the holsters I make are going to have them . . . either "just because", "authentic" or "customer request".

I guess my main question is this.  On original military holsters and some originals I've had the chance to examine at shows, etc. - the toe plug is "solid" . . . i.e. no drainage hole.  In my way of thinking, if the holster is used outside and gets any rain - a hole in the toe plug might work as a drain or at least as ventilation to help dry out the holster or let fine dirt fall out.  On the other hand, it could also let in what the toe plug is supposed to keep out. 

Obviously, if a holster gets wet or damp . . . or, say if the rig is used and stormed on and the pistol gets wet and put back in the holster . . . a solid toe plug does not allow for ventilation to help dry it out and if left holstered, a solid toe plug might even contribute faster to possible surface rust near the muzzle.

So your thoughts please . . . do any of you automatically punch a hole in the toe plug for drainage/ventilation and if so, does it help.  If you leave the toe plug solid . . . your thoughts on why it is better to do it that way.  Or . . . is my thinking on the possibility of punching a hole in the toe plug "all wet" and it won't make a difference one way or the other? 

I know a lot of you have done many more holsters than I with toe plugs so I appreciate your thoughts.   

[Cliff Fendley]

I have never seen a 19th century original with a hole in the toe plug.

[Shotgun Franklin]

I carried guns in a belt holster for 35 years. I knew of several Officers who wound up with a holster full of water because there was not drain hole. If you're only going to wear your holster at shoots or re-enactments then you don't likely need a drain hole. If you're going to routinely carry a gun in that holster it ought to have one. Besides unless you straddled someone I doubt anyone would ever see the hole.

[Cliff Fendley]

If the holster wound up full of water then the gun is saturated along with the leather. At that point dump it out and carry on, everything will need to be separated, cleaned and oiled at first opportunity anyway.

Those 19th century holsters with solid plugs were used in the rain, snow and other elements.

IMO a hole in a toe plug just takes away all the class the toe plug adds to the holster and there is just no real benefit to a hole. That much dirt, filth, water, or whatever had to get past the action of the gun to get in the toe of the holster. I just can't understand the concept of closing up the toe of a holster to just put a hole in it.

In the words of Captain Woodrow Call "That just don't make no sense"

[Bugscuffle]

I would be more concerned with lint and dirt falling into the holster and then getting pluged into the end of the barrel.  Remember that a holster is shaped very much like a funnel. It would probably be very difficult to get enough in there to cause any dammage, but it sure wouldn't do your accuracy any good. I want all of my holsters to have an open end so that I can easily clean out all of that junk, or better yet, have it just dfall straight through.

[Cliff Fendley]

Bugscuffle, I carry a gun every day of my life. I have been wearing holsters with a closed toe out hunting in the brush, rain, snow, you name it for my entire life and never had enough of anything get into a holster that it was any concern.

Please explain to me how all that horrible filth that is supposed to destroy your barrel and accuracy got there without getting in the action.

I challenge you to try and catch enough dirt with a holster to fill the end up around the barrel. Go into a hayloft during filling, stand under the elevator and catch as much dust and filth as you can in the holster. If a person even succeeds then tell me it's the barrel your worried about. If I am in that dirty of a condition I am going to be much more concerned about the action of my revolver not to mention my lungs.

The most of what will get into a holster is seed when traveling through tall grass and weeds such as ragweed certain times of the year.

[Shotgun Franklin]

Those 19th century holsters with solid plugs were used in the rain, snow and other elements.

And maybe that why the later holsters didn't have'm?

[St. George]

It's easier by far to produce a holster without a toe plug, than with one.

All of the military's holsters of the time had plugs.

Scouts Out!

[Bugscuffle]

Bugscuffle, I carry a gun every day of my life. I have been wearing holsters with a closed toe out hunting in the brush, rain, snow, you name it for my entire life and never had enough of anything get into a holster that it was any concern.

Please explain to me how all that horrible filth that is supposed to destroy your barrel and accuracy got there without getting in the action.

I challenge you to try and catch enough dirt with a holster to fill the end up around the barrel. Go into a hayloft during filling, stand under the elevator and catch as much dust and filth as you can in the holster. If a person even succeeds then tell me it's the barrel your worried about. If I am in that dirty of a condition I am going to be much more concerned about the action of my revolver not to mention my lungs.

The most of what will get into a holster is seed when traveling through tall grass and weeds such as ragweed certain times of the year.

Dang Cliff, don't get excited. I didn't say that it would damage your barrel. In fact, I said that it is unlikely that it would. I said that it wouldn't do your accuracy any good. Isn't that why long range B.P. shooters use blow tubes and bench rest shooters wipe their bores after shooting a few rounds? Isn't it a lot easier to clean out a few leaf particles or the lint build up from the bottom of your holster if the toe is open?

[Trailrider]

I have never seen a 19th century original with a hole in the toe plug.

I have an origiinal Pattern 1881 holster that most definitely has a drain hole in the toe plug. Some other civilian holsters with toe plugs do not have drain holes in the plugs.

I put holes in my plug-end holsters so that there is no problem with water filling up the holster. Of course, if a customer requests that no hole be put in, I will not put in the hole.

I personally prefer to bevel both the plug and the inside of the holster. It makes it much easier to stitch the pieces together.

[Cliff Fendley]

And maybe that why the later holsters didn't have'm?

Later holsters don't have them because makers don't want to take the time to do it.

I have NEVER had a customer ask me to leave out the plug on any holster model that would normally have one nor have I every had a customer ask me to put a hole in one. However I have many times had requests to add a plug to models that normally don't have one.

The biggest proponents I hear for open toes are from other makers, I never hear that from customers. The toe plugs are probably why my Cheyenne and Montana style holsters are my best sellers, I get more compliments on the toe plugs than any other feature.

[Cliff Fendley]

Isn't it a lot easier to clean out a few leaf particles or the lint build up from the bottom of your holster if the toe is open?

I never recall purposely cleaning out the toe of a holster beyond dumping out a few seeds. I am much more concerned about the action of my gun if conditions are such that the toe of a holster is full of anything.

The toe of my holster filling up with anything is the very least of my concerns.