Nipple woes

[RWK]

Nipple woes

1861 Colt Navy Uberti- that uses M6-75 nipples (older model)
CCI #11 caps
Track of the wolf PIR-S M6-75 nipples

I installed 1 nipple and its way to long

Faced it shorter in a mini lathe till a cap will go on and cylinder will turn

Fired 2 caps and everything is fine

So I faced the other 5

Some caps go on and cylinder turns some wont so I take a pencil with an eraser and push caps on so cylinder will turn, so may be a little too long

Then I used the guns hammer to push caps on

1st try 4 misfires, all fire on 2nd try
2nd try 5 misfires, all fire on 2nd try

Now I am trying 1 at a time
All misfire, all fire on 2nd try

When looking at the cap it's not all the way down
On 2nd try cap is bottom out on the face and then fires.


At first I am thinking they are too long
But CAP HEAD is shorter than the caps already
Cap head may be too tight because I shorten it.
So I could put it back on the mini Lathe and reduce the heads Diameter and or turn the face back to make Cap head longer.

Any help will be appreciated  

[Crow Choker]

Not all nipples are equal. If you ordered your replacement ones from trk of wolf, they may have been slated to fit your gun, but 'in reality', are too long, too 'fat'-who knows. Courious what the "PIR-S" in the track of wolf number means? I would have returned them after you intalled the first one and it was to long. The right nipples are a part of the chain of things needed for a smooth firing hog-leg. I'd try 'track' and see if you can return them, might not give you a refund since you 'milled around with em'! Try some others slated for your gun from other sources. They're like spark plugs in an engine, some work in one engine while the same plugs in an identical engine won't! How were your old ones working? Pushing caps on with a pencil, stick, etc is a good idea, BUT doin' it with the gun hammer!!!!!! Scares 'the bejebbers' outa me just readin it----sounds like the guy who used a lighted match for light to see how much gas he had in a can of gasoline. The gun could go 'bang' on ya when ya least expect it, I'd refrain from that procedure. Others with more info and insight may chime in, but if you haven't already done so, read Mako's posts on percussion cap's and nipples in the 'Dark Arts'. A wealth of information on sizes, demensions, what works, what doesn't, how they work and interrelate, etc. Lots-a-luck.

[River City John]

Also try different caps, as they vary in overall length. Left to right:
Remington #10, #11; Dyn. Nobel #10.5; CCI #10, #11.

Nipple shown is Treso for #11 cap next to stock Italian for a Uberti colt clone. Straight sides and square face holds caps better than a rounded shoulder and tapered sides.

I have used all types/sizes on the Treso and they all fit and function as they should.

[RWK]

Crow
I was using the eraser end of a new pencil. I mortified the nipples they wont take them back.
With my mini lathe I should be able to get them to work. I just need to do the correct thing.

  Nipple , 6-.75mm metric thread, for FAP - Pietta Remington, Pietta Colt, Pietta Le Mat replica revolvers, #11 CCI or Remington cap, stainless steel
      In Stock   PIR-S . . . $4.99 


I found this on the internet

EXACTLY...that is exactly how it is suppose to be done. This is the way Colt taught people to "seat" there caps clear back in the 1800's
If you pinch your caps a little and then put them on.

Then cycle your hammer through every chamber and press the hammer down firmly on each cap by pressing the back of the hammer with your palm.
Pointed in a SAFE direction, while holding the grips with the other hand.

This may seem scary, but unless you slip your hammer while lowering, it will not go off. Try it and see on an empty gun...there is no way you can press hard enough on the hammer with your palm to fire the cap.

Now these jokers in CAS use a wooden dowel to press there caps on...Are you serious?? This cannot be any safer than just using the hammer. And with the dowel, if one does go off it is not even aligned with the bore

Not all nipples are equal. If you ordered your replacement ones from trk of wolf, they may have been slated to fit your gun, but 'in reality', are too long, too 'fat'-who knows. Courious what the "PIR-S" in the track of wolf number means? I would have returned them after you intalled the first one and it was to long. The right nipples are a part of the chain of things needed for a smooth firing hog-leg. I'd try 'track' and see if you can return them, might not give you a refund since you 'milled around with em'! Try some others slated for your gun from other sources. They're like spark plugs in an engine, some work in one engine while the same plugs in an identical engine won't! How were your old ones working? Pushing caps on with a pencil, stick, etc is a good idea, BUT doin' it with the gun hammer!!!!!! Scares 'the bejebbers' outa me just readin it----sounds like the guy who used a lighted match for light to see how much gas he had in a can of gasoline. The gun could go 'bang' on ya when ya least expect it, I'd refrain from that procedure. Others with more info and insight may chime in, but if you haven't already done so, read Mako's posts on percussion cap's and nipples in the 'Dark Arts'. A wealth of information on sizes, demensions, what works, what doesn't, how they work and interrelate, etc. Lots-a-luck.

[RWK]

Caps are hard to fine in my area
All anyone carries is CCI 11 and I have 1000 of those

When I misfire the cap is being form fitted to the nipple then it fires

It either a little too tight or to short (I think)

I can fix either on my Mini Lathe

Also try different caps, as they vary in overall length. Left to right:
Remington #10, #11; Dyn. Nobel #10.5; CCI #10, #11.

Nipple shown is Treso for #11 cap next to stock Italian for a Uberti colt clone. Straight sides and square face holds caps better than a rounded shoulder and tapered sides.

I have used all types/sizes on the Treso and they all fit and function as they should.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Don't use the hammer to seat caps. The danger if a slip happens is too risky.

I use an antler tip as a "cap-pusher".  A dowel would do.

[Lefty Dude]

You could re-chase the nipple threads to accept a shorter nipple. Ruger OA's use a shorter nipple.

My Cenataur 1860, made in Belgium in 1959 had long cones and I could not find caps to fit.
I gave the piece to Pettifogger and he chased the cylinder nipple threads to accept the Ruger Treso nipples. Then build up the hammer face for the proper hammer to cone tolerence. The piece is now a nice shooter.

The nipple would be the last part I would modify in the ignition chain for proper ignition.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Lefty; I had a spare set of Ruger cones, and they do work as you suggest.

[Professor Marvel]

Ah piffle, if only Mako were still here with his excellent graphics.

>Faced it shorter in a mini lathe till a cap will go on and cylinder will turn

The standard "tubes" or "cones" or  "nipples" are a tapered cylinder, so by facing it shorter without duplicating the old diameter and taper, you now crated a tube that would need a larger cap.

I recommend that you set the angle on your lathe bit to match the original taper and run it in until you duplicate the dimensions of the outer dianmeter of the end of the nipple.

ah I found the archive:
Here is a grand discussion with excellent visuals from our good Mako

http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=9093.0

http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=9094.5



yhs
prof marvel

[Flint]

If the shooter has an old Uberti with the metric nipples, the Ruger nipples will not fit....

One solution would be to get a newer Uberti cylinder with the #12-28 threads.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

If the shooter has an old Uberti with the metric nipples, the Ruger nipples will not fit....

One solution would be to get a newer Uberti cylinder with the #12-28 threads.

I have an older Uberti model '61, made before the Colt series II, and the nipple threads are the same as Pietta

[Lefty Dude]

Lefty; I had a spare set of Ruger cones, and they do work as you suggest.
[/quote

Lets give Pettifogger the credit for the excellent thoughts and preformance with the research and hard work.
With out his articles in the SASS Cowboy chronicle several years past I would not be shooting the Frontiersman Class of SASS.

Also with out the new Slix-shot nipples we might be having nipple issues, I know many have the Treso's and so do I and they work.

But the Slix-Shots work a whole lot better. If I ran my 1860 Pietta's with the Treso cones and the light Hammer Springs I now installed with the Slix-Shot nipples, I'd have spent caps flying in all directions.

[Slowhand Bob]

Two thoughts here, I agree with not hammer setting caps and the information linked to is to valuable to lose.  I am pretty sure that SASS forbids the act of hammer setting or using body parts for such activitys.  At some point most great posts will lose valuable photographic information and this is the sort of information that needs to be transferred and archived  by a few dedicated individuals, with due credit of course.   I would love to try and see if that whole link can be converted to some format that can be printed out into notebook compatible format for saving.

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Two thoughts here, I agree with not hammer setting caps and the information linked to is to valuable to lose.  I am pretty sure that SASS forbids the act of hammer setting or using body parts for such activitys.  At some point most great posts will lose valuable photographic information and this is the sort of information that needs to be transferred and archived  by a few dedicated individuals, with due credit of course.   I would love to try and see if that whole link can be converted to some format that can be printed out into notebook compatible format for saving.

I don't know how valuable this is , but this is a piece of antlere tied to a Cash Capper that is used to bring the caps 'home on the nipple ... I got it as part of a sale of ROAs ... the previous owner was getting out of SASS and wanted to sell all his shooting stuff.

I use the curved antler to push caps home ... it keeps my hands off the caps ...

[Fingers McGee]

The proper nipple for the older Ubertis is the M6-75x.500 instead of the M6-75x.520.    ( http://possibleshop.com/s-s-nipples-cb.html ).  Not sure what the TOW number is; but the Treso number is  11-50-146 for the short nipples instead of the 11-50-106 for the standard length.  The 11-50-146 works with CCI 11, and Remington 10 and 11 caps; altho IMNSHO, the Rem 10s work best.  The Pietta Slix Shot nipples will not work on the older Ubertis. They are equivalent to the M6-75x520 Tressos in length.  I played heck getting good nipples to put on a Uberti Leech and Rigdon that was made in 1973 till I found the Possible Shop listing for the short Tessos.


And, yes, seating caps with the hammer in a SASS match is verboten and will get you a stage DQ for failuere to follow loading and unloading procedures.

[RWK]

Nipple fix

With a Sherline Mini Lathe

Track of the Wolf have no nipples that work

Track of the Wolf Nipples PIR-S M6-.75 have to be modified

OAL .525 reduced to .500

Removed .020 from the front face of seat to lengthened cone

Tapered profile of cone to refit #11 caps with a small file

Also one could counter bore revolver cylinder nipple seat .025 but then the #10 nipples will be too short.

[RWK]

Looks like I can buy them next time
Thanks

The proper nipple for the older Ubertis is the M6-75x.500 instead of the M6-75x.520.    ( http://possibleshop.com/s-s-nipples-cb.html ).  Not sure what the TOW number is; but the Treso number is  11-50-146 for the short nipples instead of the 11-50-106 for the standard length.  The 11-50-146 works with CCI 11, and Remington 10 and 11 caps; altho IMNSHO, the Rem 10s work best.  The Pietta Slix Shot nipples will not work on the older Ubertis. They are equivalent to the M6-75x520 Tressos in length.  I played heck getting good nipples to put on a Uberti Leech and Rigdon that was made in 1973 till I found the Possible Shop listing for the short Tessos.


And, yes, seating caps with the hammer in a SASS match is verboten and will get you a stage DQ for failuere to follow loading and unloading procedures.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Thanks for that information Fingers.  I did realize that standard Tresos did not fit (I tried them).  It was a good thing that my 1861 was equipped with high quality nipples when I acquired it

[Slowhand Bob]

Wadd, you have a very unique looking combination there.  I do not have as nice a tip as yours but will steal the idea and attach my antler to a capper also.  Thanks for the great photo idea.

PS: I do wish that Ted Cash would design a version of this style of capper around the '58 Remington also.

[Pettifogger]

Wadd, you have a very unique looking combination there.  I do not have as nice a tip as yours but will steal the idea and attach my antler to a capper also.  Thanks for the great photo idea.

PS: I do wish that Ted Cash would design a version of this style of capper around the '58 Remington also.

Many have tried, all have failed.  The cap windows on a Remington are simply to small.  You have to open them up and the capper will work fine.