Loading the 56/56..

[FrontierWest]

First of all thanks and hello.

I actually come from a metal detecting background and have purchased the historical fire arms of the casings I've been recovering from forts and battle sites out west.  Kind of gotten into the collecting of non dug historical cartridges to.  So, ther you have it.

I have a m1860 Spencer that the metal is great and a shooter.  My problem is...  I cannot seem to find a mold that is close to the original cartridge bullet shape (I would want it to be a slight flat nose like on many 50/70 govt. molds now, but it needs to have the rest of the profile of the original.

2nd.  The outward diameter (I'm using hypothetical numbers here for ease) say is .560 for the outside diameter of the bullet that is just right for the chamber diameter of .560 and the modified 50/70 casing is also .560.  Problem is the casing has a wall thickness that when a bullet is seated in it, is now too large to fit in the chamber.  I've thought that perhaps a necked down base combined with a more conical base instead of a flat base (like the civil war mini ball would have), would aliivate this problem (spelling errors are mine).  Problem is, I know of no one that has a mold like I am wanting of the correct factory or close grains. 

Another problem is that a converted 50/70 casing can only accept a certian amount of grains of powder, which is less than an original rimfire casing... So I thought of taking some of the weight off of the bullet to accomadate the lesser powder charge to hopefully obtain approx. the same ballistics, and MVV's out of the barrel.  Any takers on this???  Thanks in advance!   

john   

[major]

Ballard Rifle & Cartridge use to make brass for original 56-56 Spencers.  I think that they were purchased by 10X or some other cartridge maker.  But I use to have a bunch of Ballard brass that I used to shoot my 56-56 Spencer.  Do a search and you may find that the brass is still available.  One thing that you should know is that the 56-56 cartridge is notorious for being inaccurate shooting.

[Herbert]

I have not used it but the Mike Owsiak .545 heald bullet mould for the 56-56 looks good,it caries a lot of lube wich is a problem with the Rapine 56-56 mould.I belive a lot of the problems with acuracy with the original 56-56 spencer is that the bullets that were being used did not carry enough lub.I had a custom mould made based on the Rapine 56-56 mould but with much more lub caring capicity and rifles acuracy improverd to aceptable acuracy,around 5 inch groups at 100yds,I belive this can be improved on with a shoter bullet and cutt down 32 ga shot shells(you can get a extra 5grs of powder in these).Look up the thread on the Owsiak 56-56 mould in the serch section

[FrontierWest]

Where does one get the Owsiak 56-56 mould?  I think this would do the trick, but also think some sort of conical base would help it to expand in the chamber.  I cannot find him to get one.. any number or such would be great!

Thanks,
'
john

[Trailrider]

I posted this information under the topic for .56-56 brass, but will repeat it here:

Is the mould marked 533476 or is there an AX suffix to the number, presuming you have the die, not just the bullets.  These are a hollow base bullet. With Lyman #2 alloy, they should come out about .538-.540".

Here are my notes:
Useing DGW or BELL .50-70 brass.
Trim length to 0.998-1.002" OAL and deburr.
For use with straight cylindrical bullets, inside neck ream to .525" dia., slightly deeper than the length of the seated portion of the bullet. This should produce a .0125-.0135" wall thickness at the case mouth.  Huntington Die Specialties recommended a .003-.005" interference fit between the inside of the case and the bullet.
You should probably anneal the case about half-way down the remaining length of the cutdown brass. I set my brass in a pan of water, on a filled pill bottle, which the case sitting on top and the water about half-way up the brass. Put it on a lazy susan so you can rotate the whole thing. Use a propane torch until you can see the brass change color (it probably won't get cherry red), then quickly knock the case into the water, off the pill bottle.
For a .535" dia. bullet, expand the case with a  .528 expander plug. With a .540 bullet, use a .536" plug.
Seat the bullet and crimp firmly. If there is difficulty chambering the round, size the case in a .50-70 sizer die with a .575" spacer under the locking ring (RCBS .50-70 sizer die).

I had a set of custom dies made years ago by RCBS so I didn't have to cut the bottom of a .50-70 die set.

Believe it or not, the bullets cast from Lyman #2 were more accurate than softer ones! But your mileage may vary.

Unfortunately, I don't know where to find a mould for the 533476AX, and I believe Lyman discontinued it several years ago. But you might be able to find one on e-bay or some such. Sorry, mine isn't for sale.
 

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Ride to the sound of the guns, but watch out for bushwhackers! Godspeed to all in harm's way in the defense of Freedom! God Bless America!

Your obedient servant,
Trailrider,
Bvt. Lt. Col. Commanding,
Southern District
Dept. of the Platte, GAF

[Two Flints]

Try this link for more info on the 56-56 Owsiak Mould  

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php?topic=41640.0  (contact information here)

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php?topic=42084.0

Two Flints

[5judge]

Owsiak moulds are beautifully crafted and, as stated, are a superb choice. I believe Moose Moulds currently makes the Rapine Spencer mould, now that Ray has retired. My good friend Wayne Spears just got my .56-56 up and functioning. Another step in customizing .50-70 brass, at least for my Spencer, was trimming the thickness of the rim, which is done to the rim's top edge, so as not to risk leaving primers standing too high in the pocket. .56-56 Spencers, with the heeled bullet and other anomolies, are a chance harder to make function than .56-50s.

[cwbuff]

Does anyone sell cast bullets from the Owsiak mould? I would like to try some before I take a leap on a mould.

[Two Flints]

Why not contact Mike and see if he has any to sell.  His phone # was listed in the other link I posted.

Two Flints

[FrontierWest]

Thanks, and it is ordered.  He does not keep any on hand but makes them to order.  His address is for those that don't know...

Mike Owsiak
11 Verona RD
Marlton, NJ  08053

(856) 59s-0177

Thanks again and I'll post the serial number and pictures of my Spencer later.

john

[FrontierWest]

Does anyone sell cast bullets from the Owsiak mould? I would like to try some before I take a leap on a mould.

I just purchsed one from Mike and in a month or so I'll have some bullets that I'll sell.  Let me know how many ect.

John

[Eggman]

I'll just add you can't get too much lube guys - has solved all kinds of skirmishing problems for me. I use a beeswax, neetsfoot, glycerine soap concoction and coat the whole bullet with it. I believe, although I don't have concrete evidence to back it up other than hits on target, that the lube on the front ogive blows back and helps lube the bore.