Percussion shotguns in competitions

[harleydavis]

On the other hand, requiring a percussion shotgun would not be affordable and exclude me from shooting any regional or above match.

I dont believe that a percussion shotgun is REQUIRED but can be used if the shooter wanted to in lieu of a breechloader. No advantage whatsoever, but huge style points. That was one of the ideas in the founding of NCOWS, shooting for history & style. That is what attracted me to NCOWS as compared to SASS. Nothing against a feller that is a fast & accurate shooter, but back in the day, the fellers I shot with never cared what our scores were. Personally, I was more concerned about trying to win the Best Dressed trophy!!! Granted, I have been away from the game for 10 years, but I certainly hope NCOWS has not turned into a points race.

[Ima Sure Shot]

The Pistoleer class as is now only fire two shotgun shots per stage, no matter how many everyone else is required to shoot.  This is so that they do not have to reload. As they may shoot  either an exposed hammer percussion or cartridge shotgun. Questions 7 and 8 on survey 2  addressed this. Celeste

[OklaTom]

Because the survey results indicated a desire to drop the shotgun, that in itself is not necessarily going to happen.  It is my understanding that the Committee output is a suggestion, and like any proposal, may be modified from the floor.  I personally will (if no one else does it) call for that part of the proposal to be amended.  I spoke with the committee chair, and he is open to changing that line in the class proposal to leaving Pistoleer as it currently is.  Shooting that category is a lot of fun with either cartridge or percussion shotguns.  I don't want to see it changed.

[Okefinokee Outlaw]

I also am not in favor of changing Pistoleer. 

[Cliff Fendley]

I am curious if the ad hoc committee took in consideration the votes of the current members that have already been shooting pistoleer or based the decision on the whole tally.

While I personally would shoot the pistoleer without the shotgun I don't know that it is wise to eliminate the pistoleer class as it has been. By doing so we alienate the percussion shotguns.

I too just purchased a hammered shotgun so I could shoot pistoleer from time to time.

[Major 2]

Brian , Just so you know  I will second your  " call for that part of the proposal to be amended  "
but only should you beat me to  "call for the amendment" 

[Dynamite Bill]

Now yur talkin", uh  typeing I mean.

[harleydavis]

This is really why I was intially wondering if anyone was competiting with percussion doublebarrels. Pistoleer is a great class as it is, whether percussion or breechloader, two rounds is two rounds and no real advantage to either shotgun. Unless you drop your percussion cap. Bit slower at the loading table perhaps but in any case, there are plenty of shooting classes for those that do not shoot percussion (shotgun & revolver) so I would hope that Pistoleer is left as is. I do not have a percussion shotgun at the moment but am comtemplating it in the future. Like others have posted, passed up a couple of $200 percussions a few years back, wish I wouldnt have. Hard to justify the $700-$800 Pedersoli.

[Cole Bluesteele]

First of all, I hope everyone who is voicing their opinion here took the time to complete both surveys.

Second, to address the quiry about voting, there was no attempt made to seperate responses by a member's preference of shooting classes.  For example, everyone had the oppotunity to vote on the Originals class even though very few members participate in that class.  Similarly, everyone voted on the C & B classes even though not every responder shoots in the current Pistoleer class.

What you are voicing here is the Pistoleers dissatisfaction with the elimination of the shotgun from the C & B class.  That is well and good.  I would encourage those of you who shoot Pistoleer to contact other Pistoleers.  you  need to inform your Senators and Posse Reps of your request(s). 

At the Congress meeting two years ago the Originals class was amended.  There were those of us who believed that the participants in the Originals class should be the ones to decide on the issue.  Many of us abstained in the voting.  I do not hesitate to inform you that mine was the deciding vote and the Originals got what they wanted.

I say this because I personally feel the same about the Pistoleers.  The goal of the process was to develop a structure that would encourage NCOWS growth.  For that reason the motion was based on what the vast majority of NCOWS members had selected as their choice to achieve that goal.  It may well be that in this one class the majority is out of sinc with the desires of the actual participants in Pistoleer.  If that is case then rather than encourage growth, NCOWS could possibly lose members. Again, if that is the case, then that section of the survey can and should be amended.

The committee members have no "pride of authorship" problems.  Our goal remains the growth of NCOWS.  If this new structure, amended or not, is successful in growing NCOWS membership, then the efforts of the committee and those of the members who responded will have been worthwhile.

Ted Beechler
Ad Hoc Committee Chair

[Major 2]

Ted "Cole" is correct .... I clearly remember the Original Vote and how that went....

Pistoleer's need to stand up & together to save their SXS ,  or surely apathy may allow unwanted changes.

Sadly, many did not respond , by doing so you allow the tail to wag the Dog .
Same as the Senate elections....

Pistoleer's & everyone make you concerns known , contact your Possi Rep. and Senators, get you message across on all the Agenda(s).

Involved NCOWS Member is a strong NCOWS ...

"He steps off the soap box now "  ( Oh!  and my email & PM are posted )

[bowiemaker]

The survey asked all respondents to answer yes or no regarding shotguns in the Pistoleer class. I suspect many who answered may not have ever shot Pistoleer and did not understand why the class and why it is structured the way it is.

I could count myself in that camp. I honestly do not remember how I answered that question but since I have never shot in the class I never gave it much thought and did not fully understand that it was the only class that really accommodated percussion shotguns because it does not allow reloads.

[Major 2]

We are having dinner meeting tonight with possi members , to discuss the agenda and possi imput 

I might suggest other possi's do something simlar at some point before the Convention
Our shoot, Mar 2,  would then be the last change for CCC members to be heard in person to our Rep. & myself .

[harleydavis]

Update to original posting. I fell into the Dark Pool and picked up an old Navy Arms 12ga front stuffer. Guess we shall see if I am the only one on the firing up North here, with one of these beasts.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I did not vote as I am an "Alone Ranger" who has never fired an NCOWS match.  As I see it now, and the uniqueness of the pistoleer class, I would strongly cast my support towards preserving the class as it is.

My match shotgun currently is a Husqvarna underlever, a design from the late 1860s.  It would fit right in - as a spare to my Navy Arms percussion gun.

[Major 2]

I foolishly allowed an old Belgian damascus barrel 12ga. Double barrel , pass out of my hands , years ago.
It was in very good cond. but at the time, I was concerned about the barrels ...

Ah foolish me, the new owner was a aircraft mechanic, and maganfluxed them , they passed.
Course he only reenacted SIW so it only saw loose powder for the BOOM.

I bought it for $100 and sold it for $175 as I recall ...oh well that was 30 yeras ago 

[harleydavis]

My match shotgun currently is a Husqvarna underlever, a design from the late 1860s.  It would fit right in - as a spare to my Navy Arms percussion gun.

Ohhh, I had one of these some years ago. As so many of us have done, I sold for $50 more than I paid for..........doing some great business (I thought). In retrospect, kinda stupid. It went with my 60 gun collection of pre-1895 firearms. Uff.

[Montana Slim]

I'm to blame...I'm one of those who responded to the survey and voted against keeping shotgun in Pistoleer class.
I have shot Pistoleer as my predominate class at National Matches since about 1998, having missed perhaps three National Matches.... and hope to participate again someday (Lord willing & I can still obtain percussion caps). While I enjoy shooting shotguns as much as anyone, I believe removing from the class improves authenticity and reduces the logistics battle and workload for someone already managing at least two percussion revolvers.

However, If any additional consideration is given to the matter, I will be pleased to follow the wishes of fellow shooters who shoot or plan to shoot in this category.

Slim

[harleydavis]

So, am I understanding this correctly? The shotgun has been eliminated from the Pistoleer class?

[Books OToole]

So, am I understanding this correctly? The shotgun has been eliminated from the Pistoleer class?

That has been proposed; but the Congress has not yet voted on it.  The vote will happen two weeks from tonight.

Books

[harleydavis]

Oh rats. That would be a bummer after I went through the contusions of finding a percussion double. I realize I am only one feller and truth be told, I havent shot competition in some years, so, who am I to say. guess I understand the reasoning behind it and there is logic alright. Still, a bummer. Oh well, guess I can find someone to buy the ole front stuffing scattergun if I cant use it.