SAA clone durability

[Virginia Gentleman]

I think it is a foregone conclusion that most clones are made of better materials and will hold up better than most 1st generation Colts.  My question is how long and how many rounds can they go before they would need to be rebuilt?

[TwoWalks Baldridge]

I think it is a foregone conclusion that most clones are made of better materials and will hold up better than most 1st generation Colts.  My question is how long and how many rounds can they go before they would need to be rebuilt?

I think there are way too many variables to make a viable answer.  Kind of asking how many miles will a Kenworth run before it needs to have the engine rebuilt.

Some guns have soft parts that got through inspection.
How well has the owner maintained the gun.
How was the gun used, target shooting or speed shooting.
Was standard loads used versus hot loads?

Any how a general answer should be a Looooong long time.

[Pettifogger]

You won't live long enough for them to be "rebuilt".  Replacing broken parts is another question.

[Virginia Gentleman]

Let me narrow it down a bit, given Cowboy Action competition usem with reasonable cleaning and care.  Also, assuming parts TODAY are better than they were in the past with better QC.

[Abilene]

Again, what Pettifogger said.

Evil Roy recently returned his first set of ER guns to Cimarron.  After about ten years, a very rough estimate would be at least 1 million dry fires and at least 100K live rounds per gun.  In a letter with the guns he stated that he had broken one trigger/bolt spring.  These guns had been relegated to back-up status and he was exchanging them for a new pair.  They looked a little beat up and there was a line around the cylinder.  They didn't feel as smooth as a new gun but they still functioned.  Of course, these guns had been given an action job in the beginning of their life which removes friction and burrs that might have increased wear on various parts, so without an action job and lighter springs some parts might have failed or worn out sooner, but I don't think anyone would use a gun that much without at least changing the springs.

[Coffinmaker]

Again, pretty much what Abilene has said.  The most important improvement for longevity is getting rid of the original springs.  Once done, they will last a long, long time.

Coffinmaker

[Rangerider]

G,day Fellas  

Just my 2 cents worth, both my cattleman are made in 85, Had new wolf kits put in them, and a bit of polish up ?, or what I thought worked back then. Both have been used for Cow Boy only  sometime 3 times a month. Amount of rounds ?

As you can see from earlier on, That I have just got new parts from VTI, they have had a hard life, But at the price of parts there, it was much cheaper than nearly $600 each for new guns.

New guns still sound good  

For now better hop on my horse, and get out of her
Regards  John

[Bugscuffle]

It doesn't really relate for me. I spend so much time just "messing" around with some darned thing inside any one of my guns that they all end up getting rebuilt about every 8 months.

[Virginia Gentleman]

So, let me ask this question, if a clone and a 3rd gen both need work sometimes out of the box and eventually, will need rebuilding from extensive use in say CAS matches, then is the Colt really worth $700-800 more....are you really buying that much more gun for the money?  To me it doesn't sound like it from a practical standpoint or an economic one if the gun is to be used as intended or pushed to the limit in CAS matches.

[MJN77]

IMHO, I do not think a COLT can do anything that a Uberti or Pietta can't as far as function, accuracy or durability. A lot of folks can't afford $700-$800 for a pony and the word COLT stamped on their gun. Some just don't think it's worth the extra cost. I do not "cowboy shoot", but I carry my guns daily while working my farm and tending my cattle. They have seen "real" use in every kind of weather. Heat, rain, snow. They have been covered in mud, dirt and water. They have never failed me when I needed them, weather it was to put down an injured cow, shoot an aggressive wild dog, or kill a deer (or turkey) during season. I have a dozen or so Uberti guns, both rifle and revolver. I shoot them every chance I get. The only thing I have had to do to them is replace a spring now and then. Maybe three or four in the last twenty years. I have an old Uberti Buckhorn revolver I got new about eighteen years ago. It has eaten a couple thousand off the shelf Remington and Winchester .44 magnum rounds in it's life. I had to replace a bolt spring about two years after I bought it, and the firing pin about five years ago. So in my opinion, yes the "clones" are durable.

P.S. All of my guns (even the twenty year old ones) have the original springs except the ones that broke.

[Virginia Gentleman]

MJN77:  I am glad to hear from someone who really uses the guns on a daily basis for work as that is a very telling acount of how well made the replicas can be.  Breaking a spring or small part is just like needing new brakes whether you are driving a Chevy or Cadillac.....they will need new parts if used period.

[texcl]

I'm an armorer for a federal agency and I can tell you, even high prices modern super guns throw a shoe now and then, as a fact pretty often. The number one offender with most auto pistols, is the trigger spring. Normal wear and tear. I had an old replica 1851 colt that I got for Christmas when I was 13 and I shot the living heck out of it, thousands upon thousand of rounds and I really abused it, fanned the hammer and everything. I broke one bolt/trigger spring and that was it. There was some gas erosion on the edge of the forcing cone but nothing serious. I've never had any '73 colts break but none of them had over 2000 rounds through them.  Any who I don't think you have anything to worry about. I will tell you it would make me proud to wear out a good gun, it means you got your moneys worth out of it. Never done it, but that's my theory.

[Shotgun Franklin]

I have 2 clones. I use them for 95% of my CAS shooting. I carry a clone when the weather is bad or I might be doing something that would bang the gun around.
I have 2 Colt's. I shoot them at a CAS match on occasion just to keep me familiar with'm. I use them when hunting and carry one when I'm going out on the town or traveling. When I did corporate security I carried a Colt.
To me owning 4 guns is not unreasonable.

[petrinal]

So, let me ask this question, if a clone and a 3rd gen both need work sometimes out of the box and eventually, will need rebuilding from extensive use in say CAS matches, then is the Colt really worth $700-800 more....are you really buying that much more gun for the money?  To me it doesn't sound like it from a practical standpoint or an economic one if the gun is to be used as intended or pushed to the limit in CAS matches.

yes, you are buying more gun, specially if you are a target shooter or collector.  In the COLT, The finish is much better, the case hardening is spectacular, and the rifling is different also in the  COLT, anticlockwise and very well thought for lead bullets, as the ones allowed in Historical weapons matches, far more adqueate than the Uberti´s, more thought for jacketed or very tough bullets, and that will get leaded much easier in my experience.

I had more troubles with UBERTI getting accurate loads than with COLTs or even Gauchos, a wonderful no longe made revolver.

In general, at least the old ones, have a problem: chambers are too big, not exactly rounded, and with size differences, and the bore, too small, 11,43 mm or 450", while COLTS have perfectly bored chambers of the right diameter and the bore is 11,45 mm. The Ubertis tend to developed more cracked cases, something not as common in COLTS. You can correct that by sizing only the neck..but I dont do it. Not sure if really improves accuracy.

in general small parts seem to be  more durable in the Colt in my experience. Cocking the hammer is not soft as some Uberti or Pietta clones because of a stiff spring, very adequate for accuracy, with a fast hammer fall.

with Uberti, it took me a long time of experimenting to get these loads, for competition at 25 meters,  including some failures like the load below. this revolver is just not accurate with most loads



trying and trying....with different bullets, different fillings...and same load...



until I got what I wanted,  a load that this italian revolver really likes

..6 shots, one flier, and 4 shots in the center of the O ring,  another one very close....one hand held at 25 meters, with  26 grains of 2F black Powder.





all the best

[1961MJS]

Hi

Is there a set of Pietta SAA parts that it would be a good idea to keep in the gun box?  I'm guessing that the screw that holds the pin in would be a good start.  I have a 7th Cavalry Pietta, and will almost certainly be getting a second Pietta Black Powder Frame with a shorter barrel at some point.

Thanks

[Coffinmaker]

Well ..... Not really
After 16+ years as a CAS gunsmith, there is only one "spare" part I carry.  Trigger/bolt spring.  That's it.  Pietta wisely went to the spring and plunger for the hand, rather than the original flat hand spring.  As far as screws go, I normally re-install screws with a drop of purple LocTite.  The screws are easy to remove for maintenance yet won't back out under use.  That leaves the Trigger/Bolt spring as the weakest link.  I don't personally like wire T/B springs as to me, the action feels a bit mushy.  I use the Pietta T/B spring as a light replacement when I do action work.  The Pietta spring seldom fail.  I also have gone to commercially available reduced main springs, so in the event one should fail, the user doesn't have to hunt me up for a new "tuned" spring.  I like the main spring from Lee's Gunsmithing and the reduced spring from VTI Gunparts.

Coffinmaker

[1961MJS]

Hi

I'm new to SAA's, which part on the Cimarron diagram is the Trigger/bolt spring?  I own the old black powder framed SAA.

http://www.cimarron-firearms.com/parts/revolvers/model-p-thunderer-new-sheriff-pistolero-parts.html

I found purple Loctite at Midway USA, but didn't buy any yet.  I found it odd that Loctite's website doesn't have the purple kind.  I think that Locktite is a great idea for most hard usage guns.

Thanks

Mike

[TwoWalks Baldridge]

Hi

I'm new to SAA's, which part on the Cimarron diagram is the Trigger/bolt spring?  I own the old black powder framed SAA.

http://www.cimarron-firearms.com/parts/revolvers/model-p-thunderer-new-sheriff-pistolero-parts.html

for that diagram it is part #19

[1961MJS]

Hi

thanks

Mike

[Cholla Hill Tirador]

 About a year ago I bought a used Uberti .44-40. It had obviously been slicked up and had the spring end of the bolt modified for CAS. I fitted/installed a new.44 Special cylinder and have fired a few hundred rounds with light CAS loads. I also have however fired well over 1000 loads running a 260 gr. SWC at anywhere from 850 to close to 1000 fps. She's as tight as ever and as accurate as ever.

Cholla