Iron Oxide in Vinagaroon?

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hi,

I was making up a new gallon of Vinagaroon and a friend offered up some Iron Oxide.

I have never used this product in making my Vinagaroon ... but since my source of iron has gone, it has got me womdering ...

Has anyone used Iron Oxide?

TTFN,

[bedbugbilly]

Wade - I've never used iron oxide as such . . . . in regards to not having a source anymore . . . I just throw in a pound of "common" nails into a gallon jug.  That's worked fine for me.  Yea . . . . it's cheaper if you can make a connection with a machine shop for shavings, etc.  but even though nails are getting more and more expensive - a pound isn't tat bad and in the long run, a gallon lasts a heck of a long time.  I started cooking up a batch of it before I left AZ last spring - by the time I get back, I'm sure it will be more than ready and I wouldn't be surprised if the entire lot of nails are "no more".

While on the subject - how do you get rid of the odor on the leather?  I've been using a wash of baking soda water and then set the leather out in outdoors for a spell but even after a year, I can still smell it at times - even after oiling, etc. 

[Cliff Fendley]

Steel wool works great too. Just take a torch or lighter and burn off any oil and throw a few pads in the vinegar.

I've used steel lathe turnings, nails, or steel wool and can't really tell any difference in the finished product.

[G.W. Strong]

I've been using scraps of sheet steel of the floor of my armour making workshop. If you cover the shipping I will gladly send you all the scraps you want. 

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hopalong,

I tried to send you an email aaking how much and a good address to send the check, but cascity.com could not find a "G.W." 'Hopalong' or 'Strong' and would not send you a pm ....

So send me a PM telling me how much and where to send it and I will get a check to you ....

[G.W. Strong]

Hopalong,

I tried to send you an email aaking how much and a good address to send the check, but cascity.com could not find a "G.W." 'Hopalong' or 'Strong' and would not send you a pm ....

So send me a PM telling me how much and where to send it and I will get a check to you ....

It probably because I changed it from Hopalong Strong to G.W." 'Hopalong' Strong. I will look into the problem

Just email (doug-strong@comcast.net) me your address and I will mail it out to you. Once I have sent it I can let you know what I spent.
There will be some sharp and jagged bits of metal in the box. please be careful. How much would you like? I should be spenidng time this coming week after Christmas in the shop and there should be plenty of scraps on the floor.

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hi,

I don't remember where I got the ratio, but does xix ounces of Iron shavings in a gellon of 5% Apple Cider Vinegar sound rigjt?

If so, I will need about six ounces ...

TTFN,

[Cliff Fendley]

I've only made two batches, one with steel wool and nails and the other with steel shavings from the lathe.

I just dump in a bunch of metal and after a few weeks just strain it off. I figure it will use what metal it needs.

Does vinegaroon get old or go bad? What I made a couple years ago still looks the same and even though I haven't used it on a project in about a year it tried it on a test piece and it still works.

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Cliff,

Mine had been sitting in the hundred-plus heat of a Sacramento summer ... I tried to dye some leather black and it dyed it an antique walnut .... so it is back to creation for me ....

TTFN,

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre]

Cliff,

Mine had been sitting in the hundred-plus heat of a Sacramento summer ... I tried to dye some leather black and it dyed it an antique walnut .... so it is back to creation for me ....

TTFN,

I had the same problem. While the vinagroon idea interested me, I ultimatly went back to oil dye.

[ChuckBurrows]

If you're not getting a good black with vinegar black than the leather you are using is most probably low in tannins (it's the reaction between the tannins in the leather and the iron in solution that gives the color) the fix is easy - add some tannins  -  a strong brew of cheap black tea (Lipton, Great Value, etc.) will give you the black - apply either before or after the vinegar blacking. Also do a baking soda wash after - this sets and intensifies the black.

As for will it go bad - in over 40 years of using vinegar blacking I've never had a batch go "bad" - in fact I usually just add the left overs of the previous batch to the new one. re: the amount of iron/steel - keep adding it until there is no more reaction and/or there's a lot of sludge in the bottom. At that point either add more vinegar or decant/filter the liquid off and then start a new batch with the sludge - and yes iron oxide should work just fine........like Cliff I generally use steel wool to make mine (mostly my wore out stuff) and while I generally recommend burning/cleaning off the oil I have made a bunch of batches with brand new out of the bag steel wool without getting rid of the oil and it has worked fine with no problems.

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre]

If you're not getting a good black with vinegar black than the leather you are using is most probably low in tannins (it's the reaction between the tannins in the leather and the iron in solution that gives the color) the fix is easy - add some tannins  -  a strong brew of cheap black tea (Lipton, Great Value, etc.) will give you the black - apply either before or after the vinegar blacking. Also do a baking soda wash after - this sets and intensifies the black.

Sounds kinda not worth the effort.

[ChuckBurrows]

Sorry but IMO it is well worth the little extra effort - you get a dyed black leather that will NEVER rub off unlike even the best black commercial dyes and in the last 50 years I have never seen any black dye that doesn't rub off at some time  (other than some used with acrylic type finishes)....Dying is work no matter what and I'd much rather add a bit of tea than have to sit and rub off the surface leavings of the commercial dyes...plus there is NO exposure to the toxic chemicals used in the spirit based dyes, which includes the oil dyes (that contain no oil BTW)

[bedbugbilly]

Follow Chuck's advice . . . . I've never had a problem with the leather I've used not almost instantly going black with my vinegaroon . . . but on an old thread . . . and I think it probably was a post by Chuck . . . I tried the tea just for fun.  Easy enough to pick up a box at a $1 store . . . doesn't take long to brew, let cool and apply . . . and it DOES help!

I also have no "formula" for it . . . I just dump some common nails into  gallon jug of vinegar and let it set and do it's stuff.  I've never had any "go bad" . . . . and I know that vinegar (plain) will get "mother" in it if it sets too long but for some reason, the vinegaroon doesn't.  I'm not a chemist but I would imagine there's an explanation for it. 

The only thing I keep asking when vinegaroon comes up is in regards to the smell . . . I'll ask it again.  I dye with it, use the baking soda wash to set/neutralize . . . but, . . . even after letting it set out side in the beautiful Arizona weather and oiling afterwards . . . my stuff still retains a vinegar odor for a long time . . . . . what is the cure for that?  Is there something I could be using to help eliminate that vinegar odor?  I realize it's the dye but some folks are put off by it.  Any suggestions?  Thanks.

[Cliff Fendley]

I have almost two gallon mixed up from my first experiment with it two plus years ago so if it doesn't go bad it will last me forever. It doesn't take much to turn the leather black.

[TwoWalks Baldridge]

my stuff still retains a vinegar odor for a long time . . . . . what is the cure for that?  Is there something I could be using to help eliminate that vinegar odor?  I realize it's the dye but some folks are put off by it.  Any suggestions?  Thanks.

Have you tried adding Garlic to it, probably won't eliminate the smell but it might smell more like pizza and attract folks.   

I have the same problem with mine and it often is weeks before the smell fades.

[jhinaz]

Is there something I could be using to help eliminate that vinegar odor? 

FWIW, my experience making vinegaroon has only been two batches over the past two years, but the leather has not had a vinegar smell to it. I followed the recipe of "one de-greased '0000' steel wool pad to one quart of vinegar; let it 'work' outside in the heat/sun for 2 weeks, then remove the lid and let it set in a cool place a few days until no odor remains."

I read all the information on vinegaroon that I can, and some of that information is:
As the brew matures, the vinegar gets 'used up'; as the vinegar gets used up, the vinegar odor disappears. 

If your vinegaroon still smells like vinegar perhaps you could add some more iron to it and let it brew some more. - John

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Good advice, Jhinaz. I've made mine the same way except I leave the lid loose while it brews and never had any vinegar smell. I use white vinegar, for what that's worth.

Welcome to the forum.  Looking forward to your posts.

[Red Cent]

WadWatsonEllis, I gotta say htis. First this is an informative post for a newbie. Second, when I first went and looked vinagaroon up on the net, all I could find was scorpions and weird creatures .

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=vinegroon&qpvt=vinegroon&FORM=IGRE

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hi,

First thank you very much for the complement ... *S*

You might have better luck with Vinagaroon here:

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,11991.0.html

And as for Nasties, how about this:

http://www.camelspiders.net/