44 special black powder loads

Tracker · June 27, 2012, 01:30:21 AM

Hey partners,

I'm after some load data for the .44 special using black powder. I've been using Trailboss, which is great

but I kinda want to get that boom and cloud of smoke, which of course was all there was back in the old west. I'm currently using starline brass, winchester large pistol primers and 185grain cast lead bullets, also have some 3F black powder.

Many thanks!

Blackpowder Burn · June 27, 2012, 07:08:37 AM

Tracker,

You'll need a bullet designed to carry a lot of lube, and the lube needs to be a soft, non-petroleum based type, such as SPG, etc. A good bullet design are those produced by Dick Dastardly's Big Lube molds. (www.biglube.com). You can also purchase the bullets cast and lubed from Springfield Slim (http://hstrial-mwhyte2.homestead.com/). You can't use commercial bullets lubed with the hard, waxy type lubes, as they'll make an unholy mess of hard deposits in the bore of your guns. If you'll use a fairly soft bullet (about 20:1) alloy and lots of lube, you'll find you have no fouling issues.

Then just fill the case with enough powder so that the bullet slightly compresses it, and you're done. Loading BP is really a simple process.

rifle · June 27, 2012, 08:19:35 AM

Using a thin lube pill under the bullet can save on getting a mould from Big Lube Bullets......or use the lube pill until the mould is delivered. Lube like SPG is a good one and is soft and soft works better but......in hot weather adding a little paraffin wax or beeswax to the SPG can keep the lube from migrating from leaching the lube from the wax inside the case.
Mix some SPG with some paraffin in a double boiler or even carfully in a microwave and pour boiling water in a flat pan then pour some melted hot lube on the hot water. When the lube wax hardens on the water that'll cool you'll have a thin sheet of lube/wax that's uniform in thickness and can be made rather thin. Punched out of the wax/lube sheet with a homemade punch made from brass tube. Just lube any regular bullet or....use a commercial bullet even if it has the hard lube on it and when loading place a lube pill right on the powder. Then seat the bullet.
I like to use pure lead in this type load. I figure that's what they used back in the day and the pure lead seals gas well. Shoots well. Expands when it hits. Imparts more "Lethal" to the bullet.
The FFg powder is better for cartridges and is the norm in them. FFFg can be used but is a little more erratic in the SD department and can raise pressures . FFFg is pistol powder but that pertains to percussions more than cartridge. Sure the FFFg can give some extra vel. but it doesn't seem to be as accurate.

Dick Dastardly · June 27, 2012, 08:49:45 AM

Howdy Tracker,

Welcome to the land of the fire, smoke and freedom. This is a good place to hang out.

Mav Dutchman designed exactly the bullet needed for trouble free accurate shooting with the 44 Special loaded with black powder. I bought my first Mav Dutchman mold from ol Mav, himself. He was located in a former gas station "hard by the side of the road" in Calhoun, Louisiana. I've been shooting Mav Dutchman bullets for SASS matches ever since. Mav Dutchman is one of the founding designers of Big Lube®LLC bullets.

The Mav Dutchman bullets drop at .432" and easily size down as far as .427". They now have a deeper crimp grove that is not wiped out by sizing down. They weigh 200 grains cast from Lyman #2 alloy.

I've loaded thousands or rounds of 44 Special black powder ammo with these bullets and have found FFFg to give great performance, clean burning, easy clean up and fine accuracy. Currently, I'm using Schuetzen FFFg black powder and am very pleased with it. For primers, I use Winchester WLP primers, but any good large pistol primer will do your work, unless you have such light tricked out hammer springs that only the softest primers work.

Currently I'm shooting more 44 ELR (Extra Long Russian), or 44 Magnum for those in Rio Linda. I load them the same as I load 44 Specials. I compress the powder about 1/8" with the lube/sized Big Lube bullet as I seat it. I use this same 1/8" of compression on all my pistol caliber black powder ammo and it works great for me.

Email me at dckrhody@gmail.com if you have any questions.

Respectfully yours,

DD-MDA

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · June 27, 2012, 09:30:54 AM

Welcome to the Darkside; Thats where the good guys hang out ?

Read through The Dark Arts. It is a child board found at the top of the Darksiders Den, but here`s the link;

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/board,82.0.html

One of the threads is a link to GOEX data. Blackpowder loading is different than smokeless, but simpler. Fill up the case so a loaded bullet compresses the powder about 1/16 to 1/8 inch. Use a BP compatible lube like SPG and avoid using heavy petroleum oils on your firarm. Almost everything else is a refinement.

PJ Hardtack · June 27, 2012, 10:09:04 AM

rifle

I'm going to try your method to make some lube wads. Up to now I've been dipping felt wads in the lube and putting them on a wax sheet to dry, but they get quite 'fat'.
I think I'll use beeswax rather than paraffin. My cap & ball lube is a stiff mix of beeswax and olive oil. Doesn't melt away in warm weather.

Tracker · June 27, 2012, 09:38:43 PM

Ok, thanks very much everyone!

I will attempt to make some of these! Can't wait to try them out

Tracker · July 01, 2012, 10:21:21 PM

Hey pards,

Would this be a good load to try out? See attached pic

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · July 02, 2012, 11:00:51 AM

Quote from: Tracker on July 01, 2012, 10:21:21 PM
Hey pards,

Would this be a good load to try out? See attached pic

Yep! Thats the idea. Lighter bullets give less recoil, and strike lower on the target. Before settling on a bullet, try out several with different weights. The .44 Spl was designed around a 240 grain bullet, and accuracy may vary with different bullet weights. See my post above, you have to fit the blackpowder load to the bullet seating depth. Generally more bullet = less powder, but do keep that bit of compression.

Abilene · July 02, 2012, 11:58:11 AM

Keep in mind that anytime you have a lube wad just below the bullet, it might stick to the bullet and affect accuracy. That is why some folks will use something like another thin cardboard wad or a wax paper wad between bullet and lube wad, but that is just another step to go through.

cpt dan blodgett · July 02, 2012, 12:29:51 PM

A lube cookie could be used in place of the lube wad and as others have said some put wax paper or something between the lube whatever and the bullet.

Make a few shoot them to see how they work.

Tracker · July 02, 2012, 06:08:15 PM

Ok, thanks for those tips guys! Hopefully I'll be able to make a few up in the next couple of days!

Steel Horse Bailey · July 04, 2012, 01:14:21 AM

Tracker, you've got good advice here, pard.

Give the REAL Gunpowder a try. You'll find that while different, BP loading IS simpler, as Sir Chas has mentioned. Cleanup is easier, and after you get the hang of it, faster too. But a LOT messier. Just remember, anything you use that contains good ol' H2O is the right cleaning fluid. Lots of us use Moosemilk, which is a lovely ('tho stinky) mix of from 5-10 parts water to one part Ballistol "oil." (It's not a petroleum product, but is a mineral oil mix or something close.) WATER is the secret ingredient that will neutralize the "salts" (residue) left behind on your guns and brass cases after firing, and left untreated, that residue is what can rust up a fine piece of precision machinery if not taken care of after a good session of shooting.

I'd also emphasize (like the others) the GREAT importance of a good lubricant that is BP friendly, like SPG or many of the homemade lubes we shooters use. Mine is a mix (basically) of Beeswax and Olive Oil. It keeps the barrel & action fouling soft between shots so the residue doesn't harden up which guarantees a loss of accuracy, on a grand scale - if it's bad enough.

Welcome to the Darkside!

Tracker · July 04, 2012, 02:05:11 AM

Quote from: Steel Horse Bailey on July 04, 2012, 01:14:21 AM
Tracker, you've got good advice here, pard.

Give the REAL Gunpowder a try. You'll find that while different, BP loading IS simpler, as Sir Chas has mentioned. Cleanup is easier, and after you get the hang of it, faster too. But a LOT messier. Just remember, anything you use that contains good ol' H2O is the right cleaning fluid. Lots of us use Moosemilk, which is a lovely ('tho stinky) mix of from 5-10 parts water to one part Ballistol "oil." (It's not a petroleum product, but is a mineral oil mix or something close.) WATER is the secret ingredient that will neutralize the "salts" (residue) left behind on your guns and brass cases after firing, and left untreated, that residue is what can rust up a fine piece of precision machinery if not taken care of after a good session of shooting.

I'd also emphasize (like the others) the GREAT importance of a good lubricant that is BP friendly, like SPG or many of the homemade lubes we shooters use. Mine is a mix (basically) of Beeswax and Olive Oil. It keeps the barrel & action fouling soft between shots so the residue doesn't harden up which guarantees a loss of accuracy, on a grand scale - if it's bad enough.

Welcome to the Darkside!

Cheers pard! I really appreciate all the helpful advice you fine folk have given me I've already got some SPG lube and some ballistol. I'll have another update once I've fired some of them off

w44wcf · July 04, 2012, 08:52:06 AM

Tracker,
If you're using a handgun, no lube cookie is needed just some good b.p. lube.

If your using a rifle then additional lube capacity would be required.....lube cookie or the Mav-D "Big Lube" bullet.

Have fun!
w44wcf

Driftwood Johnson · July 04, 2012, 06:51:01 PM

Howdy

Pour in the powder. Then put a card wad to keep the lube cookie from contaminating the powder.Then put on the lube cookie. Then put in something else, like wax paper or another card wad to keep the lube from sticking to the bullet. Yeah, I used to do all that. What a lot of work! Then I saw the light and started using Big Lube bullets. No lube cookie needed, the bullet carries plenty of lube. None of that extra stuff needed inside either. Much less work.

By the way, yes, a soft lube cookie will stick to a bullet and cause it to wobble like a lopsided dart. Been there, done that.

Choose your poison. Do all that extra work, or just pour in the powder, then seat and crimp a bullet. Your choice. You don't have to cast them yourself, Dick's page has links to several casters who will cast and lube Big Lube bullets for you.

Tracker · July 04, 2012, 07:38:14 PM

Howdy,

I've made up 10 loads for testing, now just got to get to the range

I'll see how these ones turn out, should be lots of fun! Yep, I will have to look at getting some big lube bullets when I get around to producing these on a larger scale

Tracker · July 15, 2012, 05:55:13 PM

Howdy folks,

I've finally had a chance to test the bp loads and they work great!

very satisfying deep boom, big cloud of smoke, about a foot or orange muzzle blast. Great fun! And, no recoil either! I'll have to make some more of these asap!

Thanks everyone for all your help!

Tracker

fourfingersofdeath · July 16, 2012, 05:28:07 AM

The advantages of the big lube bullets far out weight any other consideration. Card wads, lube cookies or wads, etc, PITA.

Enough black to allow a bit of compression, a Big Lube boolit (I wipe the bases of mine as I pick them up to seat them). Easy peasy, I store loaded rounds nose down to be sure, but that is probably not necessary. Clean up with a bore snake and moose milk. Simple, well worth the bucks for the mould.

G.W. Strong · July 20, 2012, 09:46:06 AM

I am a huge fan of .44 special and Dick's Big Lube bullets. They are so easy to load for and they shoot true. I've never had fouling in any of my barrels since I started using his bullets. As said above, if you are not a caster then there are those who will make them for you. Give them a try. You will not be sorry.