Vetterli help?

Started by River City John, March 26, 2012, 08:20:00 AM

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River City John

March 26, 2012, 08:20:00 AM
I have the opportunity to pick up a converted-to-centerfire Vetterli. I have always been fascinated by their look.

Has anyone some guidance or info for me?
I have read that both .348 Winchester and 8mm Lebel cases could be modified, and Lee has a mold for a .341? I'm going to assume it would be a black powder arm?

RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

JimBob

#1
March 26, 2012, 11:03:50 AM
Here's a site with some info on the rifles and some on cartridge making you might check out.

River City John

#2
March 26, 2012, 04:14:03 PM
Quote from: JimBob on March 26, 2012, 11:03:50 AM
Here's a site with some info on the rifles and some on cartridge making you might check out.

Link did not copy, JimBob.

RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

Drydock

#4
March 26, 2012, 07:47:54 PM
THe Lee 338 mold usualy drops right around .340.

http://leeprecision.com/bullet-casting/rifle-bullet-molds/bullet-mold-double-cavity

However, I suspect you really meant .430?  In which case the Lee 430-310 gas check should be just right.
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

River City John

#5
March 26, 2012, 08:18:17 PM
Probably the .430. Found an article that the author uses the same slug he loads in his .44magnum revolver.
Also uses another source that casts a .44 320 gr. sized to .431. Buffalo Arms sells converted Winchester .348 brass, although kinda pricey.

Oh well, I'm bit hard.

Educate me on why and wherefore of gas checks . . . article does not mention the use of gas checks at all. Here I was hoping it was as easy as loading the case full of Black Powder, seating and crimping then shooting and smiling.

RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

pony express

#6
March 26, 2012, 08:25:15 PM
I have no personal experience with them, but from what I've read, the loading can be a bit tricky to get right. The overall length is critical, since it doesn't have a cartridge stop, like a '73 Winchester. I suggest searching on SurplusRifleforum, there's quite a bit there on them. One member, NormSutton, posts lots of detail abouty them.

River City John

#7
March 26, 2012, 08:30:04 PM
I also read the history and seems it was never used in any wartime action. I guess I'd have to be very free-lance portrayal, such as an infantryman in the service of the Duchy of Grand Fenwick or similar.


RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

pony express

#8
March 26, 2012, 10:35:16 PM
I haven't had a chance to look anything up yet(trying to do taxes). I seem to remember problems with gettingt the right bullet to stabilize, while still being able to load it to the proper overall length. Some were experimenting with varing the case length, to get it to work with the available bullets.

If you use one in a match, you could change the line at the beginning of every stage to something like"Don't shoot, I'm NEUTRAL!!

Delmonico

#9
March 27, 2012, 08:57:50 AM
Quote from: River City John on March 26, 2012, 08:30:04 PM
I also read the history and seems it was never used in any wartime action. I guess I'd have to be very free-lance portrayal, such as an infantryman in the service of the Duchy of Grand Fenwick or similar.


RCJ

How about an Ensign in the Swiss Navy?

BTW, Jules Sandoz a Swiss native and father of author Marie Sandoz, imported dozens of those into Nebraska in the 1890's for resale to other settlers.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

RattlesnakeJack

#10
March 27, 2012, 03:36:44 PM
Quote from: River City John on March 26, 2012, 08:30:04 PMI also read the history and seems it was never used in any wartime action. I guess I'd have to be very free-lance portrayal, such as an infantryman in the service of the Duchy of Grand Fenwick or similar.
John:

Assuming you are speaking of the Swiss Vetterli rifle, that was because Switzerland was never an aggressor, and nobody seems to have reckless enough to try to invade!



On the other hand, if it is an Italian Vetterli you have a chance to get ..... I think you'd look quite impressive in a uniform like this!

Rattlesnake Jack Robson, Scout, Rocky Mountain Rangers, North West Canada, 1885
Major John M. Robson, Royal Scots of Canada, 1883-1901
Sgt. John Robson, Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, 1885
Bvt. Col, Commanding International Dept. and Div.  of Canada, Grand Army of the Frontier

pony express

#11
March 27, 2012, 05:42:27 PM
Since it's a "converted to centerfire" one, then it's Swiss, Italians were always centerfire. Completely different design, about the only thing in common is the appearence of the back end of the bolt.

River City John

#12
March 27, 2012, 06:16:50 PM
Quote from: Delmonico on March 27, 2012, 08:57:50 AM
How about an Ensign in the Swiss Navy?

BTW, Jules Sandoz a Swiss native and father of author Marie Sandoz, imported dozens of those into Nebraska in the 1890's for resale to other settlers.

Then I'll be a Nebraska farmer with his Vetterli and Colt Open Top . . .

You'll send me link to that documentation, of course.

RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

River City John

#13
March 27, 2012, 06:21:18 PM
It's Swiss, 10.4 X 38R.
The Italian's all seemed to be 10.4 X 47R.

RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

Delmonico

#14
March 27, 2012, 07:05:43 PM
Quote from: River City John on March 27, 2012, 06:16:50 PM
Then I'll be a Nebraska farmer with his Vetterli and Colt Open Top . . .

You'll send me link to that documentation, of course.

RCJ

I'll see if I can find my copy of Old Jules by Marie Sandoz, that's where I got it.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

G.W. Strong

#15
March 27, 2012, 07:15:16 PM
Quote from: River City John on March 26, 2012, 08:30:04 PM
I guess I'd have to be very free-lance portrayal, such as an infantryman in the service of the Duchy of Grand Fenwick or similar.

I'm not sure about that. As I recall the Duchy of Grand Fenwick was still armed in a medieval fashion well into the 20th century. This may have changed somewhat since the appointment of High Constable Tully Bascomb.  ;)

George Washington "Hopalong" Strong
Grand Army of the Frontier #774, (Bvt.) Colonel commanding the Department of the Missouri.
SASS #91251
Good Guy's Posse & Bristol Plains Pistoleros
NCOWS #3477
Sweetwater Regulators

River City John

#16
March 27, 2012, 07:26:28 PM
 ;)

Well, they do have the absolute best nuclear device obtainable. One that is broken and doesn't work.


RCJ
"I was born by the river in a little tent, and just like the river I've been running ever since." - Sam Cooke
"He who will not look backward with reverence, will not look forward with hope." - Edmund Burke
". . .freedom is not everything or the only thing, perhaps we will put that discovery behind us and comprehend, before it's too late, that without freedom all else is nothing."- G. Warren Nutter
NCOWS #L146
GAF #275

Drydock

#17
March 27, 2012, 07:30:39 PM
You could always be a Swiss Guardsman.  Though you always see them with their halberds, they have always kept rifles close by, and they were used in anger during the Italian unification. Too early for Vetterli's, but the idea is there.

I personaly like the Duchy of Grand Fenwick idea myself.  Limited only by your imagination.  Did'nt Grand Fenwick have a Navy?  A lake along one border, with a boat perhaps, armed with surplus Vetterli's?   ;D
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

G.W. Strong

#18
March 27, 2012, 08:58:13 PM
Imagine the possibilities for ducal uniforms!
George Washington "Hopalong" Strong
Grand Army of the Frontier #774, (Bvt.) Colonel commanding the Department of the Missouri.
SASS #91251
Good Guy's Posse & Bristol Plains Pistoleros
NCOWS #3477
Sweetwater Regulators

Delmonico

#19
March 27, 2012, 10:24:45 PM
I think a sodbuster up along the Runningwater in Nebraska would still be the best bet. 

http://www.northshire.com/siteinfo/bookinfo/9780803293243/0/
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.
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