Racing up a Uberti 1873 Short Rifle

[SPQR476]

Gotcha now.  Yes...the whole '73 action work world is confusing.  Cocking/cycling geometry changed by either new links or changes in lever geometry, and all the other necessary, but not mentioned changes that must occur for it all to run right.  Positive slam down, no positive slam down...how the heck does this thing headspace? Over center or not over center?  It is indeed enough to get confusing fast.  Done right, good work can make you wonder how uberti let it leave the factory the way they did.

Regardless of other considerations, one of these days, I'll likely get myself a Codymatic.  I like to learn, but I also appreciate good craftsmanship by others.  Same reason I got Rugers from Jim...I've done a lot of Rugers in my day, but I don't have the tools to do forcing cones, etc., at the house, and doggone if its not nice to pick up a silky smooth six gun without having to mess with it, and a solid name standing behind it.

I guess the whole point of what I was trying to say is that, if you are going to go "full race", although I went DIY for reasons of my own, it's not simple, and not very cost effective compared to options from established craftsmen. 

[PJ Hardtack]

I'm making a list of the things I want done on my Uberti 1 of 1,000. I've read so much stuff on the net that I'm in the paralysis of analysis. There are simply too many 'experts' out there.

So far it comes down to lightening the lever safety plunger spring, trigger spring and the lever springs. I'm happy with the hammer fall as it is as it creeps me out to watch the slo' mo' hammer on some 'tuned' guns I've handled.
All the gobble-de-gook about 'timing' the action goes right over my head. I didn't realize that a lever action rifle can have 'timing' issues like a revolver and that 'headspace' was also an issue.  If things don't happen in proper sequence, a) the rifle won't feed b) it won't go "Bang!".

My B-92s, Henry, '66, '86 and '94 are functioning quite well and have never been worked on over the years I've had them. Of course they don't all have toggle link actions.

I've watched a pal actually bend the lever of his Uberti '73 in .38 Spl. after it gibbled following a 'tuning' job. He's a rigger/boilermaker by trade and is a bear of a man.
The problem turned out to be his ammo, but it made me leery of 'tuned' '73s.

[Red Cent]

PJ, I dare to say that all the top shooters have a '73 and all (I think ) are shortstroked to some degree.

A tuning of the '73 actually removes all the slop out of the action and that makes some things happen differently than the way it is set up at the factory. Most are minor requiring just a tad of "fitting".

My '73 was done 12-13 years ago sports the "original" shortstroke. The latest, which in my opinion, goes to over leverage. You can feel the hammer resistance way more than mine but that is because they are getting close to the point of final diminhing returns.

[PJ Hardtack]

Well, the "top shooters" can hot rod their '73s to their heart's content. Mine is going to get minimal work, more to smooth function than anything else.

It just doesn't compute in my conservative brain to do things to a historic design for any alleged benefit measured in fractions of an inch for milliseconds in time. Especially since I mainly shoot "Frontiersman" class with cap & ball.

[Old Top]

PJ

I beleive that your 66 has the same inners as the 73 as it is a toggle action also.

Old Top

[Red Cent]

Old Top, he addressed that item.

".......they don't all have toggle link actions."

[TheOtherLeft]

Gradually, I learned that every decision you make on a '73 affects other dimensions and decisions.

In other words, it's not a linear process, but one that must be done with the end product in mind.

Even a simple fitting of lifter and lever springs requires a goal and the dimensions for achieving it.

How does a simple thing like fitting new lifter springs affect other parts of the rifle?

Reason I ask is I have an unmodified 1873 and want to DIY install the PGW Action Springs and Coiled Lever Safety Spring. The installation looks pretty straight forward and I can't see if affecting any other geometry or timing etc. All it does is change the spring pressure doesn't it??? I think the Action Springs would be worth it as I can feel the resistance when starting to lift the elevator when I cycle and it isn't smooth.

[PJ Hardtack]

I'm interested in this as well since my '73 is in the hands of a 'smith right now.

This thread needs to be moved to the '73 forum, n'est-ce pas?

[Pettifogger]

How does a simple thing like fitting new lifter springs affect other parts of the rifle?

Reason I ask is I have an unmodified 1873 and want to DIY install the PGW Action Springs and Coiled Lever Safety Spring. The installation looks pretty straight forward and I can't see if affecting any other geometry or timing etc. All it does is change the spring pressure doesn't it??? I think the Action Springs would be worth it as I can feel the resistance when starting to lift the elevator when I cycle and it isn't smooth.

Changing springs does not alter action geometry.  Depending on the brand, sometimes the springs may need some minor fitting to clear everything, but the action geometry does not change.  For a stock 73 the best things you can do are:  put in a lighter mainspring, replace the carrier and lifter springs, and replace the trigger safety spring.

[TheOtherLeft]

Changing springs does not alter action geometry.  Depending on the brand, sometimes the springs may need some minor fitting to clear everything, but the action geometry does not change.  For a stock 73 the best things you can do are:  put in a lighter mainspring, replace the carrier and lifter springs, and replace the trigger safety spring.

WOW, Pettifogger is there anything you don't know about Uberti's, Rugers......?

I intend on buying PGW carrier/lifter springs and trigger safety spring but am not sure about the lighter mainspring. I'm not a fan of thinning/grinding out the factory mainspring and there's been some bad reviews of PGW mainspring replacement wearing out.

What mainspring replacement would you recommend?

[Pettifogger]

WOW, Pettifogger is there anything you don't know about Uberti's, Rugers......?

I intend on buying PGW carrier/lifter springs and trigger safety spring but am not sure about the lighter mainspring. I'm not a fan of thinning/grinding out the factory mainspring and there's been some bad reviews of PGW mainspring replacement wearing out.

What mainspring replacement would you recommend?

I've tried a couple of after market springs and didn't like them.  I have always ground AND polished my own.  (You have to polish out the grinding marks otherwise they create spots where the spring can break.)  Since I have the tools, it is only a ten minute job and I have never had one fail and quit looking for an aftermarket spring.  Maybe there are some good ones out there, but I haven't looked in a while.

[Red Cent]

The old hourglass trick.
Actually, some '73 shooters will loosen the the end screw on the tail end of the hammer mainspring allmost all the way, drop a drop of Locktite on it, and adjust the hammer with the tension screw. Load a round and attempt to fire. Tighten til it goes bang and maybe a 1/4 more. Changes the geometrics a lot. Like all soft springs, it will slow the hammer.

All my '73 have these springs in them.

http://www.thesmithshop.com/springkits.html

[TheOtherLeft]

I've tried a couple of after market springs and didn't like them.  I have always ground AND polished my own.  (You have to polish out the grinding marks otherwise they create spots where the spring can break.)  Since I have the tools, it is only a ten minute job and I have never had one fail and quit looking for an aftermarket spring.  Maybe there are some good ones out there, but I haven't looked in a while.

Would a dremel and grinding/polishing tips be adequate for lightening the mainspring? I assume the correct grade sandpaper would need a month of Sundays to get the same effect.

[Red Cent]

A good sharp file and some sandpaper will do. You do not want to get the spring very hot. You can use the Dremel (known as the gunsmith retirement tool:))  and keep some cold water for dippin' ever so often.

The 'smith that did mine did not remove much if any from the flats. He worked the sides to the shape of hourglass. Not sharp curves but running almost the full length of the spring. As Pettifogger said, you need to polish all the sand and Dremel marks off the metal. When you file, continous strokes and in the same direction helps. Do not file crossways. Matter of fact, my loading port springs are hourglassed. The 45 Colt Border Deluxe has been running with the same contured speings since 2001. The 38s since about 2003.

[TheOtherLeft]

I've tried a couple of after market springs and didn't like them.  I have always ground AND polished my own.  (You have to polish out the grinding marks otherwise they create spots where the spring can break.)  Since I have the tools, it is only a ten minute job and I have never had one fail and quit looking for an aftermarket spring.  Maybe there are some good ones out there, but I haven't looked in a while.

How much material do you take off the flats of the mainspring? From various pics it looks to be about 1/2. Is that correct?

I was thinking about removing about 1/3 of the material so it's lighter but still reliable???

[SPQR476]

It's fit and try.  If you've seen photos of professionally modified springs, that's as good a guide as any.  Go slow and check.  Cool often.  Do not leave any sharp corners in the hourglass shape, and as others have said, no grind lines left on, either.  You'll end up with a weak spot.