Let's talk saddle bags.

[G.W. Strong]

I am portraying a light artillery man in the year 1888 at Ft. Douglas, Utah. I beleive light artillery men were mounted troops at this time. If so, that suggests saddle bags. Is this correct? If so, would they differ from the ones used by cavalry troops? If not, can anyone point me to good pictures of authentic surviving examples?

[liten]

 shoudnt you be talk,n about geting a  cannon!!

[FTrooper]

As a 1st Sgt. you would have had your own horse and full "cavalry" tack.  Saddle bags for your time period are some of the same issues we have with the rest of your stuff...lol.  In 1885 a new and improved saddle bag was introduced.  These would have started to be seen by about 1887, and truthfully, and maybe later for Artillery.

These new bags were based on an experimental series of bags from 1879 that pretty much looked the same, I know the M1879's were made of canvas and may have also been leather like the '85's, but that book is in storage right now...sorry.  Being experimental makes it doubtful to be in the hands of Artillery.

Before that is the M1874's.  Again, a trooper in 1885 looks very different from 1888, as 1885-1887 sees the transitioning in of all the 1881-1885 pattern equipments.

There is also a special knapsack for light artillery that little is known about, its a special project of mine to find out what it was.  I have an original from 1908.  Basically it is the exact same thing as the Civil War "double bag" knapsack from 1853/55 except at some point they stopped painting the canvas black and the suspenders were replaced by a suitcase style carrying strap.  Exactly when these two modifications were done, I have not pinpointed.  This bag was issued to men NOT mounted on horses (so usually corporals and privates) and carried strapped to the limbers.

Chris Fischer
F-Troop

[G.W. Strong]

Before that is the M1874's.  Again, a trooper in 1885 looks very different from 1888, as 1885-1887 sees the transitioning in of all the 1881-1885 pattern equipments.

There is no reason the 1888 date needs to be the terminus of my career. I may play with that date by a year or two either way. 1885 might be better for uniform and equiptment. Since I will be working on multiple sets of gear for different points in my life I can see what works best.

I think my next full kit will be something to go with my 1870 trapdoor in 50/70.

What pistol would go with that? I have a Richards 1860 Army conversion and I have a Colt 1872 open top. Would either of those be appropriate for the very early 1870s artilleryman?

[G.W. Strong]

As a 1st Sgt. you would have had your own horse and full "cavalry" tack.  Saddle bags for your time period are some of the same issues we have with the rest of your stuff...lol.  In 1885 a new and improved saddle bag was introduced.  These would have started to be seen by about 1887, and truthfully, and maybe later for Artillery.

These new bags were based on an experimental series of bags from 1879 that pretty much looked the same, I know the M1879's were made of canvas and may have also been leather like the '85's, but that book is in storage right now...sorry.  Being experimental makes it doubtful to be in the hands of Artillery.

Before that is the M1874's.  Again, a trooper in 1885 looks very different from 1888, as 1885-1887 sees the transitioning in of all the 1881-1885 pattern equipments.

There is also a special knapsack for light artillery that little is known about, its a special project of mine to find out what it was.  I have an original from 1908.  Basically it is the exact same thing as the Civil War "double bag" knapsack from 1853/55 except at some point they stopped painting the canvas black and the suspenders were replaced by a suitcase style carrying strap.  Exactly when these two modifications were done, I have not pinpointed.  This bag was issued to men NOT mounted on horses (so usually corporals and privates) and carried strapped to the limbers.

Chris Fischer
F-Troop

Should I be studying up on the M1874 saddle bag then?

[FTrooper]

I am thinking the M1874 bags may be best, but let me find the book and see what it says about the 1879 era stuff.

As for 1870's pistols, to be honest you'd probably still be carrying a cap and ball as an artilleryman as late as 1874 or 1875.  In reality the Richard's conversions were not that common and the M1872 was rare in Army hands.  Most units went straight from unconverted M1863 Remingtons to M1873 Colts...BUT since this hobby leans more towards the need of a cartridge gun, if it were ME, I'd go with the conversion of a M1860 personally.

On an above note, I have some correspondence from Co. C, 2nd Cavalry in the early 1870's requisition new pistols, specifically they wanted the new Colts that fire brass cartridges, what they got was a new shipment of the same cap and ball Remingtons they already had!  Obviously the Company Commander was not pleased.

Chris Fischer
F-Troop

[G.W. Strong]

I am thinking the M1874 bags may be best, but let me find the book and see what it says about the 1879 era stuff.

Are you talking about the M1879 Whitman Saddle Bags?

[FTrooper]

Yeah, they basically developed into the M1885.  I know they were made in canvas (and that is an awesome looking bag) but I can't recall if they were made in leather before 1885.  Man I hate old age and too much information in my head!  

Chris, I Think My Name Is, Fischer
F-Troop

[Tascosa Joe]

Here is a link to a good picture of the M1879 Experimental Canvas bag.  http://www.cowanauctions.com/auctions/past-item.aspx?ItemId=78457

T-Joe

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Hoppy, Cabelas sells a set of bags that could easily be modified to look like the 1879-1885 bags you all are talking about:

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Triple-K-Cavalry-Saddle-Bags-and-Bag-Liner/706729.uts?Ntk=AllProducts&searchPath=%2Fcatalog%2Fsearch.cmd%3Fform_state%3DsearchForm%26N%3D0%26fsch%3Dtrue%26Ntk%3DAllProducts%26Ntt%3Dsaddle%2Bbags%26x%3D20%26y%3D7%26WTz_l%3DHeader%253BSearch-All%2BProducts&Ntt=saddle+bags&WTz_l=Header%3BSearch-All+Products


The brass strap protector is oval and larger on the original (look right above the cover flap) and the small pocket and US embossed oval would need to be added, but I think it's do-able.  I bought a set of the Triple K bags from Cabelas about 10 or 12 years ago and they're still going strong.  I also bought the canvas liner, which snaps in and has internal pockets.  Mine was less than $110 when I bought them, so you can see where the prices are going.  The leather of mine is VERY stiff, even after I rubbed soaked mine using a LOT of Olive Oil.  (It's not just for BP lube ... and spaghetti  )  If you look at the reviews, there are 24  and NONE were below a 4-star rating.  (5 possible)

I was going to link you to some but I saw it's the same ones that Tascosa Joe linked to.  I sure wish MINE were the same colour as the ones he linked to!  They're awesome ... but at nearly a Grand, well ... you know!  I sure wouldn't use THEM! 

I have a traveling tool & cleaning kit roll that I carry on the outside of my bags.  It's too big to go inside and would hog all the room of one side, but it makes a nice roll about 4"- 4 1/2" that I tie over the R side flap - I added a brass grommet on the other side of their oval strap grommet and I have a couple pieces of latigo "string" looped & tied that stay with the bags whether I have the tool-roll or not.  I'll bet that the oval grommet like the originals have is available somewhere and having a pocket added would be no special trick to someone who makes their own footwear (you do, right!) so really, I think that the oval US would probably be the most difficult part of converting the Cabela's bags to Cavalry bags!  (And if you DO find a big oval US tool, let me know and you could emboss MINE, too!  Please!)

[G.W. Strong]

Hoppy, Cabelas sells a set of bags that could easily be modified to look like the 1879-1885 bags you all are talking about:

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Triple-K-Cavalry-Saddle-Bags-and-Bag-Liner/706729.uts?Ntk=AllProducts&searchPath=%2Fcatalog%2Fsearch.cmd%3Fform_state%3DsearchForm%26N%3D0%26fsch%3Dtrue%26Ntk%3DAllProducts%26Ntt%3Dsaddle%2Bbags%26x%3D20%26y%3D7%26WTz_l%3DHeader%253BSearch-All%2BProducts&Ntt=saddle+bags&WTz_l=Header%3BSearch-All+Products


The brass strap protector is oval and larger on the original (look right above the cover flap) and the small pocket and US embossed oval would need to be added, but I think it's do-able.  I bought a set of the Triple K bags from Cabelas about 10 or 12 years ago and they're still going strong.  I also bought the canvas liner, which snaps in and has internal pockets.  Mine was less than $110 when I bought them, so you can see where the prices are going.  The leather of mine is VERY stiff, even after I rubbed soaked mine using a LOT of Olive Oil.  (It's not just for BP lube ... and spaghetti  )  If you look at the reviews, there are 24  and NONE were below a 4-star rating.  (5 possible)

I was going to link you to some but I saw it's the same ones that Tascosa Joe linked to.  I sure wish MINE were the same colour as the ones he linked to!  They're awesome ... but at nearly a Grand, well ... you know!  I sure wouldn't use THEM! 

I have a traveling tool & cleaning kit roll that I carry on the outside of my bags.  It's too big to go inside and would hog all the room of one side, but it makes a nice roll about 4"- 4 1/2" that I tie over the R side flap - I added a brass grommet on the other side of their oval strap grommet and I have a couple pieces of latigo "string" looped & tied that stay with the bags whether I have the tool-roll or not.  I'll bet that the oval grommet like the originals have is available somewhere and having a pocket added would be no special trick to someone who makes their own footwear (you do, right!) so really, I think that the oval US would probably be the most difficult part of converting the Cabela's bags to Cavalry bags!  (And if you DO find a big oval US tool, let me know and you could emboss MINE, too!  Please!)

I already own a US oval embossing tool. I used it on the Holster I just finished for Captain Virgil Russo.
http://talbotsfineaccessories.com/cowboy/M1881-russet1.JPG

I will have t take a look at those and compare them closely to photos of the originals.