Almost had my second match yesterday.

[Tall Dark Slim]

I travelled to a new club an hour from my house to shoot a bigger match yesterday. As I came up to register as I have done many times at many different matches all over the east coast I was shocked by what I heard. The stats guy informed me that because I hadn't shot here before I would have to watch one match before I could shoot. What!?! I've got all my equipment in the truck, I'd come dressed and fully prepared with the Stages printed out and carefully studied. I was excited and now that was all crushed by an ignorant policy that does not provide an experienced shooter any chance to prove competency prior to the first shot. IDPA, USPSA, ICORE, and the newly founded Zombie Shooters of America all have the ability to take a green shooter and get them participating from the first shot. What further fanned the flames was that this was at 0830 and the first shot would not touch off until 1000, plenty of time for several shooters to be safety checked into the match by range officers and what usually happens at the matches I have run and helped to run. Long story short I spoke with about fifty people until a few of them spoke up and I was invited to shoot the match. Unfortunately, I had missed out on the whole first stage. I was overjoyed to be shooting finally and finished well receiving many compliments about my pistol and shotgun ability. The rifle is difficult at this point as I haven't gotten the cycling down yet, but then I've only had it a week. In the end I had a great time and enjoyed the people there immensely. I have decided the cowboy way suits me, but I will be sore at that fella for some time.

Bottom line is: These aren't difficult matches to shoot and for the experienced competitor accustomed to a much higher match round count it is very unattractive being forced to sit one out. If I had not known any of the folks there I most likely would have left and never come back. I am left to wonder how many others would be participating today had they been given a chance when they showed up prepared. I understand someone opting out of shooting because they are unequipped or unprepared, but transitional competitors being turned away?

[yeti76620]

REALLY? ? ? ......WOW!
I've NEVER heard of such a thing....  Out here in the Colorado Territory as well some other Territories of this Region new shooters to a location are given a preshoot "Safety Meeting" and shadowed by a "Club Representative" for the first stage or two, as for New Shooters they're "shadowed" for the match with some slack as the match progresses....  Everyone watches out for {helps} each others!     

Kinda sounds like folks there might be a bit lazy about promoting this sport and do not want to take the time to "Wing Man" a new shooter......      


Everyone Shoots!     

[Jefro]

I've NEVER heard of such a thing....

I agree, I've never heard of such a thing. Was this a SASS affiliated club?? Was a shooter oreintation requirement plainly stated on thier web site?? I know of several clubs that will not let you shoot a "very first" match untill you have gone through thier oreintation program, but once yer a SASS member and have at least shot "A" match you should be able to go anywhere in the country or overseas and expect to shoot. Always check the local clubs web sites for any unknow range or match policy before you travel. At our range if you show up as a newbie, we will take you to the practice bay for a quick intro. If it looks like you can safely handle it you will be shooting the match, we will talk you into it

Just curious?? did they offer to let you shoot through one stage and go around make up the first stage?? Don't be to sore at the feller, I'm sure he's been made aware of his error. Sometimes lack of knowledge equels lack of judgement.  Good Luck

Jefro Relax-Enjoy

[yeti76620]

Heck Jefro,

The crew... ahohhh... The Posse I hang with have been known to "Kidnap" a newbie voyeur and strap on our own Irons on em and make 'em shoot our stage for us!!!

Ahhhh the smell of powder and the recoil in the hand just gets 'em infected (did I mention the "Hospitality") and then there is only ONE cure by the words of my ol' Pard,,, Pegleg Pete,,,  "The only cure now is a checkbook!"

Like Ye said "Relax and Enjoy!"

Yeti

[Tall Dark Slim]

Let me tell you something. I'm involved now and this is going to change and how.  This is a fun time and these people are trying to ruin it. A new competitor could not have been any slower than some of the other experienced competitors who walked SLOWLY between shooting positions and had rough transitions. Again I enjoyed the company immensely and I do realize that not all competitors are there to win and I do not wish to diminish the value of anyone's experience.

[Tall Dark Slim]

Jefro,
It ended up not costing me a match fee so it's all well. I don't thInk it will happen again so all's well. I just wanted to vent a bit and find out how other clubs did things. My mistake was not in sending the MD an introductory email which has always aided me in the past.

[Jefro]

Jefro,
It ended up not costing me a match fee so it's all well. I don't thInk it will happen again so all's well. I just wanted to vent a bit and find out how other clubs did things. My mistake was not in sending the MD an introductory email which has always aided me in the past.

Sounds good, glad yer having fun. But I'm still curious, was this a SASS affiliated club?? Was a shooter oreintation requirement plainly stated on thier web site?? Good Luck

Jefro Relax-Enjoy

[Tall Dark Slim]

Yes it was sass affiliated and thy stated it on their website. I had already attended a match the week prior. The one guy apparently discounted that experience. I'm contending that the sit out as a rule is bogus and detrimental to the growth of the sport. I say this because the equipment capital outlay is already intimidating and it's no fun to watch others have so much fun for hours on end. The clubs I have seen don't have a lot of young members and it seems to be something they desire.

[Camille Eonich]

I have never run across any club that had such a rule.  I'm glad that they broke down and let you shoot.

[August]

Neither have I ever seen such treatment accorded a newcomer at a SASS match.  Quite the opposite, in fact, is my experience.

However, one of your remarks does cause me some concern.  I am quoting you here, where you say, "The rifle is difficult at this point as I haven't gotten the cycling down yet, but then I've only had it a week".

SASS is very clear in rules and guidelines that SASS matches are not the place to learn basic gun operation.  I'm sorry to say this, and as I said have never seen it, but if your knowledge is as limited as you report about operating a lever action rifle, there are some grounds and precedents for asking you to stand down at a competition.  That would have been the correct thing to do.

I'm not sure, however, what utility simply watching the match would have.  If you had presented yourself at one of our matches, some cowboy would have taken you to an empty bay and helped you learn how to use your new rifle.

[Tall Dark Slim]

However, one of your remarks does cause me some concern.  I am quoting you here, where you say, "The rifle is difficult at this point as I haven't gotten the cycling down yet, but then I've only had it a week".

SASS is very clear in rules and guidelines that SASS matches are not the place to learn basic gun operation.  I'm sorry to say this, and as I said have never seen it, but if your knowledge is as limited as you report about operating a lever action rifle, there are some grounds and precedents for asking you to stand down at a competition.  That would have been the correct thing to do.

Ahh thanks for the heads up...I was talking about having the proper cycling speed for my new to me Thunderbolt lightning clone. I was cycling the gun too fast as I found out in practice today and not allowing the shell to get out of the magazine and on to the carrier properly. I don't have any trouble safely operating the pump rifle and I also don't need any help learning to run a lever action. I own an 1886 and have all kinds of fun with it.

[Missouri Marshal]

I will address this issue because it was at my club and I am the MD.  The Pungo Posse's policy is, as posted on the web site at www.pungoposse.org;

5.  New shooters that have never shot a SASS match before must observe one match prior to shooting with the Pungo Posse.  This is to ensure that the shooter is familiar with SASS Match procedures and safety requirements.

This is a common practice at all the local clubs and has worked well since the clubs were founded.  Shooting IDPA, IPSIC and other shoot disciplines is not SASS and new shooters need to know how things work before they are allowed to shoot.

From the Mattaponi Sundowners web site at http://www.wpgc.us/west_point_gun_club/sass-cowboy-action.html

New shooters must observe one match prior to shooting with the Mattaponi Sundowners unless they can show that they have shot with another CAS club.  Spectators are welcome anytime; eye protection is mandatory; hearing protection is strongly recommended

From KC's Corral web site at http://kcscorral.net/index.html

To shoot a Cowboy Action Match at K.C's Corral, all shooters must have observed at least one other Cowboy Action match or be sponsored by an experienced shooter who will vouch that you are familiar with Cowboy Action safety rules and that you will handle firearms safely.

In this case, the treasure, who was doing the registrations, was told that the shooter had never shot a SASS match and had only observed an informal practice session at another club.  Based upon that information and the clubs' policy, the shooter was told he would have to observe a match prior to shooting.

  After the first stage I was approached by one of the shooters that brought Tall Dark Slim to the match.  She asked if there was any way that he shoot the remainder of the match.  She explained to me that he had actually shot the practice match at the other club.  I asked her if these practice sessions were conducted the same as a regular SASS match and she told me they were.   I asked if he had all his gear, she said he had everything but a shotgun.  I had an extra 97 with me so I told her that I would let him shoot the rest of the match and I loaned him a shotgun, as I would for any shooter that was short of gear.  During the match I tried to arrange for him to shoot stage one with the other posse but it was not feasible so I waived his shooter's fee.

The Pungo Posse is one of the friendliest,  accommodating clubs that you could ever go to.  Allot of you have shot with us and know that to be true.  Those of you that know me, know that there isn't much I wouldn't do to help out a shooter, new or experienced.  That being said we have our rules and policies for good reason and they will be enforced for the good of all.

Tall Dark Slim...  This was a simple misunderstanding that could have been avoided had you contacted the Posse ahead of time.  I'm sorry that you were put off by your experience with us.

[Tricky Trina]

"Almost your second match" and you're going to change things?  You do realize how that sounds, don't you?  NO cowboy I know would have made such a statement. 

And I see you didn't tell anyone here that the MD gave you a shotgun to use for the match.

I really wish you would have talked to (or e-mailed) one of the Board of Directors of our posse before you took it to the wire - it could have been handled a lot better. 

After all the nice things MM said about you after the match, I look forward to meeting you and shooting with you soon.  Take Care and God Bless......

Tricky Trina
TG Pungo Posse

[Tall Dark Slim]

Jefro,
It ended up not costing me a match fee so it's all well. I don't thInk it will happen again so all's well. I just wanted to vent a bit and find out how other clubs did things. My mistake was not in sending the MD an introductory email which has always aided me in the past.

Missouri Marshall,
The above post should illustrate that I was not put off by the whole experience.  In fact further energized. I want to take the RO courses as soon as my six months is up and pour on the elbow grease to make sure others have a great match experience. I've been working most of the matches I shoot for the last couple of years and I guess starting over just frustrated me. I took issue with the observe a match rule because I felt it disheartens prospective shooters. I thought the whole thing was well run and organized.

Tricky Trina,
In fact the omission of the loan of the shotgun was wrong as it was both an awesome act and a slick piece of equipment. I loan out equipment in other disciplines and was WRONG for the oversight on the post. I did send him an email thanking him for everything after the match and I think he's a good man and I'd have gladly paid the full match fee for the experience I had.  As far as changing things that one policy is the only thing I take issue with. I believe I see why it's in place and believe it can be accounted for: time loss and safety. I've overcome these hurdles at 3-gun matches before with new shooters and have never had to DQ a new shooter I gave an orientation to. As far as not going through the club's chain of command, I was neither a SASS member nor a member of the club and did not feel it pertained to me in any way. As you put it a new shooter looking for change...I have no sweat equity there and thus no voice IMHO. My intention was not to smear any club, as no names were used, but only to investigate how other clubs did new shooter participation. Obviously, I was a bit too emmotionally invested at the time. I think the people in CAS are tremendous people and would like to be a part of it. I always look forward to meeting more nice folks.
Best Regards to both of you,
Forrest Halley