Krag Stuff...

[St. George]

St. George's Notes XXXIX - Krag Sling...
« on: Today at 12:28:49 pm »      

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'Underneath the starry flag,
Civilize them with a Krag'
(From the Carabao Song)

The Krag - both rifle and carbine - has reached a new level of popularity, and much has been written about them, notably these fine references:

'The Krag-Jorgensen In the Service' - by Shockley
'The Krag Rifle Story' - by Mallory and Olson
'The Krag Rifle' - by Brophy
'The American Krag Rifle and Carbine' - by Poyer

One of the best things about the Krag is that finding a nice rifle is still pretty easy to do - though carbines are harder, and many have been faked - but there are published serial number ranges, and those are helpful to the buyer/collector.

Also faked are some of the accessories, such as the three-piece cleaning rods, the canvas breech cover, the M1887 leather sling and the so-called 'Tropical Sling', as well as bayonet variants.

Original slings were of russet leather - measuring 66.5"X1.25", with two leather keepers, a double-headed brass stud button and a single double-claw.

A second variant was made up from two salvaged slings sewn together - measuring the same.

Both were initially for the Trapdoor Rifle.

The sling purpose-built for the Krag rifle was designated the 'Gun Sling, US Magazine Rifle, Model of 1898', and was also made of russet leather - measuring 48"X1.25", and features the single double-claw and brass button with the two keepers

Then, to attempt to combat the tropical rotting of pretty much everything encountering service in the Philippines, several thousand woven cotton slings were procured for testing, and were designated as a 'haversack, canteen and gun sling' they were made by Mills & Orndorff, makers of the famed 'Mills Belts' in service at the time.

These are marked on the brass adjustment hooks: PAT MILLS & ORNDORFF DEC.28 '80 MAR. 19 '89OCT 31 '93 SEPT. 11 '94 - they measured 61"X1.25" - with two brass sliding keepers.

Thes slings were never given a Model designation, due to their 'trial' status, and were not well-received by the troops, since they had a tendency to stretch and to roll vertically when wet - creating more of a 'rope' than a sling, and there is no official procurement record from Mills & Orndorff.

As they were a commercial product, they were more expensive to replace than Arsenal-produced slings.

Another sling associated with the Krag was the 'Kerr 'NobuckL' Adjustable Sling' - but it was issued during WWI as a sling for use when training rifle drill with the obsolete Krags, and wasn't an issue item during their time of service - though it would become on once the Thompson SMG was adopted for WWII.

The Carbine sling was the old Model 1885 - black in color, with a snap link, brass buckle and tip and measuring 1.5"X60.75".

It was used in conjunction with the M1887 carbine boot, which was replaced by the Model 1895 scabbard, and was withdrawn from service in December of 1898.

If you own a Krag - an original sling and original accouterments are a must-have - but if you're going to actively use it, then looking into a well-made replica will save your original sling.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Will Ketchum]

St. George, some interesting information.  I have a Krag in the conformation of a carbine but I am pretty sure it is a cut down rifle and I bought as such.  Who ever did it did a great job and the only thing that gave it away to me later was it has a rifle rear sight. ( although a so call collector told me some carbines had rifle rears).

It is my understanding that Bannerman's bought a large amount of Krag rifles and cut them down to make them more attractive to hunters.  If that is true perhaps this is one of them because it sure looks like a carbine and it was professionally done.

When I get a chance I'll dig it out of the safe and e-mail you the serial number so you can look it up for me if you would.

Will Ketchum

[St. George]

Please do, Pete - and if you can - send me a picture as well - you've got my private account.

I like Krags - always have.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Charles Isaac]

Oooo! Oooo! Here's a picture of a Krag while we're waitin' for a picture from Will!

[JimBob]

Oooo! Oooo! Here's a picture of a Krag while we're waitin' for a picture from Will!

[G.W. Strong]

Imagine the recoil when that little tiny point is placed against your shoulder.  I think you might want to look for a more traditional stock design. 

[Charles Isaac]

Ha Ha! I know! Now that's one mean shard of American Black Walnut!

[pony express]

Charles, the guy that tried to make your "fake carbine" didn't do enough research before he started cutting. I think he cut off the wrong end.

[G.W. Strong]

Now that is funnier than what I said!

[James Hunt]

Pete: Those carbine rear sights go for a mortgage payment or two now. Far more than a rifle sight. I think that most rifle sights on a mid grade Krag carbine are the result of some collector/seller maximizing his profit by replacing the carbine sight with a rifle sight, and then getting about $350 for that carbine sight. I have a Krag carbine that is only 13 numbers away from a carbine known to have been issued to the first volunteer cavalry and some fool has put a rifle sight on it. Not in the best of shape, it is still history and it is sad that someone has done this. So if your carbine appears as a carbine in all other respects I'd not discount it based on a rifle rear sight. Regards, Jim

[JimBob]

Usual serial ranges of Krag carbines

M1896 25135-37582 and 67010-79499

M1898 123161-130965

M1899-Only carbine receivers were marked 1899

226127-228055
250450-252965
268055
279888-287650
308901-309075
344014-357494
420710-420810

The one to watch for on assumed cutdowns is the Board of Ordnance and Fortifications rifles with a 26 inch barrel.Hard to ID but it has a sight different than the rifle or carbine.

There's a fellow doing a  whole lot of research at the RIA archives that will probably blow most of the current information on Krags in the water whenever he gets done and publishes it.

James-I haven't seen a bonafide carbine sight sell that cheaply of late.Several of them brought the price of a decent 98 rifle at auction.