Saddle Making

[Skeeter Lewis]

I want to make the big jump to saddle making and would like some hints from pards as to where to look for advice. I know Al Stohlman has done a series but I'm looking for something more period correct - something like a Meanea saddle with sam stag rigging. Are there any how-to books anyone can recommend?
Skeet

[Shotgun Franklin]

Why not see if you can locate a Saddlemaker who makes old type saddles on the net and get help directly from him?

[Slowhand Bob]

At one time Will Ghormley was talking about doing patterns for the old west saddles.  You will need to check with him, I am thinking he ran into some problems with the project?  Check out his web site, used to be some really nice period style saddles there.

[Devil Anse Hatfield]

The problem with  old time saddles is we dont make horses to fit em anymore. If the saddle doesnt fit the horse the horse dont work for you.
Which leaves you with the problem of building an old saddle on a new style tree. Which would make a pattern pack based from an old saddle tuff to do.
I have rebuilt a few old  baskets that get used for very short  rides, and a few old side saddles. That hang on a rack.

[Don Nix]

When I started wanting to build saddles  about 40 years ago., I went to an old saddle maker  and asked if I could apprentice with him,or short of that if I could just hang around and ask questions. he looked me dead in the eye and said ,"why should I teach you how to put me out of business".
So I did the next best thing. I began to hunt up old saddles ,tear them apart and figured out through trial and error how to do it..
I started with oldest saddles I could find and the first saddle that I totally rebuilt and sold was  an old Menea saddle.
After a few years I ran across a book on saddlemaking and was gratiified to find out that other than a few shortcut tricks I was pretty much doing things right.
My advice to you is to do just that. get on ebay,go to the horse sales ,hit the flea markets and pick you up some old kacks and just tear them down and figure them out. You'll find that there are many many ways to build a saddle and each of the old builders had thier own unique way of laying leather..
the books that are on the market are good but they show you just that particular authors technique. it may work for a particu;ar style but it will give you no depth of knowledge .
 Back in the early 90s I was a part of an National Endowment for the Arts master/apprentice program and taught saddlery to apprenties. And even though I have taught the craft I feel that it is better for an aspiring saddlemaker to start as I did.Begin by learning basic leather working skills then teach yourself using the old makers as your mentors.

[Don Nix]

One thing that I forgot to mention is that I have never used a pattern in my life.
I used to tell my apprentices that the easiest way to build a saddle, is go get 2 sides of leather and just cut out everything that looks like a saddle. Works every time!

[Trailrider]

The problem with  old time saddles is we dont make horses to fit em anymore. If the saddle doesnt fit the horse the horse dont work for you.
Which leaves you with the problem of building an old saddle on a new style tree. Which would make a pattern pack based from an old saddle tuff to do.
I have rebuilt a few old  baskets that get used for very short  rides, and a few old side saddles. That hang on a rack.

Yep, they just ain't makin' hosses like they usedta! Mules nuther, I surmise, since mules come from horse mares.

[Shotgun Franklin]

Trees aren't a problem. I've had 3 custom saddles built, all copies of 1880s saddles. They were each built to fit a horse I owned at the time. Two saddle makers made their own trees and one came from Bowden a tree maker over near El Paso. Just doing a search on the net will give the names of several saddle makers who make good copies of old saddles to fit modern horses. That's the whole point in making or having your own saddle made anyway, to make the saddle you want to fit the horse you ride.

[will ghormley]

I have trees custom made to fit modern horses, but they meet my design specifications and conforming to the styles of whatever era of saddle I'm making.  They cost more than normal saddle trees, but my saddles cost more than normal saddles.

The problem I'm still having with makin' my saddle buildin' patterns and DVDs is money.  To pay someone to make a quality DVD, costs about five thousand dollars, (I'm talkin' about a quality job, not something that looks like it was filmed in your garage).  To buy the equipment yourself runs about seven.  Then you have to take the time to learn how to use it.

Then, you have to make a saddle and film it.  That takes over twice as long as just makin' a saddle.  Then there is the post production work that takes another month before you have a quality project.  So, by the time you have the project done, you have spent over two months and ten thousand dollars, and you haven't made one red cent yet.  How many patterns and DVDs would have to be sold, and at what price, to make back ten grand and two month's salary?  Well, I'm no mathematician, but I reckon it would be a bunch.

I'd love to be able to have folks come by my shop and learn by watching.  I do what I can to help folks over the phone and via email.  But, bein' a helpful guy doesn't pay the bills.  Sometimes, bein' a leather worker doesn't pay the bills!  I'd love to make the DVDs for saddles, but am beginning to realize I'll probably never make enough money to ever be able to.  I hold out hope I may catch a break somehow, but I'm not bankin' on it.  Until that day comes, I'll just keep doin' the things I can afford to do, and hope I make some money and help some folks along the way in the process.

Will

[Freedom]

Without a doubt...the Stolman Saddlery Encylopedia series is the single most helpful purchase you will ever make for saddle making (it is actually one giant book, split into 3 volumes....I have several books and have been taught by 3 different saddle makers... and the Stolman series is still a GREAT asset to have in your collection. They are full of tons of advice and patterns...yes you can easily modify them to make a period style saddle on a modern (horse fitting) tree.

They cost a lot (worth every penny) and are still a bargan!!...and if you "know" someone, wholesale is exactly half price

This is also a good book with lots of good info http://www.saddlemakersshopmanual.info/ This one requires a little more priory knowledge to use well...but it is still a good book to have and it does have the SamStagg rig covered.

[Massive]

The dilemma you face Will is precisely why there are organizations like the National Endowment for the arts, and there may be an organization that would support crafts, or even Western culture. 

I, do my own bikes.  Recently there was a guy who got a grant to travel from England to do an essay on the state of US framebuilding.  He didn't even have your tack record, or produce much at the end of his trip (I think he delivered what was expected).  He had some conclusions that realistically he was not that well placed to suggest.  Anyway, there may be something similar here.  Not all the money should go to Mapplethorpe.

My other thought is that I actually prefer the rough videos.  The polished videos are often too tightly edited.  If one really wants to learn, then the more info, the sooner, the rawer, the better.  I don't want some video guy deciding what interests me.  Unfortunately, a lot of people want to see this stuff for entertainment, so production values do seem to mater.  I mean unfortunately for those of us who are in this for the info.  Without the gazers there would be little in the way of a video market.

[Andy Rombach]

Hey Skeeter
Here is a example of a oldtime saddle on a new tree, made for modern horses.
I know a gentelemen at Ft. Collins will make the tree for you. The bars are made for to days horses, the fork and the seat is made in the old way.... The tree is wood, rawhide covered. This trees are not very cheep, but if you need one you might spend some dollars more:-))
I have made this saddle 3 years ago.

Have a great day
Andy

[Boothill Bob]

Andy, if I come and visit you, will you teach me to make westernsaddles?

[Andy Rombach]

Hey my friend

If I will become a professional saddlemaker it would be a pleasure for me, but I am just a little leathercrafter doing that kind of stuff as a hobby, nothing more.... I learn on each saddle I do!!!! and I am not as professional as others. Ask Will Ghormley, or David Carico. These guys are much more in saddlemaking than I am. May be in about 50 or 60 years I have much know how to do that.
My shop is only 6 m2 big (small) but you are wellcome every day.
I have ordered a new saddletree land hope it will be finished in spring. So I will start my next saddle in Oktober/ November 2012 (hope so). On the saddle I post this afternoon I need 8 month to built it. Will post some more saddle pics under the category soon:-)))

have a wonderfull day
Andy

[Andy Rombach]

Hey Skeeter
Here is a F.A. Meanea No. 2 halfseat saddle, with sam stag rigging.
This saddle was also made on a modern tree with old style candle and fork... made by the same fellow of Ft.Collins.
The tree is also rawhide coverd wood....
It has a simple border tooling.
Made this saddle 10 years ago...

Have a great day

Andy Rombach

[Boothill Bob]

Thats some work of art Andy. Whats the total you have to spend in money before a saddle like that is finiched 

[Andy Rombach]

Hey Bob
On the Meanea saddle I spend nearly 450 Euro for the tree and the wooden stirrups, and nearly 1200 Euro for the leather. I use a german natural tanned leather 7-8mm thick for the skirts and 4mm for the seat and the fork. The tannery produced the hides as they do it the last 120 years... so they charge a lot of money for the leather but it is worth every zent....

Have a great day
Andy Rombach

[Andy Rombach]

another saddle I built years ago on a "modern tree"

have a greta day

Andy Rombach

[will ghormley]

Those are some fine saddles there Andy.  You do yourself proud.

Will

[Skeeter Lewis]

Thanks to everyone for their advice.
Andy - those are some great saddles. Will has it right.....