Reloading 44 colt

[Deadeye Don]

I reload the various 44 caliber shells (44 spl, 44 rus, and 44 colt) and use the same dies for all three. The only real difference besides adjusting the dies for individual caliber is I've found the shellholder for 44 mag/spl, and 44 rus does not work with the 44 colt. The rim is too small to work well so I switch to a shell holder for the 41 mag. It works perfectly for 44 colt cases.

Are you using the Dillon press with their shell plate?

[Cole Bluesteele]

I reload 44 Colt and Russian on a Dillon 550b.  I use the same toolhead and dies for both, with just minor adjustments when switching between  Colt and Russian loads.  I use the same shell plate and locator buttons for both Colt and Russian.  The shell plate and buttons are all stamped with the number "4".

Only one set of dies, one toolhead, one shell plate and one set of buttons are needed to load both Colt and Russian rounds on your Dillon 550B.

Ted

[Deadeye Don]

I reload 44 Colt and Russian on a Dillon 550b.  I use the same toolhead and dies for both, with just minor adjustments when switching between  Colt and Russian loads.  I use the same shell plate and locator buttons for both Colt and Russian.  The shell plate and buttons are all stamped with the number "4".

Only one set of dies, one toolhead, one shell plate and one set of buttons are needed to load both Colt and Russian rounds on your Dillon 550B.

Ted

Thanks alot Ted.  Much appreciated.  This is the same information that Dillon gave me also.

[Deadeye Don]

Ordered the 44sp/44mag Dillon dies, the powder measure quick change assembly and the 44colt/44Russian conversion Kit all for the 550B.  Johnny Mcrae suggested the 44mag bullet at .430.  I have quite a bit of 44 colt brass already.  I think I am in business now!!  Thanks to everyone for your help.

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Ordered the 44sp/44mag Dillon dies, the powder measure quick change assembly and the 44colt/44Russian conversion Kit all for the 550B.  Johnny Mcrae suggested the 44mag bullet at .430.  I have quite a bit of 44 colt brass already.  I think I am in business now!!  Thanks to everyone for your help.

Howdy Don;

Were you at the GLFMC shoot Sunday?  I'm very sorry I missed it.  My step-Dad passed away Friday, and we were doing viewing tasks.   The funeral was today.  (Tues.)

But I digress.  Where did you get the 44 Colt brass?  I have 200 44 Russian cases - I both bought some as well as having been given some "to get things rolling" from my pard Litl Rooster who I met in Virginia.  Great guy!  (Thanks again, Ralphie!)  That's pretty much what I've decided to shoot from my new 44 Spl. Open Top.  However, I think I'd be remiss if I didn't give 44 Colt a try.  I'll have to scrounge up or buy a hundred or so cases to make a proper test.  BP of course.  Same with 44 Spl., but since it's later than our timeframe, that caliber isn't a priority.  

Hope to see you at the November shoot, especially since the aforementioned Johnny M. is trying to get down here to Indiana to visit and shoot.


Keep yer powder dry !

[Deadeye Don]

Hi Jeff,   I was in Atlanta for my sisters 50th birthday party so I missed the shoot.  I do plan to be there in November come hell or high water.   I am very sorry to hear about your step father.  Family always comes first in my book.   

As for the 44 colt brass, I had actually purchased quite a bit of factory ammo in 44 Colt before I started reloading and I have been saving it as I shoot it.  I think I purchased some from Ammo Direct and some from TENX so I am pretty well set for that.  Hope to see you in November.

Don

[Johnny McCrae]

Howdy Jeff,

I've been buying my .44 colt brass from "Track of the Wolf" in Minnesota.  It's made by Starline and I've had no problems with it. You can actually buy the .44 colt cases in very small quantities from Track of the wolf but the shipping will kill you. Track of the Wolf has some very unique and hard to find items for sale.
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartList.aspx?catID=2&subID=190&styleID=1144

I'm keeping an eye on the weather and hope I can make the November shoot at GLFMC.

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Great! 

Don, best wishes to your sister.  (A bit late, I know.)  I hit 60 a few weeks ago myself.  Hope your trip to & from Atlanta was a good one and didn't get delayed by a lot of construction.  Like here in our state.


John, I'm a fan of Track of the Wolf.  If I buy any cases, I'd buy at least 100.  I don't think that's considered a very big order, but I'm sure I could find something else from TOTW to make the shipping more reasonable.

(back to) Don, are those cases marked Starline?  I'm not sure any other manufacturer makes 44 Colt cases, but S/L will put a custom name on the cases if the quantity ordered is in the tens-of-thousands, I'm sure.  Ten-X probably does that. 

Hope to see both of ya soon!  My tigger finger (or Trigger  ) is getting an itch that I must scratch.

Don, if you have a couple spare minutes, would you give me a call at your convenience, please?  I have an easy proposal for you.  I'm going to have to get offline in a couple minutes, or I'd contact you by IM.

Thanks!

[Abilene]

...Don, are those cases marked Starline?  I'm not sure any other manufacturer makes 44 Colt cases, but S/L will put a custom name on the cases if the quantity ordered is in the tens-of-thousands, I'm sure.  Ten-X probably does that...

Just FWIW, back a dozen or so years ago when ASM first started making conversions in .44 Colt, nobody made .44 Colt brass.  Cutting down .44 spcl or .44 mag was not an option because their rims would overlap in the ASM cylinders (unless you had a machinist turn down the rims as well).  Starline and Black Hills got together and made a deal where Starline would start making the brass exclusively for Black Hills for a period of time (I think it was 2 years) before offering the brass directly to the public.  During that time, if you wanted to reload .44 Colt you had to buy the ammo from Black Hills to get the brass.

[Mean Bob Mean]

I know this thread is older but upon searching this was the best one I saw to post in.

I have changed my life as it pertains to guns and gun ownership and am divesting of firearms I cannot "relate" to for lack of a better word.  In practical terms it means I am acquiring new versions of old timers to shoot and enjoy almost exclusively with the possible exception of a bird gun I might hang on to (28 gauge o/u).  It also means that as far as a personal defense handgun, it is likely I will end up relying on my .44 Colt RM 1860 for awhile.  I have been casting around for accurate and hard hitting loads as possible choices and keep running into this little issue of Russian vs. Colt loads.  It seems the stubby Russian case is more efficient, is that a reasonable observation?  Where I see a couple loads for the .44 Colt that push a 200 grain bullet at about 900 or so FPS (200 grains .430 at 900fps seems like a decent home defense load), I have found a couple Russian loads from John Taffin that list 6.0-7.0 grains of Unique and a 240-250 grain bullet in excess of 900 FPS.  I also see/hear great things about the Russian ammo in terms of accuracy, though as for these loads in my gun . . .well I'd have to see.  Wouldn't the Russian case develop more pressure or is that powder dependant relative to the case (brand new reloader guy here)?  Would 6-7 grains of Unique be a reasonable load to try out in .44 Colt cases?  I have found a really neat 240 grain cast hollow point that should be soft enough to expand at 700 FPS (BHN of 10).  I would assume that if I started it out at 920 I would be assured of 700 FPS within 25 yards.  Knowing that this is all meaningless if the load won't print on paper, any thoughts or ideas on the subject?  Anyone have experience comparing 240 grain loadings in the two calibers?  Given the historical use of heavier bullets in the Russian, there seems to be better data for it, and there seems to be a tendency toward higher pressure loads; that does not mean the Colt case is not capable of the same or better with comparable pressures, yes?

I have been through the Hogdon data as well as that from a few other sources.

Hoping someone has the time to respond, feel free to point me to a source I have missed.

Cheers,

Bob

[Tascosa Joe]

I normally use BP in my .44 Russian.  I would also venture a guess when Taffin developed the 7.0 Unique load there were very few open tops available to shoot.  My guess is his loads were designed for a Triple Lock Smith or a New Service.

[pony express]

I've never loaded for or owned a RM conversion, but to me that sounds a bit too hot for an open top. If I owned one, I wouldn't try to get more than BP ballistics, even with smokeless.

[Mean Bob Mean]

Thanks Tascosa and Pony both. That was another concern, and the point I was clumsily heading to regarding pressure in various cases.  Since the open tops and conversions are rated to withstand the pressures of the .44 special and .45 colt base loadings, I assumed one could reach those in the smaller cases without affecting the integrity of the weapon, but I also assumed that heavier bullets in those smaller cases might achieve greater pressures more easily and thus, the powder of choice would be a crucial concern.  I have read in these boards that BP itself is not always the best choice if pressure is the concern, but then, I know you cannot blow up the pistol with a full case of 3F so . . .

Is Unique a powder you could load a self-defense round with and not transgress the pressure rating of the piece?  Are there better choices?  How do i peruse the burn rates of a powder and determine the relative probability of it staying inside a pressure level or not?

This would never be a steady diet for the gun, just to leave in it while I carry it in the car or load it to place within reach of my bed.

Should I simply say the 240 Russian load is an acceptable self-defense round and not worry about it?  I guess my questions about accuracy point in that direction, a heavy .44 bullet reaching a target at speeds in excess of 700FPS doesn't have to be driven the extra 50 FPS at the muzzle to achieve the stated goal.  Hogdon has some data that indicates 800+ for the 240 with pressures of around 11000 which is plenty, I suppose.  I guess I simply want more options, or simply have that in the back of my mind that if 840 is good, 920 is better.  Time to get over my velocity bias. 

Any recommendations for accuracy in either cartridge, knowing that it is always weapon specific, surely some give more consistent results?

Good advice both, thanks. 

[pony express]

I would say that if the powder companies list loads for 240 grain bullet at 800fps, within the standard pressure for the cartridge, that's what I would use, with a nice Kieth type SWC, maybe even in hollow point, if you can come up with one. Should be sufficient, since you're right there in .45ACP hardball territory, 230 FMJ @ 800+ fps.

[Mean Bob Mean]

I would say that if the powder companies list loads for 240 grain bullet at 800fps, within the standard pressure for the cartridge, that's what I would use, with a nice Kieth type SWC, maybe even in hollow point, if you can come up with one. Should be sufficient, since you're right there in .45ACP hardball territory, 230 FMJ @ 800+ fps.

Right, pressure being the main point.  I assume you could find some powders that went beyond safe pressures while achieveing the same results?

People seem to get good accuracy out of the BP loads, I may simply go that route.  Would make the reloading process streamlined to have one load for everything.

Thanks for the help.

[Mean Bob Mean]

I normally use BP in my .44 Russian.  I would also venture a guess when Taffin developed the 7.0 Unique load there were very few open tops available to shoot.  My guess is his loads were designed for a Triple Lock Smith or a New Service.

One article I read indicated he was shooting a Colt New Frontier in .44 Special with those particular Russian loads--a different animal to be sure. 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Howdy!

After 2 years since this thread was started, I have had more opportunities to shoot different loads in my Open Top that I got in 2011.  As I stated in my initial post, I planned to shoot 44 Russian in my 44 Spl.-chambered Uberti O/T.  I began using the Springfield Slim-cast BigLube (tm) boolit and enough BP to fill those itty-bitty 44 R cases.  They were mild, accurate, and easy to shoot.

But ... old habits kept nagging at my brain.  I really missed the big B*O*O*M, smoke, and flames from my normal 45 Colt loads.  (250 gr BigLube (tm) PRS boolit propelled by as much 3F BP as would fit in the case with about 1/8" compression.)  That power simply wasn't there from the 44 Russian, so I decided that since the 44 Colt cases were only.006" shorter than 44 Spl cases, I had to try them.  I have now switched to 44 Colt all the way. The 44 Colt case holds almost as much BP as a 44 Spl case which holds nearly as much as a 45 Colt case.  Give-or-take 4-5 grs.

These loads still use the 190-200 gr boolit from Springfield Slim and "speak" with plenty of authority for my tastes.  That's all I shoot in my O/T these days.

I just thought some of you might enjoy hearing about this since it obviously still draws interest even after 2 years.

Keep yer powder dry!

[Mean Bob Mean]

I have now switched to 44 Colt all the way. The 44 Colt case holds almost as much BP as a 44 Spl case which holds nearly as much as a 45 Colt case.  Give-or-take 4-5 grs.

I love my .44s, controllable, loud, lots of smoke, accurate. 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Yeppir!

[Newheel]

Will any of these reloading suggestions apply to Colt .44 CF Original, for a Colt 1860 Richards conversion, Mfd 1861.  I am told they are different from modern .44 Colt.
Thanks